# Tools Of The Trade In The Past



## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

I was up in the loft a few days ago looking for a watch that I knew was buried in some box or other, and found some of the tools of my trade, long since superseded by fancy GPS instruments, portable analysers and hand held computers or in some instances combined GPS/Computer, plotters and a myriad of proprietary software.

It makes me feel old looking at them :biggrin:

Some examples below

The Brunton Compass - Clinometer, fixed on a tripod you could use it to create quite an accurate a map and it was also used hand held for traversing and measuring strike and dip of rock structures. Still used but not anywhere near as extensively as it was. These days you can get a GPS compass clinometer computer which records the position, dip and strike of the rock outcrop and allows you to not only photograph the outcrop but to record the rock type.
























Next is the Frieberg Compass - made in East Germany originally it was used primarily for recording strike, dip and linear elements in the field a lot quicker than using the Brunton, I used this compass most often due to working in structurally complicated terrain.
























Pedometer made in West Germany and surprisingly accurate on easy ground once you had set it up










Plastic field cards, all this data and more would be on your handheld computer now










Douglas Protractor - brilliant piece of kit for when you are drawing you map at the end of the day










HP 11C Calculator - Reverse Polish Notation and pretty standard kit in the early 1980's










Slide rule and unit converter

I had the slide rule at school but did use it for work until I got the HP11C, I had a couple of unit convertors lying around my desk which were good for quick reference.


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## jsud2002 (Nov 7, 2015)

Can I ask was your trade a surveyor ? I started straight from scgool at 16 as a chain man and progressed up the line and ended up a project manager surveyor in Hong Kong and Mayalsia from 94-98


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

JoT said:


> It makes﻿﻿﻿﻿ me feel old look﻿ing at the﻿﻿m :biggrin:


 What ? To me that's state of the art technology.

Still use one of these regularly. Through habit.










and "trig" tables.


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

jsud2002 said:


> Can I ask was your trade a surveyor ? I started straight from scgool at 16 as a chain man and progressed up the line and ended up a project manager surveyor in Hong Kong and Mayalsia from 94-98


 I work in the mining industry and spent part of my career as a field geologist, this kit dates from then, there is a bit of crossover as we regularly used things like plane tables, optical squares, levels etc but for regional mapping we only needed to be accurate to a few metres and for more detailed work we would normally cut and peg surveyed lines. Surveying is also a much changed trade, when I did a surveying module at university we had transit theodolites with vernier scales as the prof insisted it was the only way to learn theory before he let us anywhere neat optical theodolites, the total station was treated like a priceless artifact :biggrin:

Modern kit is amazing from what I have seen.


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## pauluspaolo (Feb 24, 2003)

Love this especially the Brunton compass - not sure I'd know really what to do it, or how to use it properly, but it looks a superb bit of kit. I don't have anything as fancy at work I'm afraid but I do use vernier calipers fairly regularly to accurately measure things. Being a science techie I get to play with sciencey stuff - a replacement for our ageing Van der Graaf generator being the latest toy


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## jsud2002 (Nov 7, 2015)

@JoT i Quit the surveying in 2000 got fed up of the stress and working outdoors in the rain.


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## vinn (Jun 14, 2015)

several years ago I bought a K&E "mountain transit" from a major surveying outfit, to survey "line of sight" path. I think its a coal miners transit as it could secured to the mine roof and read right side up. later on I bought a proper transit. the market is still flooded with them when surveying went to GPS and anyone could use it. vin


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> What ? To me that's state of the art technology.
> 
> Still use one of these regularly. Through habit.
> 
> ...


 That brings memories back.mine was a 1974 edition and I had it till 2009 when some g1t pinched it at a small sub contract engineering firm.

Still got all my old mikes, and calipres and I've even got a small pot of engineers blue that's nearly 40 years old

Ps. That's a nought to one on the cover.


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## Always"watching" (Sep 21, 2013)

My dear @JoT, I just have to say what a marvellous thread-head you have posted. I love the pictures of those instruments, and I reckon that putative watch designers could usefully take a look at the Brunton compass-clinometer and Frieberg compass - they are really nice. I also like your German pedometer, and I myself have a few pedometers in my collection, which bear scrunity in comparison with watch designs. :thumbsup:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

@Turpinr

@WRENCH










I still use one of these every day. Not the watch by the way.


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

BondandBigM said:


> @Turpinr
> 
> @WRENCH
> 
> ...


 I still put two 6" rules in the ruler pocket of my overalls but rarely need.

Outside mikes, bowyers gauges and a depth vernier these days.

