# Raketa Finally Coming Good?



## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

They'll probably be pretty damn expensive, but all kudos to Raketa for finally designing some new and interesting models. What does everyone think? Pretty tempted by the Amphibia here.


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## luckywatch (Feb 2, 2013)

I am not a fan of the modern stuff that comes out of Russia today except for Vostok. I do like that first one but as you say probably silly money and not worth it. IMO.


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

luckywatch said:


> I am not a fan of the modern stuff that comes out of Russia today


 I have to say that generally I'm not a big fan either. I've been pretty critical in the past of the new Raketas but this stuff actually looks very good both in design and quality. 500ish Euros (just a guess) for a Russian watch might seem expensive but if these were Swiss watches they'd probably be considered good value for money.


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## Rotundus (May 7, 2012)

could russian be the new japanese ?


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

they look ok but i would like to see prices first


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## taffyman (Apr 26, 2011)

Silly money i bet !!! H


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

The more I look into these watches the more impressed I get. Raketa have been employing a number of ex-Rolex personnel and have now made a brand new in-house 28800 bph COSC automatic movement (including manufacturing their own hairspring) which will be installed in these watches.

Still no idea of prices, but if this was a Western European company who had made a watch with an in-house COSC movement for less than Â£1000, people would be falling over themselves to say what a bargain it was.


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

the miyota 9015 movement is a 28800 bph and you can buy those for 30 odd quid so maybe these are going to be around the 200 to 250 quid mark the same as the obris morgan watches


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

chris.ph said:


> the miyota 9015 movement is a 28800 bph and you can buy those for 30 odd quid so maybe these are going to be around the 200 to 250 quid mark the same as the obris morgan watches


 The 9105 isn't COSC though. I reckon they're going to be around the Â£750 mark personally.


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

Lampoc said:


> They'll probably be pretty damn expensive, but all kudos to Raketa for finally designing some new and interesting models. What does everyone think? Pretty tempted by the Amphibia here.


I like that one & might consider getting one if the price was reasonable - ie cheap enough :wink2:


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

It's not going to be cheap and it's the Swiss owned the brand. Can't be bother looking for the thread where they announced in here the new company and probably the the only time I was seriously pissed off at something posted here. Along with the announcement there was a statement that every single Raketa on ebay was a fake as there was no way that a watch could cost US$60 or something like that. Well, not with the Swiss they don't. Pretty rotten attitude as usual and, just for that, I wouldn't buy anything from them but that's just my silly feud.

And I agree that the Miyota 9015 is the best mainstream auto movement out there on value for money and reliability, be it COSC or not. One of the things that makes it automaticaly not COSC is that it is Japanese, so doesn't matter how accurate it is or how well it can be regulated. Even if something runs at +/-1 second, if it isn't Swiss, it can never get the COSC certification.


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

I remember the Raketa thread well because it also seriously pissed me off too. I've been very critical of them here and on WuS but mainly because of the rehashed models with ancient 2609 movements being sold for frankly ludicrous amounts of money. However, with this new movement and watches they're finally beginning to win me over.

Yes, they're owned by a Swiss guy and have employed some highly experienced Swiss watchmakers but that's the way of the world nowadays. Plenty of Swiss brands are now owned by Chinese companies. At least production remains in Russia and they're making a serious effort - when was the last all new Russian movement produced? For Raketa it was 1966... They are also investing heavily in the future and now run the only watchmaking school in Russia.

I say good luck to them - as long as that moron who described older watches as "fakes" keeps well away from the forums!

Oh yeah - they also have some great adverts


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

does that mean my world timers are fake :tongue2: :tongue2: :lol: :lol:


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

chris.ph said:


> does that mean my world timers are fake :tongue2: :tongue2: :lol: :lol:


According to their wide brush statement, yes.


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

Lampoc said:


> Yes, they're owned by a Swiss guy and have employed some highly experienced Swiss watchmakers but that's the way of the world nowadays. Plenty of Swiss brands are now owned by Chinese companies. At least production remains in Russia and they're making a serious effort - when was the last all new Russian movement produced? For Raketa it was 1966... They are also investing heavily in the future and now run the only watchmaking school in Russia.


That I didn't know. So it's this auto movement a completely original, in-house movement?


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

Kutusov said:


> That I didn't know. So it's this auto movement a completely original, in-house movement?


 Apparently so, although they haven't released too many details yet. Raketa are now also trying to muscle in on the Swiss hairspring market now that Nivarox are declaring their intentions to reduce supplies. Here's the blurb from their website:

"For the first time, â€œRaketaâ€ has produced a hairspring with a 28800 frequency! This new spiral will soon obtain the prestigious COSC certificate (Official Swiss Chronometer Testing Institute).

Jeanâ€"Claude Quenet, exâ€"director of the â€œRolexâ€ hairspring department, has said that â€œRaketaâ€™sâ€ spiral should soon be ready for sale in Switzerland.

â€œSwatch Groupâ€ (â€œNivaroxâ€) is today in a monopoly situation, suplying most swiss brands with its hairspring.

â€œSwatch Groupâ€ announced the termitation of the supply of such components to other firms, which will lead to a shortage in supply for many major Swiss brands not producing their own hairspring. â€œRaketaâ€ will soon be able to help these Swiss watch brands. Escapement 28.800 beats per hour."


