# Steinhart Snowflake Sub



## dowsing

I just saw this and thought I'd share, Steinhart are now doing a homage of the original blue snowflake sub called the Arctic Ocean. Rather than being done by Steinhart directly it is available through the Dutch company Aramar and limited to 100 pieces. Available to pre-order and ready in 6 - 8 weeks and costing Â£330 with p & p.










Here are the details from the site:

Technical Details

Type: Arctic Ocean / Individually engraved serial number

Movement

ETA 2824-2 Swiss Made, automatic, hacking seconds, date

Jewels: 25 jewels

screw down crown

Functions

hour and minute with Super Luminova vintage "old radium"...

central second hand, date

Case: stainless steel

Back: Stainless steel screwed, engraved..

Diameter: 42 mm (1.65 inches), without crown

height: 13 mm

Weight: 190 g

Dial: blue

Crystal: Sapphire incl. date magnifier

Bezel: blue

Indices: Super Luminova vintage

Lug width: 22mm

WaterRes: 300 metres/990 feet 30 ATM (on the dial is due to vintage reasons 200m/660ft)

Strap: stainless steel 22 mm, screwed

Buckle: stainless steel, safety clasp

350 EUR VAT incl. (inside EU!)

289 EUR without VAT (outside EU!)

Open for pre-order now! Watches will be ready in 6-8 weeks from now. 100 pcs available!

*euro 350.00 *

The website link is: http://www.aramar.nl...aid=515&lang=EN


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## jmm1

That looks really nice.


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## mach 0.0013137

Nice, but I`d want to see a photo of the actual watch face rather then a drawing before shelving out cash :wink2:


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## dowsing

Weren't you after a blue snowflake Mach?



mach 0.0013137 said:


> Nice, but I`d want to see a photo of the actual watch face rather then a drawing before shelving out cash :wink2:


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## mach 0.0013137

dowsing said:


> Weren't you after a blue snowflake Mach?
> 
> 
> 
> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice, but I`d want to see a photo of the actual watch face rather then a drawing before shelving out cash :wink2:
Click to expand...

I`d love one but as I indicated - I`d want to see a photo first.


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## Neillp

Hmm looks nice and has the date window which I miss on my OVM, if it came with a ceramic bezel insert I would order one (I am hard on my watches!).


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## Neillp

They are also doing a Pacific Ocean

http://www.aramar.nl/index.php?item=&action=article&group_id=35&aid=514&lang=EN


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## Draygo

I was only thinking at the weekend that Steinhart should do a snowflake version of the Ocean. I'd prefer a black dial, and I'd need to see the 'vintage' lume to be convinced... But I hope it's a huge success and Gunther produces some more.

I'm with Mach; I'd want to see a real photo first... But I'm still tempted...! Steinhart quality should be pretty reliable. I'd be quite confident that it would be very nice indeed.

Maybe he could swap the dial and hands of my OV red for me...!?

Cheers for the heads up Carl. (I'm sure I'm on the Steinhart email list, but this one had escaped me.)


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## Stu1

That looks very nice, what I do find funny though is that Aramar say they do the design work while Steinhart make the watches, I guess it's easy going in the Aramar design department then!

And why do Steinhart need another company to design a watch that they already manufacture that is already another companies design,

Stu


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## Pob

dowsing said:


> ........ Individually engraved serial number


Wow!

...there's a novel idea! :lol:


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## dowsing

Well, I caved in and have ordered #33, I shall also post up some thoughts and photos when it arrives later in the year.

This will be my first Steinhart. I have had an Orange Watch Company Blue Snowflake on order for years but I'm still no nearer getting it so have gone with this for now. I prefer the the idea of the 40mm size, but with this at least I know I should actually get one soon.


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## jbw

Not for me...Prefer the Pacific Ocean.


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## Drum2000

dowsing said:


> Well, I caved in and have ordered #33, I shall also post up some thoughts and photos when it arrives later in the year.












Bravo that man!



dowsing said:


> This will be my first Steinhart.


I'm sure you won't be disappointed. You could always sell it to me if you don't get on together.



dowsing said:


> I prefer the the idea of the 40mm size, but with this at least I know I should actually get one soon.


Hey, what's 2mm?