I doubt i could read (or see) an imperial vernier caliper these days


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

Engineers marking blue


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Turpinr said:


> I still put two 6" rules in the ruler pocket of my overalls but rarely need.
> 
> Outside mikes, bowyers gauges and a depth vernier these days.
> 
> I doubt i could read (or see) an imperial vernier caliper these days


 It's actually not a ruler in that pic but it does measure something.

Any guesses ??

:biggrin:



















In my occasional work on the tools these days other than some of the tools, micrometers and verniers being digital nothing much has changed in forty odd years.

In fact some of the kit we use is probably that old.

:laugh: :laugh:


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

BondandBigM said:


> It's actually not a ruler in that pic but it does measure something.
> 
> Any guesses ??
> 
> ...


 A set square?

Is that a stubby bowyers gauge and i recognise the scale on yon boring bar



Turpinr said:


> A set square?
> 
> Is that a stubby bowyers gauge and i recognise the scale on yon boring bar


 I priced up a digital 0-25 about 15 years ago and it was £200ish


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

BondandBigM said:


> @Turpinr
> 
> @WRENCH
> 
> ...


 When I started out, first part of the training was precision toolmaking. There was the mandatory bully, I fixed his results by taking 1/2 a mm of the end of his rule. :laughing2dw: When I moved house recently, I emptied my workshop of all my old measuring gear, not much value in it.  Kept my Britool Torque wrenches, a Starret micrometer, a vernier, and my intact Rabone rules.

Always a favourite source.


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## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

I love tools and using them, Not for my job but I have a few lathes to play with as a hobby, Trouble is the only one that's set up for use is an old flat cone pulley type that has wear in the bed, It's calle a Faircut Senior and was made by Hendersons of Sheffield, They make a sauce now called Hendersons Relish or Hendo's for short!!



















This is the old Faircut!










1953 Myford 7










Granville Senior (Also around 1953)..

Little Wade










Even smaller Flexispeed 7










Even even smaller Super Adept!!










I've a few more lathes but they're more like toys!!

John


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

@johnbaz Great stuff John, I am envious!


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## vinn (Jun 14, 2015)

John; nice collection, good show! are those leather belts? i have a 6 inch Logan , belt drive and gear change feed. vin


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## al_kaholik (May 22, 2018)

I'd love to get into machining but space is a premium as always. Besides which it would probably mean more hobbies get put on the back burner. Certainly a lathe and a mill/CNC would be very helpful for my bigger 'project'


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

@Turpinr

The small scale is for measuring flatness, we sell a lot of plate with pre machined weld preps and there is a flatness tolerance for the plate, usually around a couple of millimetres.

So a big straight edge then use the small graduated wedge. One side is metric and one side is imperial.



















Inside mics and DTI's haven't changed


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

BondandBigM said:


> @Turpinr
> 
> The small scale is for measuring flatness, we sell a lot of plate with pre machined weld preps and there is a flatness tolerance for the plate, usually around a couple of millimetres.
> 
> ...


 Clock and bases never change do they. I don't use then often these days, sadly.

I don't know about you but i always check Inside mikes in case someone's been over tightening them and they're not set properly.

Then there's the one's who check OD's with an outside and have them squeaking they're so tight :swoon:


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## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

vinn said:


> John; nice collection, good show! are those leather belts? i have a 6 inch Logan , belt drive and gear change feed. vin


 Hi Vinn

It was originally a leather belt but it broke so one of our fitters gave me the stuff that's fitted, It's some kind of vulcanised braid, It's stiffer due to being almost double the thickness of the leather one, It was a bit awkward fastening the clawed fittings on to the end that takes the pin to join the ends together!!

The Logan sounds nice :notworthy:

John :thumbsup:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

@johnbaz

Back in the day around the time when I visited your Super Gun factory on a regular basis we picked up a contract to do some testing for Rolls Royce Derby.

This involved cylindrical grinding so I bought a couple of grinders from Myford. Their works, like yours, was like stepping back into the 50's, proper old school that you just don't see these days.

But they had moved with the times while still manufacturing their small trade mark bench top lathes.


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

BondandBigM said:


> @johnbaz
> 
> Back in the day around the time when I visited your Super Gun factory on a regular basis we picked up a contract to do some testing for Rolls Royce Derby.
> 
> ...


 My favourite small grinding m/cs are Jones and Shipman surface grinders which are little jewels imo.

I always liked Matrix Churchill External (cylindrical) grinders too.

One of the Churchills i worked on was 70+ years old, mind you the bed was bu66ered so i had to keep casings the taper.


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## vinn (Jun 14, 2015)

johnbaz said:


> Hi Vinn
> 
> It was originally a leather belt but it broke so one of our fitters gave me the stuff that's fitted, It's some kind of vulcanised braid, It's stiffer due to being almost double the thickness of the leather one, It was a bit awkward fastening the clawed fittings on to the end that takes the pin to join the ends together!!
> 
> ...


