# Raymond Weil Freelancer Chronograph.



## cidercider (Nov 23, 2010)

I have Â£1700 to spend on a watch and I keep getting drawn to the Freelancer chronograph. I love the Raymond Weil style and look of watches.

I would love to hear your opinions on this watch and whether its worth the purchase. Thanks in advance.


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## jaslfc5 (Jan 2, 2007)

do a search on here there have been a few threads concerning rw watches and they are worth reading before buying .i am an owner of a rw and as much as i like it i wouldnt spend that money on one again.

welcome.


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## Benzowner (Nov 11, 2009)

RW are overpriced in the UK, I own a Freelancer day date which retailed at about Â£1150 in the UK. I holidayed in the Caribbean last year and the same watch retailed at about Â£750, but that is a similar senario for all watches and jewelery I guess. I am happy with my RW and would like the Don Giovanni chrono. Personally I like them and would buy another but maybe not in this country :hi:


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## ENY55V (Mar 17, 2006)

Most watches are over priced in UK..... full stop.

RW is one of those brands that we have all heard of (Ebel, Maurice Lacroix, Paul Picot) but don't know many that are actually wearing one.

I cannot find which movement this watch is fitted with!?

Pointing to brands like Oris, Tag, Steinhart, Sinn, Omega, Fortis and Glycine becomes really boring in my opinion.

For <personal reasons> I don't really like to mention this brand but I think it is good value for money - model SEMPER from Jean Marcel. The brand used to belong to Richard Kalina (ex Bulova director) but now in hands of some French company.

I REALLY BELIEVE that we should buy British but NOT from those pompous brands that pretend to be Swiss expatriate but from good manufacturers like RLT.

At which point I think you should look at Christopher Ward range of chronographs too.

Montblanc Timewalker and Longines Master (with discount) could be a <foreign> choice. You may also wish to consider the EPOS Sportive chronograph. A Â£1,100 watch with chronograph Valjoux 7750 (good value) !


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## cidercider (Nov 23, 2010)

ENY55V said:


> Most watches are over priced in UK..... full stop.
> 
> RW is one of those brands that we have all heard of (Ebel, Maurice Lacroix, Paul Picot) but don't know many that are actually wearing one.
> 
> ...


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## cidercider (Nov 23, 2010)

ENY55V said:


> Most watches are over priced in UK..... full stop.
> 
> RW is one of those brands that we have all heard of (Ebel, Maurice Lacroix, Paul Picot) but don't know many that are actually wearing one.
> 
> ...


Automatic movement. It retails in Beaverbrooks and Frazer Hart at Â£1895 but I have just picked one up on Amazon for Â£1295


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## 86latour (Jun 3, 2010)

ENY55V said:


> Most watches are over priced in UK..... full stop.
> 
> RW is one of those brands that we have all heard of (Ebel, Maurice Lacroix, Paul Picot) but don't know many that are actually wearing one.
> 
> ...


I agree and disagree at the same time, whilst these brands are regulary recomended that is for a very good reason, Many memebers on her can vouch for there quality and value for money particulary Glycine and Steinhart. Mind you I am biased given I own one of each of the bolded brands! Furthermore, I would have any of these brands before a Montblanc, had a 4810star and it was very disapointing.

On the flipside, couldn't agree more regarding Christopher Ward, quality.


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## DaveOS (May 9, 2010)

ENY55V said:


> I cannot find which movement this watch is fitted with!?


as far as I know, it's a 7750.


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## ENY55V (Mar 17, 2006)




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## Benzowner (Nov 11, 2009)

I agree and disagree at the same time, whilst these brands are regulary recomended that is for a very good reason, Many memebers on her can vouch for there quality and value for money


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## 86latour (Jun 3, 2010)

You make some very interesting (unusual) comments,

I don't think the Ford/Vauxhall analogy is particularly relevant though, my point which I thought was clear, is that many people on this forum have had positive experiences with the aforementioned brands, therefor allowing them to recommend with confidence.

With regard to the martial arts comment, no idea...What's a Senpai?..

Your very lucky to have driven almost ALL car brands AND models out there and equally so to have 100+ watches probably from 80 brands, whilst being well travelled at the same time. Many would be incredibly envious of this!

