# My Search For A Grail To Complete Another 7A38 Trilogy



## SEIKO7A38

To many Seiko 7Axx collectors, and probably most 7A38 collectors, I suspect the 7A38-701B 'Vulcan' is something of a grail. :man_in_love:

I guess I've been fortunate in having had two examples pass through my hands, and for selling the first with a decent profit.

This is an oldish photo from December 2009, which I've posted before elsewhere (probably in the 7A38 Vulcan thread):










Whereas I actually prefer wearing the somewhat more subtle 7A38-7010, to the left of those two 'Vulcans'.

Indeed that particular 7A38-7010 has since been supplanted in my collection by a second better example,

and become an occasional daily wearer - and there's currently a third, hopefully better example on the way.

But something that has eluded my grasp for the last couple of years is their 'middle sibling' - the 7A38-701A (SAA003J):










Note the Seiko sales codes in these catalogue page illustrations : SAA*001*J; SAA*003*J and SAA*005*J.

Although their case numbers might not be the lowest (by a long way), these would appear the first 7A38's offered on sale.

Indeed, the 38xxxx case-back serial number of my own 7A38-701B dates it to August 1983 - one of the earliest I've seen.


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## SEIKO7A38

In fact, the cross-hatched dialed 7A38-701A appears to be nearly as scarce as it's yellow-faced 7A38-701B sibling. :search:

But they're out there. Probably one of the nicest examples belongs to Hung Pham ('Time2Fly' on SCWF).

This is a photo he posted on the old SCWF, way back:










Hung was lucky to pick up this very nice example, based on an 'eBay fuzzy photo gamble' in December 2005:












> This watch was listed on Ebay Europe with a very poor photo.
> 
> I emailed the seller for the model number, and found a photo of it in an old Seiko catalog.
> 
> A forum member helped me bid on it and won at a good price.
> 
> The watch looks much better than the catalog photo.
> 
> It's in excellent condition and all functions work correctly. This one is a keeper.


More photos here: http://members.cox.net/watches-3/7A38_701A.html










It may not be in absolutely pristine condition, with a few marks on the bezel insert, but it's still the nicest example I've seen.


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## SEIKO7A38

Another belonging to a German collector, Achim, who posts on UhrForum.de as 'Gufi', has started popping up all over.

Here's the first thread he posted it on Uhrforum.de: Seiko 7A38 Teil II - ein recht seltenes Modell (Plenty more photos there).



















That particular example came up for sale on eBay in Germany in August last year:










I had it on my eBay watching page, only to have it 'snaffled' by Achim. :angry:

There are other photos that he's posted elsewhere, where it doesn't look quite so good. :thumbsdown:

Not only is the bezel insert on his badly scratched up, the originally orange hands have faded to a pale yellow:










.... and like many well-worn 7A38-701x's, the original Seiko p/n Z1118S bracelet appears to be quite badly stretched:










So, in hindsight, I'm moderately pleased that I didn't make the seller an 'off eBay offer', as Achim obviously did. :schmoll:


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## SEIKO7A38

Speaking of well-loved 'beaters' ....

Here's the 'lightly modified' 7A38-701A belonging to 'Nonnodiqulia', posted on Orologio & Passioni:










Fitted on an incorrect bracelet (off a 7A28-701A, if I'm not mistaken), faded yellow hands, and a Ferrari decal on the dial !

Here's another 'beater' I found on the other Italian watch forum Orologiando.org in a thread titled Old Forgotten Seiko


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## SEIKO7A38

Here's yet another slightly tired-looking 7A38-701A with faded to yellow hands fitted with the wrong bracelet:




























Again, I may be wrong, but the bracelet looks like a Seiko p/n YA16A off a 7A28-7010, but minus it's Speedmaster clasp.

It was posted a couple of times on the old SCWF / SCTP, so I guess it may have changed hands since then. 

In the newer couple of photos I've saved of this watch, it's also recognisable by the same nick in the bezel insert at '90':


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## SEIKO7A38

Sightings of *any* half-decent looking 7A38-701A's on eBay have been *very* few and far between over the last couple of years.

Apart from the one Achim snaffled off eBay Germany, best I can remember, there have only been three others (that I've seen).

The first, a really rough example offered by one of the Filipino watch-botchers in June 2009. This one had it all:

Badly scratched bezel; faded to yellow hands, degraded lume and fitted on a totally wrong aftermarket bracelet !




























It was bought by one of those 'dealers' like 'swotlab', and re-sold on Yahoo Japan Auctions later the same month:


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## SEIKO7A38

The next one came up in August 2009, again offered by one of the Filipino watch-botchers.

For a change, this one's hands weren't too faded, and almost a passable shade of their original orange colour:










Sadly, the watch had been ruined, by polishing off most of the original anodised silver finish, in true watch-botcher fashion:



















Although the bracelet looked something like 'correct' it was in fact a cheap after-market, fitted with the original SQ clasp:










Lastly, there was this barely recognisable piece of junk offered with an equally battered-looking 7A38-6000 in June 2010:










That was until a couple of weeks ago ....


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## SEIKO7A38

By which time I guess I was getting impatient to fill the gap in my 7A38(-701x) collection. :sadwalk:

Despite all the warnings I've given to other people in the past, about (not) buying 7A38's from the Philippines ....

About poor workmanship standards / working conditions in their 'repair shops' / high humidity (especially this time of year);

their eBay listing descriptions which are either downright misleading, or best case often leave a lot to the imagination.

So what did I do ? :groan:

I bought this one: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360391022541?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649#ht_9117wt_1075



> *VINTAGE SEIKO QUARTZ CHRONO 7A38-701A RARE*









































> *Heres a HTF Seiko quartz chronograph, 7A38-701A......39.5mm.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> DIAL: Original dial in good condition. English/Arabic wheel. All functions work. *
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> CRYSTAL: Original glass.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> BEZEL: Chapter ring and bezel in good condition.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> CASEBACK: Unpolished case......52....May 1993.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> MOVEMENT: Overhauled 1 week ago..... watch keeps time. *
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> BRACELET: Original bracelet, extension clasp placed, fits a 7 inch wrist.*


I guess the reasons I fell for it were because it's bezel was in reasonable condition; the hands still an orange-ish colour;

it was still on the original p/n Z1118S bracelet (albeit a tad short), and it didn't look as if it had been too 'messed with'. :hammer:

Besides, the eBay seller was JosÃ© Sotto a.k.a. 'watchcooking', by far and away, the best of the Filipino watch-botchers. :wink2:

The watch arrived (very quickly) last Friday, but has since turned out to have 'a few issues', which I'll tell you about tomorrow.