 John; leather worked for years. now its time move on. the flat side of cog belts, would be a good replacement. i'll work on that. vin


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

When I first started as chippy on the buildings, everyone used a 'Yankee' spiral screwdriver which you pushed down on to screw in the fixing.










Nowadays, we all use impact drivers to do the same job, but much faster.


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

As an addendum to the above (and because I couldn't take any pics 'till today) here are some old tools that I made when I worked at Compair BroomWade, the compressor makers back in the seventies. Working in the maintainance dept., there were always slack periods, and we would make our own tools up from bits of scrap that were lying around.

Three screwdrivers...the top one has a handle made from a piece of aluminium bar, turned and knurled on a lathe. The shaft is a piece of mild steel rod with a bit holder brazed onto it. The second one also has an ally handle, but I fluted this one in a milling machine, before turning. The last one is a T bar screwdriver for applying extra torque, made out of mild steel again.










Next are a couple of home made tap wrenches, large and small. We fitters all had our own versions.










A surface scraper for removing old bits of gasket from mating surfaces, made out of an old file with a piece of tungsten carbide brazed to the end. We used to get the tool grinders to sharpen these on their diamond grinding wheels. Below is a key drift, also made out of an old file (file steel is good for making tools as it's hard). This was used to remove the key that held a wheel or pulley on a shaft. You put the pointed end between the key end and the pulley hub and tapped it with a hammer to remove the key.










A home made drill stand (imperial) made out of a block of aluminium.










Finally, an unusual one. There used to be a couple of old submariners who looked after the boilers, and one of them showed me one of these tools that he still used at work. It's a wheel valve wrench, used to tighten and loosen wheel valves. It will fit several sizes of valve, and is a really simple piece of kit. I made this one in the welding shop, heating and bending the steel rod to get the right shape on an anvil.



















We don't have any large wheel valves here, but I found a smaller one to show how it works in principle. The hook goes over one of the wheel spokes, and the short end bears on the rim to give really good leverage.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Roger the Dodger said:


> as an﻿ addendum to the above (and because I couldn't take any pics 'till today) here are some ol﻿d tools that I made when I worked at Compair BroomWade, the compressor makers back in﻿ the seventies. Working in the maintainance dept., there were always slack periods, and we woul﻿d make o﻿ur own t﻿ools up fro﻿m bits of sc﻿rap that ﻿were ly﻿ing ar﻿ound﻿.


 One of the sad things from my recent house move was having to get rid of chests full of this stuff, I Had the same home made tap wrenches, screwdrivers etc. Roller cabs full of heavy plant tools, torque multipliers, and so on.

Any of you guys that's worked offshore know what this is ?










Makes a great paperweight. :laughing2dw:


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## GaryH (Nov 8, 2006)

Roger the Dodger said:


> When I first started as chippy on the buildings, everyone used a 'Yankee' spiral screwdriver which you pushed down on to screw in the fixing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Yankee ratchet spiral screwdrivers are really quite collectable . I recently bought a NOS model 130 from eBay sealed in pack from the 1980s. Great quality. Of course impact drivers for speed but Yankees seemed like witchcraft back in the day.

Gary


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

WRENCH said:


> One of the sad things from my recent house move was having to get rid of chests full of this stuff, I Had the same home made tap wrenches, screwdrivers etc. Roller cabs full of heavy plant tools, torque multipliers, and so on.
> 
> Any of you guys that's worked offshore know what this is ?
> 
> ...


 I'll go with a gear out of a ball valve ???


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

BondandBigM said:


> I'﻿ll go w﻿ith a gear﻿ out of a b﻿all val﻿ve ??? ﻿﻿


 Phosphor bronze drive gear out of an air driven RMO pipe cutter, where all components were designed not to cause sparks. These gears wore out really quick, and were always charged out as a consumable when on hire, which always caused arguments with contractors, so I kept this one as keepsake, as a memory of many arguments. :laughing2dw:


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## Robti (May 19, 2017)

Roger the Dodger said:


> When I first started as chippy on the buildings, everyone used a 'Yankee' spiral screwdriver which you pushed down on to screw in the fixing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Still have my Yankee somewhere, still has a jubilee clip on it to stop it rolling away from you, I was proud as punch when I first got it


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Robti said:


> Still﻿﻿ have﻿ my Yankee somewhere, still has a jubilee clip on it to stop it rolling away from you, I ﻿was ﻿proud﻿ a﻿s pu﻿n﻿ch wh﻿en I fi﻿rst g﻿ot﻿ it﻿


 Never a problem with a flat battery either. :yes:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

WRENCH said:


> Phosphor bronze drive gear out of an air driven RMO pipe cutter, where all components were designed not to cause sparks. These gears wore out really quick, and were always charged out as a consumable when on hire, which always caused arguments with contractors, so I kept this one as keepsake, as a memory of many arguments. :laughing2dw:


 Chopped the ends off a few pipes in my day, did a stint here when we had the contract for testing the seam welds of the finished pipes.