Lastly, your point about Glycine, I find rather vague..

"Glycine are also good value for money. HOWEVER - the few models that I saw recently had more problems that the ones I had in the past. I don't know why; I can only think that they are cutting corners to stay competitive"

The models you saw had more problems than the ones you owned? I struggle to understand how you identified these problems by looking whilst comparing said problems to the models you owned...

I think the biased marketing point is odd too, No one is marketing on here as far as I am aware..Simply recommending brands and models they have had positive experiences with - A chap on here pointed me in the direction of Steinhart and I bought an Ocean diver, was he a marketeer? I think not.


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## ENY55V (Mar 17, 2006)

86latour said:


> You make some very interesting (unusual) comments,
> 
> I don't think the Ford/Vauxhall analogy is particularly relevant though, my point which I thought was clear, is that many people on this forum have had positive experiences with the aforementioned brands, therefor allowing them to recommend with confidence.
> 
> ...


Hi Guys!

very much in a hurry yesterday, had to drive out of London and worried about the snow. Actually, I didn't find any. However, stuck in today, it snowed last night and we have 20cm (which is nothing comparing to some places). Anyhow, here with a cup of tea doing nothing.

May I reply to Benzowner - please! When Invicta (USA) launched their watches (just to mention one) - these were an exact replica of Rolex and Cartier, in design. So, if you take the brand name away, why not wear an Invicta instead of the Rolex? - that should save a couple of thousand pounds.

Of course we recognize cars brands under the badge name. Shall we say that there are some 40 car brands out there? I have no idea actually.

I do not know a lot about the current production but I know of a few facts (some, perhaps, out of date). PSA group = Citroen, Pegeout and Renault belong to the same Group; which means? It means that many components (chassis and engines) are shared. The VW group includes Skoda, Seat, Audi and so on. The chassis for the Phaeton or the Passat is the same as the one for the Bentley Continental GT. Fiat and GM work together and I am sure they too share components. In the "old days" old production lines from FIAT were sold to Russia too (and to wherever Lada was made) and Rover "plant" has been sold (partially) to China.

Mercedes is like Rolex. They are (sort of) independent and make loads of cars out of one single brand name. They make the Maybach but were not much interested in buying Rolls Royce or Bentley. Like BMW they spend and invest money in their own technology to build what everyone perceive to be excellent cars. Neither, in fact, are so good, in my opinion; for different reasons.

ETA (I think it was around 1985) sold their technology (old machinery) to the Russians too.

Has anyone ever looked inside a washing machine?

It can be from UK, Germany or Italy but the majority of components come from the same 2 or 3 manufacturers - change the name/brand but, they are really all the same.

With 5000 brands of watches out there - there are not many Einstein making watches.

I have been in marketing for over 30 years and they say it is difficult to sell something to a salesman. It could be because he/she knows all the tricks.

I can see and smell marketing a mile away. There is no doubt that Rolex has been and still is one of the best marketing companies in the world.

At one point I had 10 of their watches (Submariner, GMT, Daytona, Explorer, Sea-Dweller, 2 x gold, 3 x Oyster). Despite my passion for Ulysse Nardin I was a typical ambassador for Rolex. When visiting Basel watch fair I would wear my solid gold one with diamonds baguettes on the dial and - AMAZINGLY SO - it got more attention than if I would have been wearing a Patek or Vacheron (which I never owned, by the way).

Having visited Basel for well over 10 years I saw the reaction from CEO on what I was wearing at any one time and there was more attention on Rolex than any other brand.

With Rolex (and some brands) it is a little bit like smoking. You are young and want to be a poser to impress the girls. With age (girls don't look at you anymore - sadly so) and you get more sense in the head and sort of questioning - what is it all about?

In fact, I sold almost all of my Rolex watches (kept a couple for occasional posing - just in case....).

It is no coincidence that Rolex is so popular, the fact that they make around 900,000 units per annum has something to do with it. It is not just the 1,400 employees at source but the other 8,000 or so dealers out there that make a living out of it. Hence it may answer the question about - marketeers.......... (for one brand or the other).