Got a whole load of photos to re-size and upload to Photobucket first. :sweatdrop:


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## stradacab

Cliffhanger! pleas update as soon as possible. Have you found your grail watch or have you been turned over by the 'pino's!


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## jair1970

Great story.

I'm thinking 'a few issues' are likely easily remedied by one so expert.


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## Mike_J_Smith

Nice story and some serious background work there! Lovely looking watch too, will be interesting to see what you make of it.


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## SEIKO7A38

jair1970 said:


> Great story.
> 
> I'm thinking 'a few issues' are likely easily remedied by one so expert.


Thanks, James :hi:

Yes, whereas they're relatively simple issues (to me), for a watch that the seller was allegedly claiming to have been:



> *MOVEMENT: Overhauled 1 week ago.....*


I shouldn't really have to be dealing with them at all. :disgust:

One thing I should make clear to everybody (who doesn't already know) is that ....

Second hand watches coming out of the Philippines have generally suffered a hard life.

As JosÃ© Sotto once told me in an email, they're actually more likely to be 4th or 5th hand.

Think about this 7A38-701A. Why does it have and English / *Arabic* day wheel - and say not Spanish ?

Another thing is that Filipinos tend to be of smaller stature, and hence have proportionally smaller wrists ....

Meaning that watch bracelets have often been made smaller, and end up totally devoid of any adjustment links.

Anyway, getting back to this watch.

As I wrote, it arrived last Friday, and initially I was pleased with it's overall appearance.

However, on closer inspection, it's actual condition wasn't all that it might have been. 

I started making notes on a couple of Post-it Notes, and so they're not necessarily in any particular order:

There was no case-back sealing ring gasket fitted, and the case-back was only on finger tight.

The watch was fitted with an under-sized SR927SW (#399) battery, instead of the proper SR936SW (#394).

The crystal may well be the original, but it appears to have been polished, and has a slightly rippled surface.

Although they appeared clean in his listing photos, the pusher wells were full of a horrible tar-like rusty gunge.

As for the bracelet, after an overnight soak in Flash, and 5 minutes in the ultrasonic cleaner, the water was black ! :yucky:

There was strangely no feel to the 'split time' pusher (which re-sets the 30 minute counter) at 10 o'clock.

When I took the dial / movement assembly out I found more gunge / rust around the inside of the pushers.

The watch keeps time (so far), and the day / date flicks over at night, however, it has two faults with the chrono' function:

When you come to re-set it the sweep second hand, it stalls - hesitates around 20-30 minutes so does not re-set, and

the (30) minute counter sticks / does not move - if at all. Both symptoms repeat themselves during the chrono 'self-test'.

Getting back to the bracelet thing, one other little bodge that p*ssed me off was the way the clasp had been extended.

Someone had roughly filed the bracelet's end fixing link tube narrower to fit the clasp extender:










Had they used a decent aftermarket extending clasp extender, of this type:










.... instead of the cheap and nasty plain channel section used, the need to file the bracelet wouldn't have arisen.

As it happens, I was able to rob a couple of adjustment links, and another end tube off a gash Z1118S bracelet. :hammer:


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## SEIKO7A38

As I've written before, I'm not very good at taking W.I.P. photos. Let's face it, guys don't multi-task.

I'm either actually working on the watch :hammer: or taking photos.







Not both at the same time. :no:

So you'll have to take my word for it, that by this stage, I'd already stripped and cleaned the watch-case.

I removed the pushers; cleaned all the rust and gunge, inside and out, re-finished the ends of the pushers and crown,

fitted new pusher seals; greased and re-assembled the pushers into the case, which apart from one small ding, looks good.

Here's the first few photos I took of the dial face / movement (as received) removed from the case:



















Note the 30 minute counter hand stuck at 5, and the badly rusted dial post screw near the one o'clock baton:



















Note the verdigris near the 10 o'clock baton, and something strangely absent from the pusher recess below. :dontgetit:

Remembering this:



> *MOVEMENT: Overhauled 1 week ago.....*


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## SEIKO7A38

Normally, I'd strip a movement down in either a watchmaker's vice or movement holder, with the dial and hands removed.

But because of that rusted dial post screw, it wasn't going to be easy to take the dial off, without risking collateral damage.

So I decided to leave them in place, and strip the movement in the case.

Not really to be recomended, because you're reliant on the crown stem to hold the movement in place.

As it happens, all 7 screws holding the antimagnetic back-plate on were loose. A sign they'd been off before. :fear:

Looks quite good at first impressions - a reasonably clean back-plate (note the under-sized SR927SW battery still fitted):










No sign of any leaking battery acid damage to the PCB either:










Still looking good, apart from the discolouration of the bushing on the 30 minute chrono' bridge:










Uh-Oh. Someone's been in here before me:










You can see some of the 'tinkering' slightly better under the hard light of the flash:


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## SEIKO7A38

Here's a couple more close-ups I took yesterday:










These two taken by flash - you can also see the other end of the rusted dial post screw in the main-plate:



















The latter showing the reason for:



SEIKO7A38Fan said:


> There was strangely no feel to the 'split time' pusher (which re-sets the 30 minute counter) at 10 o'clock.


Incidentally there's an excellent tutorial on this subject (but using a 7A28), written by John Bentley on SCWF. :thumbsup:

See: Problems caused by old rubbers !! Better photos than mine, too. :wink2:


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## bpc

Great story so far! I've got my fingers crossed for a happy ending...

Also, what a great testament to the 7A series and their ability to be worked back into properation nearly 30 years after they were made.


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## SEIKO7A38

Now, where was I ? :umnik2:



SEIKO7A38Fan said:


> There was strangely no feel to the 'split time' pusher (which re-sets the 30 minute counter) at 10 o'clock.
> 
> When I took the dial / movement assembly out I found more gunge / rust around the inside of the pushers.
> 
> The watch keeps time (so far), and the day / date flicks over at night, however, it has two faults with the chrono' function:
> 
> When you come to re-set it the sweep second hand, it stalls - hesitates around 20-30 minutes so does not re-set, and
> 
> the (30) minute counter sticks / does not move - if at all. Both symptoms repeat themselves during the chrono 'self-test'.


Ah Yes. 