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## Mutley (Apr 17, 2007)

mach 0.0013137 said:


> I like that one & might consider getting one if the price was reasonable - ie cheap enough :wink2:


What Mac said :yes:


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

Ah, I was forgetting about that COSC thing. Well, if they are going to get that certificate for this new "Russian" movement, that just shows it is not Russian at all. The COSC certificate is only applied to Swiss made movements and that does mean that the movements have to be made in Switzerland only. So production doesn't remain in Russia, at least when it comes to movements. Case, dials, etc and assembly might be done there and that might be kind of good for Russia as it means more jobs but it's kind of like Apple going to China to assemble the IPhone. I mean, it's also investing the high-tech resources in Switzerland (and I recognize that when it comes to hairsprings that's where the factories are) and keeping Russian labour that is certainly cheaper than Switzerland.

I do hope that my reasoning is completely wrong though...


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

lampoc empty your pms mate ive a question for you


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

chris.ph said:


> lampoc empty your pms mate ive a question for you


 Done!


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

cheers matey, message sent :thumbup:


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

Kutusov said:


> Ah, I was forgetting about that COSC thing. Well, if they are going to get that certificate for this new "Russian" movement, that just shows it is not Russian at all. The COSC certificate is only applied to Swiss made movements and that does mean that the movements have to be made in Switzerland only. So production doesn't remain in Russia, at least when it comes to movements.


 I've honestly no idea how they're doing this despite doing quite a lot of research (I'm laid-up with a dodgy arm right now so have nothing better to do  ). They're certainly making their own movements. Raketa is now owned by a Swiss Count so there must be a loophole somewhere....


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

Lampoc said:


> (I'm laid-up with a dodgy arm right now so have nothing better to do  ). They're certainly making their own movements. Raketa is now owned by a Swiss Count so there must be a loophole somewhere....


Sorry about your arm, hope it gets better soon.

Well, I won't bother to look into this then, if you couldn't find anything, I also wouldn't be able to. I guess we'll have to wait and see.


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

Kutusov said:


> Sorry about your arm, hope it gets better soon.


More importantly, which Russian watch do you think would go best with my arm?


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

Lampoc said:


>


Holy cow! That looks nasty! Well, I guess a Navy Vostok could work, the blue dial would match the blue stitchings :lol:


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## chris.ph (Dec 29, 2011)

christ,which one of the sac cooks sowed you up


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## luckywatch (Feb 2, 2013)

You want a large bund on that one mate.


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## Draygo (Mar 18, 2010)

Lampoc said:


> ...I'm laid-up with a dodgy arm right now ...


Having seen the photos, I think this qualifies as the understatement of the day.









Hope it's not as sore as it looks and here's to a speedy recovery!


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## ETCHY (Aug 3, 2004)

Bloody hell, hope the arm gets better soon  . I like the first Raketa shown but have you noticed the dial on it isn't quite centred relative to the inner chapter ring, doesn't suggest great quality control. - Cheers Dave


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

ETCHY said:


> I like the first Raketa shown but have you noticed the dial on it isn't quite centred relative to the inner chapter ring, doesn't suggest great quality control. - Cheers Dave


 I think the first picture might be a drawing/photoshop rather than an actual watch?


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## Chascomm (Sep 9, 2005)

Kutusov said:


> That I didn't know. So it's this auto movement a completely original, in-house movement?


Well it's in-house at least. They originally announced that they would be reviving the auto-winding variants of the standard Raketa movements, and this one looks just like the old 2616 and 2627 but with some very tasty new decoration applied. Do they really state that this one is beating at 28,800bph? I find that hard to believe.

Amongst their early announcements was also a mention of the 3031 alarm. I wonder what happened with that? Serious intention, or just an remark intended to win over those of us old-school enthusiasts who'd been pissed off by the "fakes" thing?


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

Chascomm said:


> Amongst their early announcements was also a mention of the 3031 alarm. I wonder what happened with that? Serious intention, or just an remark intended to win over those of us old-school enthusiasts who'd been pissed off by the "fakes" thing?


I haven't even bothered to look this through as it all seems like rumours and intentions to me. They like to talk big and, so far, I have a pet dislike for them because of that. So, bearing that in mind, main springs and stuff like that is something really hard and expensive to develop from scratch. They might do it in Switzerland, as all the factories are there. But what else can you really do? Fit that new spring in an old design or come up with a new one?

They could pick the old tooling and start producing the same thing but adapting or coming up with an entirely new version is incredibly difficult and would mean a massive investment with many years to get a return. And only if they started to sell as much as Seiko or Citizen or the Swatch group.

So I don't know... either there is a way to fit the new spring into those oldy fake movements and get the same thing with a high beat for a terribly higher price (oh, but it is decorated...) or it's just a bunch or horse manure. Either way, and if they go through it, it's clear from the COSC thing it will be at most a Swiss movement cased in Russia. And I dooubt that very much. What would be the market? How well is Volmax doing with their Valjoux chronos that they've just released a full range of quartz movement watches - including a quartz Strela  - because no one will be spending the same money as a Longines, Fortis, etc on an Aviator.

Oh, I love to have a new petty hate for someone, now that I take everything I've said in the past about Juri Levemberg back. As far as I see it, he and Vostok are the only ones that still care about Russian watches. Oh, and Moscow Classic too but I think there's some connection between them and JL.


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## Lampoc (Oct 31, 2010)

The plot thickens! I guess I'll reserve judgement until the watches are finally released.


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## Kutusov (Apr 19, 2010)

They don't have any sort of newsletter, do they? I was looking through the site and could find any subscription thingy...


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