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## Chromejob

DIdn't see the "Pacific Ocean," but the "White Ocean" white dial GMT is intriguing. If the "SuperLuminova Vintage" is used on either, check WUS for pics of the Ocean Vintage Military, tons of pics of people's received models. Not to my taste, I don't want my "C3" looking dingy ecru in daylight. YMMV.

I have an OBDLC, and love it. Good quality all 'round.


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## Dr.f

Good for you,keen to see what it looks like.


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## Draygo

Not seen an OVM in the flesh, but I'm worried that the aged Luminova might be a bit less ecru and more peach...

Anyone?


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> Not seen an OVM in the flesh, but I'm worried that the aged Luminova might be a bit less ecru and more peach...
> 
> Anyone?


They'll probably use the same stuff as on other vintage watches on their range. Some are a bit excessive, like what they use in their flieger range. But you already know what they've used on our Ocean Vintage GMT, looks nice!

I might have to start flipping couch pillows to see if I can come up with a few coins... this would scartch a serious itch. :yes:


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## Guest

Will be interested to see the first purchased photo rather than a photo of every other angle of the watch other than the face.


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## Kutusov

Well, just ordered one too... thing is, can't pay the damn thing as my homebanking page keeps telling the service is down...


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## dowsing

What number did you go for Renato?

There is a thread up over on watchuseek giving some more info and another pic of what it should look like.


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## mach 0.0013137

Unfortunately, the lume in that photo is too in-ya-face for my tastes 

Hopefully it`ll be better on the actual production model.


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## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> What number did you go for Renato?


Don't know, just managed to transfer the money a while ago... Does Maurice get back to you with that kind of information? Oh, sorry, misread you... I didn't ask for a number... I'll be knowing in a couple of months :wallbash:

And as to the lume, I think it's very close to what we see in a lot of the old Tudors....










Doesn't look as a orange-ish as the OMV too.


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## dowsing

If you wanted a specific number you can email Maurice and see if it's available. I originally asked for one in the comments box when ordering, though I did email him afterwards to check that I had got it. There are some numbers mentioned on the watchuseek thread of what's been taken.


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## Draygo

mach 0.0013137 said:


> Unfortunately, the lume in that photo is too in-ya-face for my tastes
> 
> Hopefully it`ll be better on the actual production model.


Bear in mind, Mach, that that 'photo' is a composite of another Steiny with the cgi dial from the top of this thread... Not saying it won't look like this, but that it's just a really good bit of photoshopping, not a photo.


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## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> If you wanted a specific number you can email Maurice and see if it's available. I originally asked for one in the comments box when ordering, though I did email him afterwards to check that I had got it. There are some numbers mentioned on the watchuseek thread of what's been taken.


I'll have to take a look at that WUS thread... but to be honest, the only number I would prefer was 1 and I'm guessing that's taken :lol: Any other number is fine by my.

Regarding the lume, I would prefer it C1 white but hey...


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## Chromejob

How about 68? What's 68? That's the position where she does me, and I owe her one. (... I'll get my coat.)


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## rossi46

Just ordered mine & asked which numbers were still available. Maurice sent me an email straight back with the list of 9 numbers !!!! I've picked one of those so it looks like only 8 watches still available !!! If you want one you'd better be quick


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## Kutusov

Still PS but I thought they were real!





































...and I still don't know if I have secured one or not :wallbash:Scratch that! Just got confirmation it is secured! :yes: :thumbup:


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## Draygo

Well, I've just ordered one. 

Number unspecified.

If I like it, look out for an Ocean Vintage Red on SC.

If I don't, look out for an Arctic Ocean on SC.

Win/win?


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## Kutusov

Well done!! There are very few left!

As to win/win, don't know about that... but I'm really glad you've sold me the black Ocean 1 to get the Vintage Red. If it wasn't for that, I would have bought the VR myself and would have probably sold it by now.


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## Drum2000

Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.

Must not give in...

Must not give in...


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## Kutusov

25 left apparently... info from Maurice himself over at WUS.


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## Afka

Hamilton 24h. 12 on the top, what I think is the better option for a 24h hour dial than 24 (or 0) on the top.