Well, I had a couple of N.O.S. Pusher actuator levers in my spares stock. Seiko p/n 4450.727 'Switch Lever' they call them:










But, even at a mere Â£2.75 + VAT each, I decided I wasn't going to waste either of them on this movement. :schmoll:

So I robbed a couple off this gash (also water-damaged) scrap 7A38 movement in my bits box:










Those of you who are familiar with the 7A38 movement will notice 'a few' other bits missing. :dontgetit: Of more anon. 

I cleaned up the area of the (7A38-701A) main-plate, the two (scrap donor) used lever actuators and fitted them.

I'd lent my multimeter to a mate at work, still not returned, and was unable to check the resistance of the coils,

so as an added precaution, I fitted a 'known good' used coil to the (30) minute register as well, for good measure.

Re-assembled the rest of the movement, expecting it all to work again. :sweatdrop:



SEIKO7A38Fan said:


> As I've written before, I'm not very good at taking W.I.P. photos. Let's face it, guys don't multi-task.
> 
> I'm either actually working on the watch :hammer: or taking photos.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not both at the same time. :no:


Sorry - no photos for that bit. :tongue_ss: Then came the acid test - first run of the chrono' functions:










Epic fail. :angry: Although both the sweep second hand and the (30) minute register now worked, I still had problems !


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## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38Fan said:


> Still looking good, apart from the discolouration of the bushing on the 30 minute chrono' bridge:


And therein apparently lay the problem(s). Yesterday evening (again, sorry no photos taken) .... I stripped, cleaned and

rebuilt the chrono' sweep second and (30) minute bridges, using more parts that I robbed from that gash movement. :hammer:


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## SEIKO7A38

So once I'd got the watch sorted, it was just a matter of this little problem:



SEIKO7A38Fan said:


> Getting back to the bracelet thing, one other little bodge that p*ssed me off was the way the clasp had been extended.
> 
> Someone had roughly filed the bracelet's end fixing link tube narrower to fit the clasp extender:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Had they used a decent aftermarket extending clasp extender, of this type:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .... instead of the cheap and nasty plain channel section used, the need to file the bracelet wouldn't have arisen.
> 
> As it happens, I was able to rob a couple of adjustment links, and another end tube off a gash Z1118S bracelet. :hammer:


Fortunately, I'd just freed up a 'proper' spring-loaded 16mm clasp extender from my 7A38-7050 'Diver':










With the two more adjustment links and an un-molested end tube, which I'd robbed from a gash Z1118S bracelet ....










.... it fitted me perfectly, and I've been wearing it most of this afternoon:


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## SEIKO7A38

stradacab said:


> Cliffhanger! pleas update as soon as possible.


Done ! :grin:



stradacab said:


> Have you found your grail watch or have you been turned over by the 'pino's!


To answer your question: I've found a reasonable example of one of my grails - a Seiko 7A38-701A.

It's far from perfect, but will do as a 'place-holder' in my collection, until a better one comes along. :lookaround:

As far as being 'turned over by the 'Pino's', I don't think so. :no:

I could have easily returned the watch to JosÃ© for repair (by him) or credit.

Instead, I decided to put it right myself - but how might others have fared ? 

I'm just disappointed in the received condition of the watch, bearing in mind the statements in his eBay listing description:



> *All functions work.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> MOVEMENT: Overhauled 1 week ago..... *


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## hermann

Congratulations to your 7A37-701A! It looks better as I thought when I saw it on ebay. From all the 7Axx itÂ´s my favourite model; it looks great at the wrist.

The stretch of the bracelet doesnÂ´t bother me too much; itÂ´s still very nice to wear. But a better looking bezel insert would be nice although in reality it doesnÂ´t look so bad as on some photos.

By the way; my model has a black day/date-wheel background. I canÂ´t imagine that it has been changed by the previous owner, so maybe there were models (maybe in Europe) with black wheel. And maybe the yellow chrono hands are not faded orange but original? It doesnÂ´t look like faded colour to me.

Best,

Achim/gufi

PS. Don Â´t you think it would be fair to ask me before posting *my* photos?


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## Moustachio

Great story dude!!


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## LeeKaye

Nice, I love reading your threads. I am slowly becoming a 7A38 fan myself. I will need to change my username soon...


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## Moustachio

haha, me too... resistance is futile!!! :thumbsup:


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## SEIKO7A38

Hi Achim, and :welcome: to :rltb: - the 'Home of all things 7A38'. :grin:

What's with the 'hermann' username, instead of your usual 'Gufi' handle ? :huh:

Was that choice perhaps in comic reference to 'Hermann the German' :dwarf: ? :rofl2:



hermann said:


> Congratulations to your 7A3*8*-701A ! It looks better as I thought when I saw it on ebay.


Thanks, Achim.  Actually, I think it's about the same, no better, as far as it's cosmetic condition goes.

JosÃ©'s photos didn't hide anything. I'm just rather disappointed about it's received mechanical condition. :thumbsdown:



hermann said:


> From all the 7Axx it's my favourite model; it looks great at the wrist.


I personally prefer the more subtle 7A38-7010. But I needed a 7A38-701A to complete this sub-set.

I'll reply to the other points you raised about your example in a couple more seperate posts. :wink2:



hermann said:


> PS. Don Â´t you think it would be fair to ask me before posting *my* photos?


Yes, I suppose I could have, but when you post photos of your watch all over the Internet (I counted 18) ....



SEIKO7A38 said:


> Another belonging to a German collector, Achim, who posts on UhrForum.de as 'Gufi', has started popping up all over.


.... they become 'fair game' - particularly if you host them in Photobucket without any image protection.

I could have been really cheeky and linked them direct from your Photobucket, instead of re-hosting them.

Besides, from what I remember of our last little exchange on UhrForum.de, we weren't on speaking terms.


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## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> I'll reply to the other points you raised about your example in a couple more seperate posts. :wink2:





hermann said:


> The stretch of the bracelet doesnÂ´t bother me too much; itÂ´s still very nice to wear.


No, I wouldn't worry about it too much, Achim. :wink2:

The Seiko p/n Z1118S bracelet used on all the 7A38-701x's is prone to stretching, and any well-worn example will have some slop between the links.

Indeed, in my experience, it's a common problem with any of these early 1980's Seiko folded link bracelets, which use a

small 'U' section channel joining piece between the main link sections.

Probably one of the worst examples I've encountered was on my first 7A38-701B 'Vulcan', which I bought in May 2009.