No phosphor bronze gears though

:laugh: :laugh:

Just good old fashionable hand held burning torches although latterly we upgraded and they were attached to a robot not unlike this.










We have a few robots where I'm working now. Both gas cutting and welding set ups.


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

Just found these in the shed. I've had them 40 odd years and they weren't new when i got them


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## Steve D UK (Sep 28, 2016)

Roger the Dodger said:


> When I first started as chippy on the buildings, everyone used a 'Yankee' spiral screwdriver which you pushed down on to screw in the fixing.


 Two days before I got married I was still fitting a new chipboard floor in a house we had bought. No electric screwdrivers then so I bought a a Yankee. I was doing it right up to midnight and I ended up with the biggest blister you've ever seen on the palm of a hand. It was the Yankee I tell ya!


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

Hughes Noble firefighting branch used in the late 1960's, 1970's and into the 1980's, probably still a few on-the-run now here and there

Maximum 1" aperture and the ability to have a spray at the same time, difficult to adjust under pressure though, the earlier versions were painted differently; red (port) on the spray control to indicate turn to left for on and green (starboard) on the jet control to indicate turn right for on. This later version was from when Hughes Engineering who made the original branches was sold I think to Galena Fire Engineering. I keep meaning to strip it down and paint it red and green with a black body.


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## Teg62x (Dec 28, 2016)

When I did my apprenticeship. :thumbs_up:


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## spinynorman (Apr 2, 2014)

Broadening the scope a little from penknives, I also have this, a multi-tool set with a selection of 9 awls and screwdriver heads, any 5 of which can fit in the handle, along with a saw and hammer that screw onto the top. No identifying marks on any of it, just "Pat. applied for".


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## Biker (Mar 9, 2013)

portable woodworking kit


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

spinynorman said:


> Broadening the scope a little from penknives, I also have this, a multi-tool set with a selection of 9 awls and screwdriver heads, any 5 of which can fit in the handle, along with a saw and hammer that screw onto the top. No identifying marks on any of it, just "Pat. applied for".


 What a brilliant piece of kit, definitely portable woodworking tools

I moved it to this thread, a better fit


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## Karrusel (Aug 13, 2016)

Plenty of old tools knocking about Karrusel Towers 

...not just watches!









































































:biggrin:


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

Karrusel said:


> Plenty of old tools knocking about Karrusel Towers
> 
> ...not just watches!


 Well I know what the first two are...the top pic is a pair of turfing irons...used to slide under, and lift turf. We had some of these on the estate when I worked there. The second pic is a draw knife, usually used in conjunction with a shave horse to make all manner of wooden items from thatching spars to wheel spokes, besom handles etc.


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## chocko (Nov 9, 2008)

These are the sort of tools I have been working with for the past 51 years.





Sorry for double photo


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

chocko said:


>


 Wow! Some serious skill there! :notworthy: Though the two inscriptions to your right made me irreverently smile.


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

chocko said:


> These are the sort of tools I have been working with for the past 51 years.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Brilliant, that's some skill :yes:


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

At the end of my 5th Form year at school the headmaster gave me this set of BWC drawing instruments in a pigskin and chamois leather folding case. He was given it by the widow of a retired Royal Engineer with instructions to give it to a pupil who would make good use of it. I had done well in my "O" Level mock exam in Engineering Drawing so I was chosen.

I have used them for the last 48 years both at work and personally, although I no longer use the ink pens or attachments, so I think I did the old boy and his widow credit. The set dates from around WW2 and was made by BWC i.e. British Watch Cases Ltd who must have been tasked to produce instruments for the forces. After the war sets also found their way to newly nationalised industries. BWC didn't make them for long as the design and quality, while adequate for war, were a long way behind the quality of instruments produced post war.


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## Ugg10 (Nov 26, 2020)

Call that a spanner ?










Used on this -


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

"Fag Packet" drawings.

Most recently I'm a one man machine shop with a lathe and a couple of milling machines and from the main fabrication shop they are still bringing me barely legible fag packet scribbles.

Bond can you make me half a dozen of these.

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:


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## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

The foundry I working was all heavy stuff and only iron and steel but when the boss man had gone home at 4pm, We got stuck in and got our work done double sharp then started making moulds to pour molten brass or aluminium into, We melted it with the burning tackle and use an iron sample spoon to pour, We also had a small crucible and shank stowed for anything a bit larger!!

