# Hello And Help!



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Hello all; I would like to try to identify a pocket watch that used to belong to my grandfather, and ask a couple of questions about it.

Would that be acceptable on this forum, or would it be rude just to pop in for help then disappear?

Thanks for reading this

Phill


----------



## Andy Tims (Apr 13, 2008)

I'm sure if you post a photo some may be able to help.

You might even decide you'd like to stay.


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Ok, Thanks Andy

I recently inherited this watch from my father. It was given to my grandfather when leaving his post as head of the Dutch stock exchange, or so family legend goes).

It has an inscription which is so ornate, and in dutch, that I may transcribe it incorrectly:

"FerHerinnering

1877 1/3 1902

Jan Hol en Co"

It has several deliberate markings that are hard to read eg 44K (or 44R?) in a box with a number below (75934 squiggle) and another that says WR&F ?

The watch does not work properly - it is overwound, and I cannot adjust it. I expected to be able to pull the winder knob out to adjust it but it doesnt want to go.

If anyone can help with identification, approx value (insurance - its not going to be sold), and a reliable place to service/repair it near the Forest of Dean (UK) or postal (UK) I would be immensely grateful. I can supply more info or images if useful.

Drat - when I preview the images are absent. Apparently I am not allowed to use the image extension on this board. Here are the 'naked' urls...

http://www.box.net/shared/i0krudorzd

http://www.box.net/shared/vdid59e220

http://www.box.net/shared/geonefmnoa

http://www.box.net/shared/u2o833y7x2

Thanks

Phill


----------



## Mikrolisk (Jan 23, 2008)

Hi!

First, do NOT pull the crown to set the hands, push that little knob at 11 o'clock with a finger nail and use then the crown.

The trademark "WR&F" (with a little star) was registered by Wuilleumier-Robert & Fils, who made pocket watches in Geneva in the year about 1881.

Your watch has got a swiss lever escapement (as far as I can see), 15 jewels, a swane neck fine regulator, compensation balance wheel.

That year 1902 in the case should be also the manufacturing date (perhaps minus 1 year). The squirrel is a swiss gold mark for 0.585 gold objects (here: the watch case).

Regards, Andreas


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Thanks Mikrolisk, a lot of detail for me to mull.... would the watch have been in the upper part of the market back then? If so it would support the family legend of a retirement present for an important man.

I did think the protrusions at 11 o'clock might be significant, but did not realize that there was a button to press between them. Thanks, I can now adjust the time.

Anybody have any help on the inscription? My grandfathers surname was 'van Leersum' but that does not appear in the engraving, so maybe the legend is false? Surely an engraved gift would include the name?

Its fun finding out stuff like this,

Phill


----------



## Shangas (Jan 27, 2008)

Yeeek!!

NOOOOOO!! No no no no! Do NOT pull on the crown to set the time! You'll only break the watch!

What you have is called a "PIN SET" watch. To set the time, you need to press down on the pin (the little button on the watch-case) to set the time correctly.

A watch such as this would've been fairly good quality in its day. 15 jewels is a respectable level of jewelling and the swan-neck regulator generally means it's capable of keeping very good time (otherwise I doubt they would have included that in the regulator).


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Thanks for the info..... this has certainly helped.

Does anyone have suggestions of how to find a reputable cleaner/servicer of watches? I live in the UK, if that affects the answer. It would also be nice to get a valuation to put on the house insurance - any suggestions as to how I get a valuation?

In continuing gratitude

Phill


----------



## Shangas (Jan 27, 2008)

A competent jeweller should be able to give you an evaluation, but keep in mind that evaluations fluctuate. Above all, don't leave your watches with a jeweller for servicing. That's best done by a professional watchmaker.


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Thanks, Shangas.

I know that valuations fluctuate, but I was hoping for a stab-in-the-dark guess. 10, 100, 500, 1000, ..... ? I guess that no-one would want to risk that, even though I would not quote it.

And can anyone recommend a professional association for watchmakers in the UK?

Thanks in advance for any clues....

Phill


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

To answer one of my own questions, in case it helps someone out there in the same position:

The British Horological Institute Limited has a list of registered repairers (and there are suprisingly few on their list).


----------



## ValvesRule (May 20, 2009)

Probaby a silly idea -

Could 1877 - 1902 be the time he was with the D.S.E.?

This doesn't account for the 1 and the 3, but the Division Line looks a bit like a long Hyphen to me.

It seems to me that if the Watch was given as a present, then the prominent engraving would be about the Recipient, rather than about the Watch or its Manufacturer.


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

I agree with your assessment ValvesRule, but was surprised there was no name. The 1/3 was hard to transcribe accurately. The line is horizontal with the '1' above and the '3' below.

I tried googling on Dutch Stock Exchange, but the web has little detail of the dates given, but then we are straying off pocket watches.

Phill


----------



## ValvesRule (May 20, 2009)

I'm guessing that You know your GrandFather's name, and that it isn't Mr. Herinnring (unless You don't, and 'Fer' is how you specify a person's Name in Dutch - again, guessing).

Could 'Jan Hol en Co' be a company name (i.e. Jan Hol & Co.)? Again, guessing.


----------



## DrPhill (Sep 19, 2009)

Yes, herinnering means something like 'memory, souvenir, token' according to moxicon.

I cant find anything on the 'Jan Hol en Co' - I am assuming its something like a company name. I cannot find a history of the dutch stock exchange that includes a list of important members....

I find it irritating to have so little information, but I have been spoiled by the web into thinking its all our there.

I might try the Dutch Stock Exchange.....

Phill


----------