This is one of three additional photos, that the eBay seller sent me (which wasn't included in their eBay listing):










I didn't attempt to disguise the slop in the bracelet, when I subsequently re-sold it on eBay in December 2009:










Although it looked reasonably lacking in stretch in JosÃ©'s eBay listing photos, the bracelet on my 7A38-701A is now sloppier.

I don't know about you, but I can't abide the thought of wearing a used watch with 25-odd years of somebody else's wrist cheese ingrained in the bracelet. :bad:

So the first thing I do, is to whip them off, and let them soak overnight in Flash, before a long session in the ultrasonic tank.

This removes 99% of the crud from between the bracelet links / joining sections, but often also has the adverse effect of leaving them somewhat sloppier ! :angry:

The chances of anyone finding a replacement / N.O.S. Seiko p/n Z1118S bracelet are now pretty slim to remote to none.

I did see a good used one on eBay in January 2009:










But at that time I was still a '7A38 Newbie' and didn't recognise the significance / rarity factor of this particular bracelet. :blush:

Since then the only other one I've seen was on eBay in Germany in May 2010, which had a broken end piece:



















This time, I realized straight away what it was, even though it might only be useful for providing spare links.

I put a bid on it, subsequently only to have my bid cancelled â€" so it was presumably sold off eBay. 

Not you again, I suppose, Achim ? :naughty:

However, all is not lost.

There are other similar-appearing 20mm Seiko bracelets which will fit, and 'look the part' (to the un-initiated).

I myself have a couple of Seiko p/n B1688S bracelets that I use on my 7A38-701x's when I wear them for any length of time.

Other similar Seiko bracelets include p/n's B1424S and the slightly heavier G1410S, which isn't quite so wide at the ends.

Then of course there are all those cheap aftermarket repro' Seiko 20mm bracelets, usually mis-leadingly described as

SEIKO BRACELET FOR BULLHEAD offered on eBay by 'Mountapo_Merchant' and other Far East eBay sellers:










You'll often see these fitted to 'Frankens', described as 'Original Seiko bracelet', on 7A38's coming out of the Philippines.


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## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> But a better looking bezel insert would be nice although in reality it doesnÂ´t look so bad as on some photos.


Yes, sadly it's often a badly scratched bezel insert that lets down so many well-worn vintage Seikos. 

Yours looks particularly bad in the photo you posted here: Restoration of a bezel inlays - who can help me?

The bezel insert on my 7A38-701A is in better condition than yours, but still far from good enough in my book. :thumbsdown:

Long ago, I looked at sourcing alternative Tachymeter inserts from other bezels which might fit the 7A38-701x range.

I don't know if you realize, but a few Filipino watch-botchers use repro' 6139-6002 bezel inserts to restore 7A28-703x's.

I also talked to the late Noah Fuller ('10Watches') about the possibility of producing repro' 7A38-701x bezels / inlays.

His reply was simply that unlike say the repro' 6139-6002 bezel insert, the low volumes simply wouldn't be economic.

I note in that other thread of yours, you describe the bezel as: 'The base colour of the inlay is a slightly broken black'.

In fact, it's a slightly metallic very dark grey. The Tachymeter bezels used on the 7A38-701x range are all different:

7A38-7010 has silver printing on a black background, with the word Tachymeter in a metallic Candy Apple Red.

7A38-701A has silver printing on a dark grey background with Tachymeter in a dark metallic Orange.

7A38-701B 'RAF Vulcan' has all gold printing on a black background.

So, it's not as if you could even swap bezels between 7A38-701x's.


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## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> By the way; my model has a black day/date-wheel background.
> 
> I can't imagine that it has been changed by the previous owner ....


Thank you for pointing that out, Achim. Yes I had noticed (I have right-clicked and saved all your posted photos). :wink2:

I deliberately omitted it from my post # 2, because I didn't want to be seen to be bad-mouthing another collector's 7A38.

I'm sorry to tell you, but although it looks better than the 'correct' silver / white day date windows on a 7A38-701A ....

this fact actually makes your 7A38-701A a 'wrong 'un' in my book. :thumbsdown:

I've been religiously right-clicking and saving photos of 7A38's for nearly 3 years now. Off eBay and everywhere. :nerd:

If you check Seiko Oceania's database, sadly the parts list, in fact all the data, for the 7A38-701A is missing. 

However, this wouldnâ€™t make any difference, because the Day / Date wheels aren't included in the case # parts lists.

Where you'll find them is in a parts breakdown of the 7A38A movement:










That's not all of them, by any means; that's just some of the Day wheels in different languages / colours.

There are more on other pages, plus the various different coloured number / background Date wheels.

I'm not sure how Seiko manufacturing controlled it at the time â€" I doubt their manufacturing lines were computerized in the early 1980's.

I suspect some fairly sophisticated (paper-based) batch control was in place to manage which assembled 7A38 movements

with whatever colour / language day / date wheels were used in the right cases.



hermann said:


> .... so maybe there were models (maybe in Europe) with black wheel.


I doubt VERY MUCH that they used different colour background day / date wheels for different target demographics. :no:

In my experience, 7A38-7010's and 7A38-701A's should have silver / white Day and Date wheels with black lettering,

and the 7A38-701B 'RAF Vulcan' used white lettered Day / Date wheels with black backgrounds.

The only exception I have seen to this rule was a 7A38-7010 offered on SCWF and later on eBay by Mike Mounce.

See here: http://www.thewatchforum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=53526&view=findpost&p=663606

That watch was clearly a Franken, in that it was been fitted with the wrong case-back off a 7A38-7180:










Presumably that same 7A38-7180 had donated its movement, complete with white on black day / date wheels.

Note that whoever replaced the sub-dial hands got those on the 9 o'clock and 6 o'clock registers mixed up ! 

I doubt anyone would have gone to the trouble of swapping the day / date wheels on the original movement in your watch.

I suspect what happened is that the original movement (with silver / white day / date wheels) got trashed somehow.

Whoever re-built it then transferred your watchâ€™s original dial and hands over onto another used movement with black date / date wheels.

It could have come out of any number of other 7A38 models besides a 7A38-7180: 7A38-7070/-7080, -7270, etc., etc.

So, I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings.









If it's any consolation, Achim, as I wrote - even if it's wrong, I think it looks better than 'standard', with the black day / date.

To which end, I'm planning to do a few 'Franken' mods on my own 'beater' 7A38-7010 which is already on a B1688S bracelet.