We used to make these kind of things!










This is what we did when we had to work, A 3' HiLo oxy propane cutter provided the heat and an oxygen lance moved the metal..

This job was solid, It took around four cuts to get it to the size and shape required (Which was like a funnel shape!).. The centre was pierced and cut then pulled out with the crane, We were halfway through the second cut in this pic..










This is the piece that was pulled out with the crane from the centre, My old mate was pointing at it, Sort of like 'Crocodile Mick Dundee when he was pointing at his boat! :laughing2dw:










This was the job before we started piercing it but after we'd removed the head (riser), It's a cast node for the offshore oilrigs..










Something a bit bigger..










This is a Chicago Pneumatics air hammer, We had a few of these to clean the castings as clean steel cut better than steel with sand covering it, Some jobs would take a week to clean with the CP hammers and that's with four bods on it doing twelve hour shifts!, I think there were so many whitefinger claims and carpol tunnel syndrome claims going in that they got us a couple of five ton excavators with peckers permenantly fitted, The cleaning time was reduced massively!!










The castings usually came from the pits almost fully covered in sand, Certain ones came out very clean apart from the necks where we had to cut them :wacko:










Starting a cut on a large roll housing..










John :thumbsup:


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## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

A few more old tools

I like finding old stuff at the bootsales and cleaning them up, Most of these came from the bootsale (Not the anvil though!)














































Many many years ago (42 or 43 years) I used to drive one of the 'orrible things in the light railway foundry, It's a speed slinger!, A green sand mix is fed to the slinging head by conveyors, The slinger head is spinning at high speed and picks up the sand and throws it down hard so that it compresses in to the aluminium moulds, A dopey fella stuck a shovel under one day to get some sand, It snapped the shovel and almost removed his fingers!! :yes:

The vibration from the machine was so bad that it made my legs itch like crazy, Couldn't help but scratch them like mad at the end of the shift and make them bleed!!, The seat was like a tractor seat with no cushioning at all, Just pressed steel!

It had a joystick like a helicopter to move around and was raised and lowered by hydraulics!










John :thumbsup:


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

Maybe we should have a vintage work and commercial vehicles thread :yes:


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## eezy (Apr 13, 2018)

johnbaz said:


> A few more old tools


 I've got 30 or 40 old black iron OE spanners, mainly machine spanners that were handed down when I was a kid. I used to carry half a dozen when I was mobile and if I was stuck for a particular size to fit a truck or plant I ground the odd one out to fit. Some of them are about 2 inches across the jaws.

I'm at a time of life when I need to start clearing out this sort of stuff but I can't even give them away. Only thing I can think they are useful for is forging into artwork.


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## Always"watching" (Sep 21, 2013)

This continues to be a fascinating thread. I love the pics and personal anecdotes, so as far as this thread is concerned, just "keep on trucking". :thumbsup:


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

It's interesting in the fact that I never thought of taking pictures of my tools for nostalgic reasons. When I stopped working on heavy plant I sold off/gave away everything, including things like mechanical torque multipliers, and flogging spanners etc, etc, plus factory branded tools from the likes of Caterpillar, Komatsu, and old school diesel pump and injector tools and test rigs, which I suppose will now become collectables.


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## Hotbulb (Jan 1, 2020)

I did 5 years at college as part of my apprenticeship as a tool maker when I left school including ga final year at night school learning CNC programming at 21 years of age I was taking home £100 a week ,gave it all up to go and work for my father who paid me almost double to go and dig holes and build Children's play grounds , 35 years later I'm still digging holes and building play grounds , it's quite sad that the engineering industry in this country has become almost non existent and the pay has never reflected the skills required


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Hotbulb said:


> it's quite sad that the engineering industry in this country has become almost non existent and the pay has never reflected the skills required


 I'm not so sure about that, there are still plenty of smaller specialist engineer works around my way and they are busier than ever, not withstanding the Pandemic I've rarely been out of work and whilst you can't name your price if you know what your doing you can still make a decent couple of quid.


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## Hotbulb (Jan 1, 2020)

BondandBigM said:


> I'm not so sure about that, there are still plenty of smaller specialist engineer works around my way and they are busier than ever, not withstanding the Pandemic I've rarely been out of work and whilst you can't name your price if you know what your doing you can still make a decent couple of quid.
> 
> It's good to hear that you are still making a decent living , Yes agree there's lots of smaller specialist engineers still around I use a few myself but what I was getting at there has been a big decline in the larger engineering firms especially around here , some have moved production out to Eastern Europe and obviously there's China forcing prices down making them non competitive and forcing closure , even when I was at college in the mid eighties our class numbers were struggling to make numbers enough to run the courses and had to be moved to another college back in the days if the old YTS schemes earning £25 a week , but that's all there was at the time.
> 
> we had lots of big shops locally back in the eighties and nineties that have all now disappeared, their old premises have been built on , made into trading estates or converted into luxury flats especially along the harbour , my old firm got bought Out and moved by Howden Wade blowers which also disappeared many years ago , both premises are now office blocks and storage units which seems to be a ever growing industry


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## sabailand (May 28, 2010)

johnbaz said:


> John :thumbsup:


 From the film 'Alien'. 