Some of the watches that I like now, I can't really afford. I have been after the 3 Bridges and Golden Bridge for a long time (the name bridge is only coincidental and doesn't have deep suicidal meaning).

I never looked into it but why boys like: watches, pens, cars, motorbikes (not necessarily in that order)? It is more than a passion in some cases.

I see a new watch/model, I like it, I but it, I wear it for a few weeks or months and....... I go back to my Submariner and/or Citizen. The Submariner because it well battered, I know that I can swim in it and take it to the sauna, it looks "good" while, really, I couldn't give a s*** about it. The Citizen is a perpetual calendar and, a) I can actually see the date without glasses, B) **** me, the time is ALWAYS spot on (unlike to poxy Rolex).

When I recently met a friend of mine in Germany (Raphael - im Bad Homburg) I looked at a variety of watches and Glycine too. Now - he is a friend and an authorized dealer. He allowed me to play with many of his watches and, of course, we talked about the industry, brands and business in general.

I noticed extra movement within the dial when you pull the crown out on a Glycine watch. Raphael mentioned that the quality was no longer as good as it used to be and there have been more problems than in the past. He was also not so pleased about the quality of the movement. We came up with our own conclusions but, next day, I was in Sissach (here you can have the best Spaetzle mit Speck und Eie at the Sonne Restaurant - a must if in the region)

to meet my friend Ivan

Ivan worked for 20 years for the Swatch Group and for the last 20 he has been looking after "smaller brands" near the Basel region. Ivan and I know Katherina BrechbÃ¼hler (director, owner's daughter) of Glycine.

Ivan and I agreed that Glycine is a Deja Vu of marketing similar to many other brands - Breitling came to mind.

Glycine is becoming more popular (bad time too since the 'relaunch' of the new company in 1984). In 1982 Ernest Schneider launched the current Breitling brand.

In 1990 Breitling was selling watches with quartz Miyota movement for Â£900. Glycine is actually selling, these days, an automatic watch for Â£400. What do they have in common?

Then and now they are selling watches of poor quality with high margins of profits. Yes, many have the same policy (Bell & Ross and Jacob come to mind).

Glycine wants to move to new levels and now that sales have gone up it is time to invest for the future generation of models that may or may not be of good quality. A CEO friend of mine, Simon, used to work with Breitling in the 80s and his stories are no different to today's Ivan ones.

Ivan tells me that in some cases ETA are not what they used to be. The Ã©bauche can be made by ETA but the finish product can have many alternatives (even foreign). It is no coincidence that Swiss firms like ISA and Ronda have offices and production lines in China too. There are, therefore, different standards on what should be considered true Swiss made (and no manufacturer is going to tell you/us - unless you know Ivan or friends). ETA, Sellita and Claro are just the front name for something that could be very different (like in the car industry, components are shared).

When I was there Ivan took me to see a "Swiss brand?" ? - Maurice Blum (in Basel). The idea was to show me their Tourbillon movement. I really know **** all about movements but I am a good listener and eager to learn all the time. Apparently, for just below Â£2,000 (cost) the movement was actually excellent in every aspect. Problem? Well, a few in my opinion. Apart from a couple of models, the range/design is not so good. Good prices for what they are but - very much Chinese design in most of them and with Chinese movements too. All good and high quality movements but made by Sea-Gull (Tianjin). Their ST19 and ST21 an identical copy of ETA 2892 - and 2824.

The above is only part of a full basket of fruit and vegetables and it is only by talking to many insiders like Ivan and Simon that one can get an idea about one product or the other.

Speculative talks on some topics are very much pointing into promoting one brand or the other. As the famous brands have more followers (dealers) in pushing a certain brand than the other, all forums seem to agree that the best products are the Omega, Tag, Breitling, Rolex and......now, even Glyicne.

When, in 2004, Peter was selling Glycine watches, he was just about selling 120 pieces per annum. My question to the Glycine owners (and Luminox and Raymond W and Maurice Lacroix and Ebel etc. etc.) is - how many brands of watches do you actually owe so that you can compare one brand against the other?

(PS - still bored and with another hot cup of tea) - Have a great snowball day!!!!


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