Not only will it be getting black day / date wheels, like yours, but probably (at least) a red sweep second hand. :hammer:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> I'll reply to the other points you raised about your example in a couple more seperate posts. :wink2:


Last part ! :sweatdrop:



hermann said:


> And maybe the yellow chrono hands are not faded orange but original? It doesnÂ´t look like faded colour to me.


I hate to tell you, Achim, but I'm right about the 'faded to pale Yellow' hands on your example as well. :smartass:

When I first started saving photos of 7A38's, I too thought that there might possibly be two versions of the 7A38-701A.

One with orange hands, and another version with yellow hands. I knew the one with Orange hands was SAA003J from the

catalogue illustration, so I thought that maybe the version with yellow hands might be the missing sales code SAA004J.

Indeed, for a long time, when I saved any photos to file, I included the hand colours in the captions. :duh:

Experience tells you that I was wrong.









When you've studied photos of 7A38's for as long as I have, you'll realize that the pigments Seiko used for red and orange

coloured hands will often fade to yellow over the years.

You'll see it not just on the 7A38-701A, but other 7A38's, like the 7A38-704A and â€"704C.

Another common one is the sweep hand (only) on the 7A38-7080. More often than not they're yellow (instead of orange).

It's not just the hands that fade either. Remember my all-Titanium 7A38-7030 that you fancied ?

The hands may have retained their original red colour, but the word CHRONOGRAPH on the dial has faded to a sort of yellow.

Indeed, 'JasonM' pointed out that it was a fairly common problem, in that same thread:



jasonm said:


> I would hazard a guess that the wording would have been red fading to yellow....
> 
> Seiko divers of the same era had the words 'water resist' in red on the dial and many of them have faded to yellow.


----------



## SEIKO7A38

bpc said:


> Great story so far!





Moustachio said:


> Great story dude!!





LeeKaye said:


> Nice, I love reading your threads.


Still not quite finished yet, either. 

So does any of you fancy nominating this one for the 'Thread Of The Month Competition' ? :lookaround:


----------



## hermann

Hi Paul,

thanks for your warm welcome.



> Was that choice perhaps in comic reference to 'Hermann the German'


Not really; actually IÂ´m an Austrian (living in Germany) ... ^_^



> I personally prefer the more subtle 7A38-7010. But I needed a 7A38-701A to complete this sub-set.


That is indeed a very nice model which maybe IÂ´ll try to get too. I think a nice looking (but not running) one was on ebay Germany lately. As I do not limit myself to 7A38 my subtle choice is a 7A28-701A with its great looking tachymeter scale right under the glass.










Coming to your comments about day/date wheel, colour of hands and bezel insert.

*Day/date wheel:*

YouÂ´re probably right that my black wheel is not correct. But as you said it actually looks better than the white one. And I think this little "mistake" makes it rather unique and not really a Franken ... :wink2:

*Yellow/Orange hands:*

*
*

Most likely you are right about this topic too. Sure I know about faded colours on other Seikos too. But still we have little information about the models/variants that existed. By the way: do you have information about production rates of the various 7Axx?

It would be easily done to let the hands painted in orange by a professional but I like the way it looks now.

*Bezel insert:*

Your bezel insert looks better, no doubt. My photo above with the racing background shows the scratches much more than they really are (it always depends on the light when taking photos). ItÂ´s better looking on this photo:










But as I wear this watch a lot maybe some day IÂ´ll let it restaurate professionally (I know that this wonÂ´t be cheap ...).

Best,

Achim

PS. By the way: The crazy guy who bought the (not running) Seiko 7T42 Titanium for a very high price was me! I have a spare movement and was looking for this model for a longer time. IÂ´m not sure what IÂ´ll do with the awful looking 7A28 ...


----------



## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> I personally prefer the more subtle 7A38-7010. But I needed a 7A38-701A to complete this sub-set.
> 
> 
> 
> That is indeed a very nice model which maybe IÂ´ll try to get too.
> 
> I think a nice looking (but not running) one was on ebay Germany lately.
Click to expand...

You mean I missed one ??? 



hermann said:


> As I do not limit myself to 7A38 my subtle choice is a 7A28-701A with its great looking tachymeter scale right under the glass.


I had a slight relapse a couple of weeks ago and bought my first 7A28 - a 7A28-7040. :blush:

The 7A28-701A (and -7010) are a couple more that I fancy - particularly the -701A. :naughty:

Funnily enough, I was only looking at one on Yahoo Japan auctions yesterday. 



hermann said:


> By the way: do you have information about production rates of the various 7Axx?


No, Sorry Achim, I don't. 

We did try a little exercise, seeing if it was possible to work out production volumes from serial numbers.

See this thread: Is There Any Real Significance To Seiko Serial Numbers ? Pretty inconclusive though. 



hermann said:


> (it always depends on the light when taking photos). ItÂ´s better looking on this photo:


Yes, the angle you take the photo at, and clever lighting can hide a multitude of sins.











hermann said:


> But as I wear this watch a lot maybe some day IÂ´ll let it restaurate professionally (I know that this wonÂ´t be cheap ...).


I guess you meant to write that maybe you'll get it professionally restored. :wink2:

It doesn't make economic sense, Achim. :no: Not for any 7A38 at today's values.

I think what we both need to do is to keep a watching eye open for better examples.

One will turn up on eBay, sooner or later. It's just a matter which of us snaffles it first ! :naughty:



hermann said:


> PS. By the way: The crazy guy who bought the (not running) Seiko 7T42 Titanium for a very high price was me!
> 
> I have a spare movement and was looking for this model for a longer time. IÂ´m not sure what IÂ´ll do with the awful looking 7A28.


So you read this thread / post then ? Holy Cr*p !  ?









Whatever floats your boat, Achim. :thumbsup:

Actually that's not a bad buy for such a rare 7T42 variant - it'll make a good lookalike substitute for the 7A38-7030. :grin:


----------



## hermann

> I had a slight relapse a couple of weeks ago and bought my first 7A28 - a 7A28-7040. :blush:


ThatÂ´s an obvious choice; I guess itÂ´s the most popular 7Axx of all. Fortunately it must have been very popular back in the 80s too, as there are still some good ones around. I like it too, but actually I think that this kind of diver-bezel is not the appropriate one for a chronograph.



