# Genuine Vintage Or Old Franken?



## Smart Stig (Mar 27, 2010)

Various family members going through jewellery boxes to cash in on the current high gold price turns up this odd little vintage piece originally owned by my grandmother and possibly her mother before - an Ingersoll dial and movement in a case marked RWC Ltd, which I've only seen in Rolex (i.e. Rolex Watch Company).



















Case markings are R.W.C Ltd, and 18kt import marks for Glasgow 1926. Movement is marked "15 JEWELS SWISS" and has a decent quality engine turned finish on the plates. As well as the back cover hinging, the crystal is hinged too.










Did RWC make cases that were used by other makers or has someone long ago put the Ingersoll into a Rolex case?

Watch is a non runner at the moment - the balance won't swing at all, but even so it is not going to be going to the big crucible in the sky. Once I know a bit more, a trip to a reputable repairer is probably over due.

Any information or ideas welcomed....

Andrew


----------



## ong (Jul 31, 2008)

My wife inherited a similar watch but Gents in 9ct and un named movement or dial. Got it serviced and discovered that back in the 20s and 30s it was not uncommon for jewellers to import movements and cases separately then assemble the watches inhouse.

Allegedly the idea was to give a choice of movement and case but this is about the extent of my knowledge in the subject.

Hope of some use

Ong


----------



## chris l (Aug 5, 2005)

I believe that there were also advantages, in terms of import duty, in bringing in movements alone.


----------



## ong (Jul 31, 2008)

Yes , I seem to recall something about that. Along the lines of movements being classed as spares rather than complete units. I asked my wife about the origins of her watch and she said that her Grandad bought it in the 1930s from a 'watchmaker'in the City of London ( about where the gherkin is now. Unfortunately I don't have a picture but the movement is Rotary and the case is unidentified


----------



## Smart Stig (Mar 27, 2010)

I was aware of the import duty thing - like the old loopholes that meant you could export or import cars as "machine parts" at lower duty by removing enough bits to qualify as CKD!

Main interest is if imported RWC cases have turned up on non-Rolex or Tudor movements legitimately or if the Ingersol has been retro-fitted into a RWC case sometime early last century.

Andrew


----------



## bjohnson (Oct 2, 2007)

Smart Stig said:


> Various family members going through jewellery boxes to cash in on the current high gold price turns up this odd little vintage piece originally owned by my grandmother and possibly her mother before - an Ingersoll dial and movement in a case marked RWC Ltd, which I've only seen in Rolex (i.e. Rolex Watch Company).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I have an unmarked ladies art deco watch (neither dial nor movement is branded) in a case marked "Rolex 14K"


----------



## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

Hmmm

Rolco and Unicorn are tradenames of Rolex, they had fourty odd trade names including Oyster, tudor, can't remember the rest though i do have them written down somewhere...










John


----------



## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

Here's a list of trade names that rolex used- *Originally posted by Stan*

Archeo, Aqua, Brandcard, Brex, Cestello, Cellissima, Chronautic, Cybernaut, Danaos, Elvira, Egyptian, Genex, Imperial, Lilliputian, LON, Lonex, Marconi, Milgauss, Metropolitan, Moneda, Ondeo, Omigra, Oyster, Oysterdate, Pearlmaster, Plage, Prima, Prince Dauphin, Prince, Rolco, Rolexis, Roliseum, Rollesor, Rolwatco, Royal, Sousmarin, Space Dweller Stratosphere, Tru-beat, Tudor, Unicorn Lever, Unicorn, Viceroy, Waferthin, Wicket, W/D, X/L, Zerographe.

John


----------



## Smart Stig (Mar 27, 2010)

Ah, that seems to add up now - the movement has no name on it, but the transmission wheel matches the smaller movement ('SWISS MADE +') and the ratchet only has space for '15 JEWEL * * *'. Typeface is identical and it even has the 'Y' on the barrel plate that is on the smaller movement pictured.

Also found this yesterday on the bay of evil in their "Rolex buying guide" (while googling for something unrelated bizarrely)



> Ladies 9k gold pre-war cases are generally in 9k gold and stamped with one of the following marks: Rolex, RolWatch, W&D, RWC Ltd; Rolex 20 or 30 Records. Rarely do you find such watches in 18k gold and when offered I would recommend they are bought - excellent investments!


So I'm guessing that Ingersoll contracted Rolex to provide the watches to the UK market with their name on the dial.

It is definitely going to sent off for service now!

Thanks to all for the info :thumbup:

Andrew


----------



## Smart Stig (Mar 27, 2010)

Couple of clear dial and movement shots for future reference...



















Thanks once again...

Andrew


----------