[IMG alt="alien-engineers-1979.jpg" data-ratio="70.13"]https://nofspodcast.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/alien-engineers-1979.jpg[/IMG]


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## Alpha550t (Mar 31, 2020)

sabailand said:


> From the film 'Alien'.


 I thought the same, but didn't expect anyone else to !


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

This must come under tools of the trade. The "forked stick" is called a "Tang" and the 'Bucket" which has a sealed glass bottom to it is called a "Jug". The Man in the film stayed a couple of miles away from me at one time, and whenever I saw him fishing the Tay, more often than not, he'd be on a bicycle as transport too and from. "The last pearl fisher" claim is nonsense. My great friend fished right up to the 1990's when it eventually became illegal, and he gifted his gear to the Kelvin Grove Museum in Glasgow, where it has remained on display. The shot in the film of the jewellers would have been Cairncross in Perth, who until recently were a Rolex AD.

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/cBr4XR6uoPY?feature=oembed

I remember meeting a Welsh man fishing north of Inverness in the early 1990's and he was using a traditional Coracle, and gave me a shot of it, and I could do nothing with it. :laughing2dw:

Another interesting fact;

Famous wildlife cameraman/photographer started his early career filming and fishing with Bill Abernethy.

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/W2UqwX1mIiI?feature=oembed

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/17904313.doug-allens-life-lens/


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## Always"watching" (Sep 21, 2013)

Absolutely fascinating, dear @WRENCH. :thumbsup:

I had pretty much assumed that freshwater pearls all came from abroad. I wonder if British freshwater pearls had a price premium on them when these British pearl fisherman were out there fishing, rather like Welsh or Scottish gold does over "ordinary" gold.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Always said:


> Absolutely fascinating, dear @WRENCH. :thumbsup:
> 
> I had pretty much assumed that freshwater pearls all came from abroad. I wonder if British freshwater pearls had a price premium on them when these British pearl fisherman were out there fishing, rather like Welsh or Scottish gold does over "ordinary" gold.


 British pearls have been coveted since Roman times.










This is "Little Willie" reputedly the largest pearl taken from the Tay.


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## Ming The Merciless (4 mo ago)

I'm really surprised to see so many fellow engineers on the site. We must be doing better than I thought. That tin of " bedding blue " brought back some memories. I sold all my scrapers including an electric " Biax " mottler/featherer when I retired. One bloke contacted me - he said " I don't want to buy the Biax mate, I just wondered if you wanted to do some work using it ? " I said " No thanks, why do you think I'm selling it ? "

Regards, Ming.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Here's another blast, the Oxford Allen Scythe,

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/bRDFEJJ_vtI?feature=oembed

Still a very competent machine in todays world, but totally dangerous. :laughing2dw:

I've used these regularly, and also bought and sold them, usually after adapting them to take a modern 4 stroke Honda or Kohler engine, so you didn't get gassed. They are amazing things, and will climb the side of a house.

They came with an array of optional attachments, some of them shown here;

https://heritagemachines.com/nostalgia/the-adaptable-allen-scythe/


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

johnbaz said:


> Back in the late 1970's I worked at a bar/wire turning/Peeling/reeling company called Sanderson Kaysers here in Sheffield, When we used to transport the products through the bays we had a small but very heavy three wheel maching for towing the trailors, We were told it was originally for pulling bombs on airfields during the war, It was similar to this pic I found but had no roof, Was shorter with all the wheels hidden inside the body work, The bodywork was very heavy at around 10 or 11mm thick and must have been formed by drop stamp or a press as it was way too thick to be shaped on an English wheel!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 When I worked at Compair BroomWade back in the 70s, we had several diesel Lister auto trucks for carting our maintenance gear around on. The motor unit was basically a diesel engine mounted over a single wheel and was steered by a large handlebar the width of the engine. This was coupled to a low flatbed trailer. They were lethal things to start... you flipped the decompression lever to open, turned the engine over with a large and heavy cast iron handle to build up speed and then flipped the decompression lever over. Hopefully, the engine started, but there was always the risk of it misfiring and flinging the handle off at high speed. Ours had slightly lower platforms than the one shown below.










https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/DQMwa5dtJDM?feature=oembed