> The 7A28-701A (and -7010) are a couple more that I fancy - particularly the -701A. :naughty:


As said before I like the tachymeter scale with horizontal inscription a lot. This kind of placing it under the glass also has the great advantage that you donÂ´t have the problem with scratched bezels ... :wink2:

There are two other 7A28 I like a lot. The 7A28-703B (not the pepsi one; just black and grey); some time IÂ´ll get me this one. And also my titanium 7A28-7080 which is in nearly NOS-condition (remember yellow hands?) :wink2: .












> I guess you meant to write that maybe you'll get it professionally restored. :wink2:
> 
> It doesn't make economic sense, Achim. :no: Not for any 7A38 at today's values.


Does it make economic sense to have more watches than one at all? :wink2:



> Whatever floats your boat, Achim. :thumbsup:
> 
> Actually that's not a bad buy for such a rare 7T42 variant - it'll make a good lookalike substitute for the 7A38-7030. :grin:


Of course you can describe this 7T42 as an substitute for a 7A38-7030. And indeed itÂ´s obvious that Seiko copied itÂ´s own design with this watch. But I like the 7T32/42s a lot too. I use my chrono-watches as chronographs every day and I like the way the chrono-second hand moves with 1/5 sec steps. Besides you can use the alarm time function as GMT.

Do you collect only 7Axx? Actually IÂ´m not a collector in your sense to have something "complete"; there are only a few watches in my collection that I would describe as "keeper". Besides Longines automatic watches my main interrest are early (Seiko) quartz-watches of the 70s/80s. There are some very nice Grand/King Quartz watches from this period.

And there is also my "Citizen grail": a 3531 titanium in nearly NOS condition. The Caliber 35xx can be described as Citizens response to Seikos 7Axx. I hope you donÂ´t mind this off-topic photo:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> As said before I like the tachymeter scale with horizontal inscription a lot.
> 
> This kind of placing it under the glass also has the great advantage that you donÂ´t have the problem with scratched bezels ...


Achim, and of course there is a *7A38* which meets this criteria - the 7A38-7000:



Paul66 said:


> Personally, I much prefer my stainless and black 7A38-7000 (SAA007J). It's one of my favourite 7A38's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No hint of bling; better lume (still works too 27 years on); great retro looks ....





hermann said:


> Do you collect only 7Axx?


Yes, in all their forms, including the Cartier Ferrari Formula versions. See this recent thread.

But I do own a few other 'prestige' brand watches, which I'm not prepared to discuss here. :secret:



hermann said:


> I hope you donÂ´t mind this off-topic photo:


No, Achim. :kewlpics: I thank you for your recent contributions, but would ask if you'd kindly stop taking the thread fftopic:

It's not meant to be about 7A28's; 7A38's in general, or other makes of watches (please feel free to start new threads) ....










*Just the Seiko 7A38-701x sub-group and in particular the 7A38-701A SAA003J which we both own*.

More on the original topic to follow tomorrow.


----------



## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> Then of course there are all those cheap aftermarket repro' Seiko 20mm bracelets, usually mis-leadingly described as
> 
> SEIKO BRACELET FOR BULLHEAD offered on eBay by 'Mountapo_Merchant' and other Far East eBay sellers:


Just checked that eBay listing, which has now ended, and noticed that someone bought 3 of them. I wonder who ?


----------



## SEIKO7A38

Getting back to my 'problematic' 7A38-701A ....



SEIKO7A38 said:


> And therein apparently lay the problem(s). Yesterday evening (again, sorry no photos taken) .... I stripped, cleaned and
> 
> rebuilt the chrono' sweep second and (30) minute bridges, using more parts that I robbed from that gash movement. :hammer:


In fact although I was remiss in not taking any W.I.P. photos at the time, an obvious reason for one of

my problems (a slipping / sticking sweep second hand) was evident in one of my earlier close-up shots.

Look at the state of the gear teeth visible through the inspection hole on the centre second chrono bridge:



SEIKO7A38 said:


> These two taken by flash - you can also see the other end of the rusted dial post screw in the main-plate:


I'm talking about these wheels - one of the largest used on the 7A38(A) movement:










Approx 4.50mm Ã˜ on a 7.00mm long spindle with 6 lightening holes and 60 teeth.

You're all familiar with it right ? :huh: Seiko part number anybody ? :lookaround:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> You're all familiar with it right ? :huh: Seiko part number anybody ? :lookaround:


What ? :dontgetit: Nobody ? :huh:

O.K. it's Seiko p/n 0888731, or in their old format 888.731.

Though you might not be able to easily figure that out from the descriptions in Seiko's online parts list:










Incidentally, although they share a lot of common parts, the equivalent gear used on the 7A28(A) movement is different ....

because the spindle is slightly shorter. It's Seiko p/n 0888725 (or 888.725 in old money). Of more anon ....


----------



## SEIKO7A38

In case anybody's wondering why I appear to be rambling slightly fftopic: - it's not. :tongue2:

While I was dabbling with the movement in that 7A38-701A, I had to refer to the Seiko manuals on occasions :book:

and *somewhat belatedly* (bearing in mind they were printed in 1984) discovered a couple of transposition errors.









If you need to order any movement spare parts, or do any kind of strip-down, you'll refer to the manuals, naturally.









And the Seiko technical manuals and parts lists are 'Gospel', right ? 

Most people use print-outs of these 2 scanned .pdf files, which are available online: 7A28A.pdf and 7A38A.pdf

What some of you may not know, is to get the full benefit from them, when working on a 7A38, is that you should read

*both* manuals, because there's a lot more information in the 7A28A manual, which is also relevant to the 7A38. :read:

Anyway, back to that gear wheel. Here's a partial scan of the top part of page 6 of the 7A38A Tech manual:










You can see it 'arrowed' as (37) in that illustration and called 'Second Counting Wheel' (which is what it does).

Note also the *shapes* and names given to the various chrono' bridges:

Chronograph Second bridge; Chronograph 5/100 Second bridge and Chronograph Minute bridge.

Now turn to your copy of the parts lists where it shows the illustrations of the parts - and the gears:










So indeed, what we are taking about is Seiko p/n *888.731* - the *Chronograph Second* Counting Wheel. Right ?

Now flick over the page to the parts lists with descriptions, and run your finger towards the bottom:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

Seeing as I've worked on 'a few' of these movements, I'd like to think that I know what I'm doing, by now. :smartass:



SEIKO7A38 said:


> .... rebuilt the chrono' sweep second and (30) minute bridges, using more parts that I robbed from that gash movement. :hammer:


Note the two missing bridges I mentioned. :hammer: The main Train wheel bridge and 5/100s Chrono' bridge are still in place.

