# Citizen/Seiko I Picked Up That I Am Absolutely In Love With... Any Oth



## Mechanical Alarm (Oct 18, 2010)

Hello All,

Just wanted to share my newest acquisition with you. Saw it and knew nothing about it - it was just love at first sight!

Received it from the UK and couldn't be much happier. Seems to be a little outward dent between 6-7 and a little scratching of the center dial that weren't mentioned but I am definitely overlooking these. They look much worse than in person. I didn't notice the scratches till later. I personally have no complaints about ordering overseas or seeing it in person (seen a lot of links to this effect). If they have a good reputation - then I have no worries.

Please check it out and feel free to offer any comments:



















Dial marked @ 12:00 position: I believe it is a stylized "*41*" or *4H*

Beneath that in stylized script is: *Citizen Alarm Date*

Then at the 6:00 position is: *PARA 40 METER*

And beneath that: *21 JEWELS*

Size: ~38 x 45mm - Looks so good!

Am I right in assuming it was made in Oct '68?? Any other info on this particular model would be greatly appreciated. Also, because I am lazy today, can someone give me a brief history about the whole Citizen/Seiko thing... just a quicky?? Thank you all!


----------



## Davey P (Sep 9, 2010)

Mechanical Alarm said:


> Also, because I am lazy today, can someone give me a brief history about the whole Citizen/Seiko thing... just a quicky?? Thank you all!


This might be a good place to start:

http://www.thewatchsite.com/index.php

Or here:

http://www.gmtplusnine.com/2008/06/07/seiko-type-ii-quartz-a-piece-of-history/

Or here:

http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/Seiko-Corporation-Company-History.html

I hope that helps mate ^_^


----------



## Mechanical Alarm (Oct 18, 2010)

Thanx Davey - I read and I read and couldn't find the Citizen/Seiko connection.

Anyone with any additional info on the Citizen Alarm Date / 41??


----------



## Morris Minor (Oct 4, 2010)

Mechanical Alarm said:


> Thanx Davey - I read and I read and couldn't find the Citizen/Seiko connection.
> 
> Anyone with any additional info on the Citizen Alarm Date / 41??


That's a nice example of a Citizen alarm - the stylised logo is in fact '4H', i.e. 4 Hands since it uses a fourth hand for setting the alarm time. Yours was made in October 1968 and uses Citizen's 3102 movements which was first produced in 1964. AFAIK this movement was produced until the early to mid-1970's and was the second version of this alarm movement. The earlier one was the 980/1 movement and had a 'cricket' case, i.e. a second outer case-back. Your version was only produced as a 21 jewel model, beating at 18,000bph. Some like yours were rated to 40m water resistance - Citizen's term for waterproof prior to about 1970 when they had to change to 'resistant', was 'Parawater - so with the 40m on the dial yours is a little bit more unusual.

The movement wasn't one of Citizen's in-house creations, it was licensed from a Swiss design and has since been used by Poljot for their alarms.

The alarm works by a small hammer striking a pin on the inside of the case back, so the snap fit back has to be located correctly to ensure this works - there's a pin to help with that though. This pic shows the movement with the hammer being the triangular-ish piece slightly overhanging the balance wheel and you can just see the pin to locate the case back at the top of the pic:










Citizen made a Custom V2 variant which is seldom seen - I managed to get one last year - not hard to guess it's from the 1970's!:










Some more examples of these alarms here:

http://seikoholics.yuku.com/sreply/376

And if you want to see where they fit in the development of Citizen's movements and models, here's a link to the movement table I've compiled:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/stephen.netherwood/Vintage%20Citizen%20Movement%20Table%20v1.5%20Secure.pdf

Morris Minor, aka Sweephand in some other places


----------



## Mechanical Alarm (Oct 18, 2010)

Hello Morris Minor... Now that's what I'm talkin' about! :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:

You are a font of information - you must be like the Citizen/Seiko guru! Great information... great links... YOU ROCK!!

The 1965 and '67 versions look identical to mine.

Thank You MM!!


----------



## Morris Minor (Oct 4, 2010)

Mechanical Alarm said:


> Hello Morris Minor... Now that's what I'm talkin' about! :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
> 
> You are a font of information - you must be like the Citizen/Seiko guru! Great information... great links... YOU ROCK!!
> 
> ...


You're very welcome  Good to see someone interested in vintage Citizens - when I started collecting them I couldn't find much info, so I decided to do some research and put some together myself.

Morris Minor aka Sweephand in some other places


----------