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## johnbaz (Jan 30, 2005)

Roger the Dodger said:


> When I worked at Compair BroomWade back in the 70s, we had several diesel Lister auto trucks for carting our maintenance gear around on. The motor unit was basically a diesel engine mounted over a single wheel and was steered by a large handlebar the width of the engine. This was coupled to a low flatbed trailer. They were lethal things to start... you flipped the decompression lever to open, turned the engine over with a large and heavy cast iron handle to build up speed and then flipped the decompression lever over. Hopefully, the engine started, but there was always the risk of it misfiring and flinging the handle off at high speed. Ours had slightly lower platforms than the one shown below


 Hi Roger

Love the Lister trucks, We had one in the early 80's that we started by winding it up with a handle!!

At my old works we had a stand on electric truck that had two levers, One for steering, The other for speed, It also had an emergency dead mans pedal, The truck wouldn't go unless the driver stepped onm the peday, It had new batteries every few years that were lead-acid and weighed around a half ton, It came to a rather ignominious end a few years ago, This was my mate Jim reducing it to fit in the basket to go in the furnace..










Regards, John


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Roger the Dodger said:


> When I worked at Compair BroomWade back in the 70s, we had several diesel Lister auto trucks for carting our maintenance gear around on. The motor unit was basically a diesel engine mounted over a single wheel and was steered by a large handlebar the width of the engine. This was coupled to a low flatbed trailer. They were lethal things to start... you flipped the decompression lever to open, turned the engine over with a large and heavy cast iron handle to build up speed and then flipped the decompression lever over. Hopefully, the engine started, but there was always the risk of it misfiring and flinging the handle off at high speed. Ours had slightly lower platforms than the one shown below.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/DQMwa5dtJDM?feature=oembed


 I'm responsible for the "death" of a lot of those things. I used to buy them for the engines and scrap the rest. Another was the Bonser truck,

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/RD-aNhbo1pc?feature=oembed

I remember buying 10 of them at a local authority auction for £25 each, to get the engines.


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## eezy (Apr 13, 2018)

Roger the Dodger said:


> They were lethal things to start... you flipped the decompression lever to open, turned the engine over with a large and heavy cast iron handle to build up speed and then flipped the decompression lever over.


 I worked on small plant for a few months. We had small Listers in 3'' slurry pumps. One of the hirers was the local animal rendering plant and if we had a service call we had to go there. After handling them you could not get rid of the smell for days.

The most difficult ones to start were Petters in the little single drum rollers. During the winter they were nigh on impossible to start after standing out all night. They had a single handed cranking handle and we carried some tube in the van so that we could use both hands. It was a test of fitness.

Another occasion I went out to a Bomag double drum roller with a Hatz engine. Operator said when I select forward it goes backwards. I noticed it was blowing out the air filter and sucking through the exhaust. They were cranked from the back of the engine so anti clockwise. The handle had a spring loaded peg that you could turn around to ratchet in the opposite direction. So he'd started the engine and it was running backwards.

Listers were generally the easiest to get on with.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

eezy said:


> Listers were generally the easiest to get on with.


 Very forgiving as well, they run in a state of wear where a comparable Petter wouldn't. I had one of these running a generator at my last home, with the exhaust piped through a water butt which quietened it right down.

Big engine for all the power it produced. I ran it on recycled cooking oil.

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/tOYrE-UcvY4?feature=oembed


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## eezy (Apr 13, 2018)

WRENCH said:


> Very forgiving as well, they run in a state of wear where a comparable Petter wouldn't.


 Absolutely. Even new Petters were difficult to start in comparison. They had an enormous amount of drag when you were cranking them. It says something when the big navvies on the roads couldn't swing them fast enough.

We had all sorts of Listers, small, big, 1,2 and 3 cylinders which had electric start in the 3 ton dumpers.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

eezy said:


> Absolutely. Even new Petters were difficult to start in comparison. They had an enormous amount of drag when you were cranking them. It says something when the big navvies on the roads couldn't swing them fast enough.
> 
> We had all sorts of Listers, small, big, 1,2 and 3 cylinders which had electric start in the 3 ton dumpers.


 A lot of the problems with the Petter's, especially the smaller A series, was the wrong oil viscosity, especially in cold weather. It caused too much drag on the engine internals to spin up. The Lister TS/ST 3 and 4 cylinder motors weren't too bad for the experienced to crank start. I had one of those horrible Petter AC1's with the wind round rope start on my saw bench. The only way you could successfully start them was without using the decompressor, and turning the engine backwards onto compression before pulling the rope hard, and having a rope pull made from a broom handle so you could use both hands. All this stuff is illegal on sites now due to H & S.