Here's two used examples of the same chronograph bridges (but not necessarily the ones I robbed from that movement):










Left is the Chronograph Second bridge (the one that has the familiar finger spring fitted) ....

On the right is the (30) Minute bridge which sits at what I'd call the bottom of the movement.



SEIKO7A38 said:


> Note also the *shapes* and names given to the various chrono' bridges ....


I was doing some work on my recently acquired 7A28-7040 at the same time, so I thought I ought to read up on it. :book:

Turn to page 8 of the 7A28A Technical Manual and look closely at the top left part of the chart:










It's not immediately obvious, because all the other data is correct, but the illustrations of the two bridges are inter-posed:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

Now I've bored you all to death :bored: with 'pedantic technicalities', I suppose I ought to make amends. :grin:



SEIKO7A38 said:


> Indeed that particular 7A38-7010 has since been supplanted in my collection by a second better example,
> 
> and become an occasional daily wearer - and there's currently a third, hopefully better example on the way.


.... and here it is, as promised - my third (and in best condition so far) 7A38-7010 (SAA001J):










I can feel a 'family portrait' photo shoot coming on.


----------



## hermann

SEIKO7A38 said:


> .... and here it is, as promised - my third (and in best condition so far) 7A38-7010 (SAA001J):


This looks really great; congratulations. :thumbsup: The deep black bezel insert seems to be in amazingly good condition. Where did you get this from?

Coming back to the 7A38-701A and itÂ´s cross-hatched dial. I ask myself if there is a direct connection to the Giugiaro-designed 7A28-7050 with the pivot case. Of course this kind of texture can be found in variations on a lot of Seikos throughout the years. But the texture of these two dials look very much the same. Maybe itÂ´s just some kind of "by-product" of GiugiaroÂ´s design studies or maybe he even was directly involved in the design of the 7A38-701A?


----------



## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> This looks really great; congratulations. :thumbsup:


Thanks, Achim. :hi:



hermann said:


> The deep black bezel insert seems to be in amazingly good condition.


It's almost perfect. There are one or two tiny marks, and on the crystal, but you only see them under magnification.

It's got a few light scratches to the silver anodized coating on one side of the bracelet, as you can see in the photo.

This one's bracelet has no stretch and came with the full original complement of removeable adjustment links, too. 



hermann said:


> Where did you get this from?


eBay Germany. :grin: It wasn't on there for very long. :naughty:



SEIKO7A38 said:


> hermann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I personally prefer the more subtle 7A38-7010. But I needed a 7A38-701A to complete this sub-set.
> 
> 
> 
> That is indeed a very nice model which maybe IÂ´ll try to get too.
> 
> I think a nice looking (but not running) one was on ebay Germany lately.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You mean I missed one ???
Click to expand...

It wasn't that one.


----------



## watchking1

Is this one a grail? Seiko 7A38-702H

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Extremely-Rare-1987-Seiko-7A38-6109AO-Divers-Chronograph-Sport-150-watch-/270825793054?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item3f0e79a61e


----------



## SEIKO7A38

watchking1 said:


> Is this one a grail? Seiko 7A38-702H http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Extremely-Rare-1987-Seiko-7A38-6109AO-Divers-Chronograph-Sport-150-watch-/270825793054?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item3f0e79a61e


You mean a 7A38-*6109* Skip ? :huh:

No, hardly a grail (for me) any more - and especially not at that kind of crazy asking price of $500 bucks ! :shocking:

It was a grail (as were many other 7A38 models I didn't have in my collection 18 months ago). :search:

But then I found one on eBay (which turned out to have a battery acid damaged movement), and then another ....

better example in February 2010, for which I paid the princely sum of $91.00, and sold the first one back on eBay.

See: My Newest Incoming 7A38 .... SERIOUS BLING ALERT !!!!! (another thread that really needed updating).

Since then I've bought two 7A38-6109 sample cases and used their 609L dials and hands to build Frankens with. :hammer:

See: 7A38 Into 7A34 Will Go .... (and scroll down the page).

So thanks for the 'heads up' Skip :thumbsup:, but not for me at that price thank you :schmoll: - nor anybody else if they've got sense.


----------



## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> Indeed that particular 7A38-7010 has since been supplanted in my collection by a second better example,
> 
> and become an occasional daily wearer - and there's currently a third, hopefully better example on the way.


I had to get my 'second string' 7A38-7010 out today. I needed to 'borrow' it's bracelet for my 7A38-701A. :naughty:

Here they are photographed together for the first time. The newest, in slightly better condition is on the left:










I may yet swap a couple of parts around between them. 



SEIKO7A38 said:


> I can feel a 'family portrait' photo shoot coming on.


.... and now, for the 'money shot', turn the page. :book:


----------



## SEIKO7A38

I took advantage of the super sunlight we had today to rattle off a few more photos of my 7A38-701x's.









*7A38-7010 SAA001J*:










*7A38-701A SAA003J*:










*7A38-701B SAA005J*:










The original Seiko catalogue page showing these three models:










.... and my three (slightly less than pristine) examples together:










And before Mike 'Tixntox' (or anyone else) comments about the positions of their hands ....









Yes, they were all 'hacked' - and set to *WED 2* just like they were in the catalogue illustration. :tongue2:


----------



## hermann

Well done, Paul! :thumbup: Indeed a very nice family photo. I know how hard it is to get these Seikos in decent quality.

By the way, if you intend to sell your old 7A38-7010 on ebay, you can first ask me; it would be a nice companion to my 701A.


----------



## SEIKO7A38

hermann said:


> Well done, Paul! :thumbup: Indeed a very nice family photo.


Glad you appreciated it, Achim. :thumbsup:

I did actually try to set the shot up with the watches angled slightly to one side, just like the catalogue page ....

but it was bright and sunny, so there were reflections all over the place. I may have another try at the weekend. 



hermann said:


> By the way, if you intend to sell your old 7A38-7010 on ebay, you can first ask me ....


It may be a little while, yet, Achim. 