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## Roger the Dodger (Oct 5, 2009)

We had an old cement mixer on the estate with a similar crank started, single cylinder diesel engine in it. It was much more powerful that the modern Belle electric ones and the drum was huge.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Roger the Dodger said:


> We had an old cement mixer on the estate with a similar crank started, single cylinder diesel engine in it. It was much more powerful that the modern Belle electric ones and the drum was huge.


 I used to buy job lots of these mixers, always British made, not for nationalistic reasons, but because they were really well made and extremely durable. All would be completely refurbished, then sold on to building contractors.


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## chas g (Nov 20, 2016)

Tales of trying to start a small diesel engine has reminded me if a rather frightening experience I had in 1973. I was an engineering cadet on the MV Clan Graham anchored off St Helena in the South Atlantic. One afternoon, me and the other 3 cadets thought it would be fun to lower a lifeboat and have a tootle about.

We got the lifeboat into the water and let go the ropes. It was a perfectly calm sea with a light wind. Within minutes the lifeboat started to drift alarmingly away from the ship and our best efforts with the oars was getting us nowhere. The boat had a small single cylinder engine and it took forever on the handle to start it and even then it was next to useless.

With a combination of rowing and the pathetic diesel engine it took ages to finally get back to the ship and a right rollicking from the captain. An incredibly frightening experience to say the least.


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## Hotbulb (Jan 1, 2020)

WRENCH said:


> Here's another blast, the Oxford Allen Scythe,
> 
> https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/bRDFEJJ_vtI?feature=oembed
> 
> ...


 I had a couple of them when I collected horticultural equipment buggers to get going with their 2 stroke villiers engines, my late father had one in the sixties on our farm and used to cut the hay , he acquired a former horse drawn Bamford finger mower that had been modified to be tractor drawn shortly after as it was a bit of a man killer , Remember him saying that the odd rabbit would loose a leg if it didn't run fast enough to get out of the way , also had a collection of Howard rotavators for my sins and used a 1940's Gem back in the nineties for prepping areas for turf or planting , when you did eventually get them started there wasn't much that could stop them

pic for reference of the same early one I had with spade lug wheels


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Hotbulb said:


> pic for reference of the same early one I had with spade lug wheels


 I had one like this, with the twin cylinder motor.

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/yHTdh1xgGBo?feature=oembed

Although I preferred the J.A.P. sidevalve single.










Superb machines.

I kept one like this for doing the garden untill I left my last place.


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## Hotbulb (Jan 1, 2020)

WRENCH said:


> I had one like this, with the twin cylinder motor.
> 
> https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/yHTdh1xgGBo?feature=oembed
> 
> ...


 Smaller Bottom one was called either a Bantam or Bullfinch maybe a later model which I can't remember ? , I used to have all the manuals for them also originally used the Villiers 2 stroke the same as the Allen or a Villers 4 stroke MK40 ? Jap engines where superb , think I've still some Wico ek magnetos somewhere which were used in multiple engines from various manufacturers


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Hotbulb said:


> Smaller Bottom one was called either a Bantam or Bullfinch maybe a later model which I can't remember ? , I used to have all the manuals for them also originally used the Villiers 2 stroke the same as the Allen or a Villers 4 stroke MK40 ? Jap engines where superb , think I've still some Wico ek magnetos somewhere which were used in multiple engines from various manufacturers


 These things were made to a quality and durability unsurpassed.

I had a Merry Tiller truck as well, but it was for selling on to a market gardner.










This was another one,

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/wxemKnj77uc?feature=oembed


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## eezy (Apr 13, 2018)

Hotbulb said:


> had a collection of Howard rotavators for my sins


 We had Howard Gems in a hire fleet. I couldn't for the life of me remember what engine was in them so had to look it up. They were Kohler engines (late 70's)


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## Hotbulb (Jan 1, 2020)

WRENCH said:


> These things were made to a quality and durability unsurpassed.
> 
> I had a Merry Tiller truck as well, but it was for selling on to a market gardner.
> 
> ...


 Yes remember the Merry tillers a lot small holdings and I think local authorities used them, Bonsers were another similar three wheeled truck , Never owned a Ransomes always fancied one , the guy who I used to get my Howard spares from was know as the "Howard man" his name was Chester Hudson , a name I'll never forget he also had loads of Ransome crawlers including the rare wheeled versions they used for cleaning out the solids tanks from sewage treatment works , he lived in a 18 century house that was falling apart around him in a village over in East Sussex and was super posh and very eccentric , I always got on well with him and would get invited into his kitchen for a cup of Tea when I visited and sit amongst the almost ceiling high piles of old news papers in front of the AGA , most people we told to F off hence why he never sold much ha ha , spent many an hour rummaging through his old poly tunnels full of treasures


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