First thing I'm planning on doing is modding my original 'beater' 7A38-7010 (not in any of those photos):



SEIKO7A38 said:


> If it's any consolation, Achim, as I wrote - even if it's wrong, I think it looks better than 'standard', with the black day / date.
> 
> To which end, I'm planning to do a few 'Franken' mods on my own 'beater' 7A38-7010 which is already on a B1688S bracelet.
> 
> Not only will it be getting black day / date wheels, like yours, but probably (at least) a red sweep second hand. :hammer:


----------



## hermann

As I wrote earlier I was planning to do a revision of my 7A38-701A. I found a watchmaker who (to my surprise) could find a NOS-replacement bezel. Unfortunately only for a 7A38-7010. Anyway, I think it looks quite good that way; it fits to the black day/date-wheel. :wink2:

Additional work that has been done: repaintig the chrono-hands, new glass (sadly not original), new gaskets and a professional cleaning of the case. The watch is looking like (almost) new.

Of course the watch is not "original" anymore. But right now I donÂ´t mind and of course there is still the possibility to change it again to the dark-grey bezel.


----------



## SEIKO7A38

Looking good, Achim :thumbsup: - a great improvement - if not strictly 100% original and correct. :wink2:

Your watchmaker has done a nice job of re-painting the chrono' hands. :artist:

I've seen this done a few times on various 7A38's, with varying degrees of success.

This is a photo of a 7A38-7010 I found on a 'RisingSunWatches' forum a while back:










I guess whoever did it was trying to make his watch look like a 7A38-701A. Not particularly well done though. :thumbsdown:



hermann said:


> Additional work that has been done: repainting the chrono-hands, new glass (sadly not original) ....


Achim. I suspect that you're not completely happy with the replacement glass that has been fitted ?

Looking at your photos (and the others you posted over on Uhrforum.de), it appears to be plain and flat ....

without that nice polished beveled edge of the original Seiko crystal - and also rather (a lot) too thick !! :shocking:










I don't know if your read earlier in this thread, but the crystal on my 7A38-701A had been polished. :butcher:

It looked reasonable in a head-on photo, but from some (sideways) angles, it was distinctly ripply. :thumbsdown:



SEIKO7A38 said:


> The crystal may well be the original, but it appears to have been polished, and has a slightly rippled surface.


Also, when I came to take the photo of my 7A38-701B for this thread, I noticed a small scratch on the crystal. :angry:

Right in the middle of the 3 o'clock subdial - scroll back up to the top of the page and you can see it clearly. :blush:

Anyway, the crystals in both those watches have both since been replaced (by me) :hammer:

with a substitute crystal which is (externally) virtually indistinguishable from the original ....

Sternkreuz p/n XMF300.860. See page 3 of this thread: http://www.thewatchforum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=66398&st=30

Suggest you might want to get one fitted to your 7A38-701A, Achim.









Besides, they're 'Made in Germany' so you know it makes good sense. :thumbsup:


----------



## hermann

Hi Paul,

thanks, I also think that the revision is an improvement. After two days of wearing this "new" watch IÂ´m getting used to the different look. Of course the bezel is not original, but isnÂ´t modding something a lot of the Seiko-diver-fans do every day ... ? :wink2:

What surprised me most: that my watchmaker was able to find a replacement bezel at all! IÂ´m sure that somewhere in the world there are a lot of replacement parts (that we look for desperately) are just lying around in the vaults.

The glasses: Actually I donÂ´t mind that the new glasses donÂ´t have the beveled edge that much. You think they are too thick? I didnÂ´t notice it before. But if this is the case, maybe it prevents the bezel from forthcoming scratches. :wink2:

But for the future I guess I will order a Sternkreuz p/n XMF300.860 as you suggest. :good:


----------



## jwatches

Hi Paul,

After I did read this topic I only say that "you are a really 7A3 8FAN".

Regards,

Paulo


----------



## Chromejob

SEIKO7A38 said:


> ... I did actually try to set the shot up with the watches angled slightly to one side, just like the catalogue page ....
> 
> but it was bright and sunny, so there were reflections all over the place. I may have another try at the weekend.


You just need a photographer's reflector screen. We had some overcast afternoon light today, so I experimented with one I just bought. I got it for the large, matte black cover, but the base screen is a white "diffuser" which lets light through but giving nothing for the crystal to reflect. Worked a charm imho.

I got mine for US$13 on Amazon.


----------



## tixntox

SEIKO7A38 said:


> And before Mike 'Tixntox' (or anyone else) comments about the positions of their hands ....


Moi? Mais Non!


----------



## SEIKO7A38

SEIKO7A38 said:


> Moi? Mais Non!


Speaking of which, Achim, have you seen the 7A38-701A which was listed on eBay in France early this morning ? :huh:



> *Montre vintage SEIKO Chrono quartz 7A38-701A de 1984*
















































> Je vends cette belle SEIKO quartz chrono modÃ¨le 7A38 de 1984. Fonctionne parfaitement, pile neuve, mvt nettoyÃ©. Tout d'origine, bracelet compris, Ã©tat impeccable, aucun coup ni rayure. Toutes les fonctions sont parfaitement opÃ©rantes, jour, date, ainsi que le chrono : au lancement, simultanÃ©ment tournent la grande aiguille chrono et le chrono 1/10e sec placÃ© Ã 15h. Fonction marche/arrÃªt, reprise du chrono aprÃ¨s arrÃªt en prenant compte du temps d'arrÃªt ou pas, remise Ã zero. Diam 38mm. Au dos : SEIKO waterresistant 393039 - JAPAN S - stainless steel - 7A38- 701A -A3. Paiement paypal. Fret France 10 euros, inter 20 euros. Remise main propre Paris possible.
> 
> I am selling this beautiful Seiko quartz chrono model 7A38, 1984. Works great, new battery,clean mvt. All original, bracelet included, perfect condition, no scratches blow. All functionsare fully operative, day, date, and the clock: the launch, simultaneously turning the minute hand and stopwatch timer 1/10th sec set to 15h. On / off, taken off the clock after taking into account the time of arrest or not, reset. 38mm diam. On the back: SEIKO waterresistant393039 - JAPAN S - stainless steel - 7A38-701A-A3.
> 
> Paypal payment. Freight France 10 euros, 20 euros inter.


No mention of the worn bezel insert, the dodgy lume, nor the faded (to almost white) chrono' hands. 



hermann said:


> .... I also think that the revision is an improvement.


I've noted, from looking at French eBay auctions, over the last couple of years, the popularity of the expression 'RÃ©visÃ©e',

which is frequently used abused to cover a multitude of sins. :naughty: I think this one could probably use a bit of 'Revision'. 

PS. Check out this search on eBay France on: RÃ©visÃ©e included in title and description - over 500 results returned.


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