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## Afka

Afka said:


> Hamilton 24h. 12 on the top, what I think is the better option for a 24h hour dial than 24 (or 0) on the top.


Sorry, posted into wrong thread. The right one must be Snowy Saturdays.

For some reason I can't delete and even edit my previous post to correct my mistake.


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## Kutusov

Afka said:


> Afka said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamilton 24h. 12 on the top, what I think is the better option for a 24h hour dial than 24 (or 0) on the top.
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, posted into wrong thread. The right one must be Snowy Saturdays.
> 
> For some reason I can't delete and even edit my previous post to correct my mistake.
Click to expand...

No worries but the reason you can't edit is because there's a time window to edit a post. I think it's about 5 minutes or maybe less.


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## tall_tim

Drum2000 said:


> Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> Must not give in...


I gave in, number 71 bagged last night.


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## Kynuna

Hmmm very tempting


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## Drum2000

tall_tim said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I gave in, number 71 bagged last night.
Click to expand...

It's just that I have the Ocean One Green and it is pretty much the same watch. It would be like having two of the same car but in different colours. Though that's no bad thing really.

Must...

resist...

willpower...

waning...

(as the credit card begins to glow somewhere in the distance a dog barked)


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I gave in, number 71 bagged last night.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's just that I have the Ocean One Green and it is pretty much the same watch. It would be like having two of the same car but in different colours. Though that's no bad thing really.
> 
> Must...
> 
> resist...
> 
> willpower...
> 
> waning...
> 
> (as the credit card begins to glow somewhere in the distance a dog barked)
Click to expand...

Come one, it's a very different watch. It makes a lot less sense to have a black O1 and a GMT like I do and I don't regret it at all. Let the CC glow white hot!


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## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I gave in, number 71 bagged last night.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's just that I have the Ocean One Green and it is pretty much the same watch. It would be like having two of the same car but in different colours. Though that's no bad thing really.
> 
> Must...
> 
> resist...
> 
> willpower...
> 
> waning...
> 
> (as the credit card begins to glow somewhere in the distance a dog barked)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come one, it's a very different watch. It makes a lot less sense to have a black O1 and a GMT like I do and I don't regret it at all. Let the CC glow white hot!
Click to expand...

Yep. And my O1VR and Vintage GMT pair is totally sensible. Obviously.


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> Yep. And my O1VR and Vintage GMT pair is totally sensible. Obviously.


They feel like completely different watches, I didn't even included that I also own a Vintage GMT because I don't even drawn a parallel between that one and Ocean 1 and Ocean 1 GMT.


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## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gunther seems to be doing a lot of variations using this case, bracelet and movement. I've been trembling for the last few days and am trying hard to resist.
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> Must not give in...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I gave in, number 71 bagged last night.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's just that I have the Ocean One Green and it is pretty much the same watch. It would be like having two of the same car but in different colours. Though that's no bad thing really.
> 
> Must...
> 
> resist...
> 
> willpower...
> 
> waning...
> 
> (as the credit card begins to glow somewhere in the distance a dog barked)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come one, it's a very different watch. It makes a lot less sense to have a black O1 and a GMT like I do and I don't regret it at all. Let the CC glow white hot!
Click to expand...

Same case. Same bezel. Same movement. Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent.


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Same case. Same bezel. Same movement. Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent.


What do you mean same bezel?? Your Ocean is green!!! And about the movement, it's the same thing you'll find in a huge lot of automatic watches... I must have a 2824-2 in about 10 watches or so....

Come on, you know you are just trying to kid yourself and not giving in to temptation.... does it help if I mention that Ratzinger would be very happy to see you following that path? :lol: :lol:


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## mach 0.0013137

Ok, I finally gave in to temptation 

Hopefully I`ll get the number I ordered :wink2:


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## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> Ok, I finally gave in to temptation
> 
> Hopefully I`ll get the number I ordered :wink2:


Well done, congrats!!!

As they are pretty much all sold, we'll be getting them pretty much at the same time. It will be funny to see a Friday thread crowded with Steinies snowflakes :lol:


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## tall_tim

I would also like to say what a gent Maurice is. We've had a few emails go back and forth, and he's been very accommodating and replies faster than my missus replies to my texts to her!!


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## dowsing

That's certainly quite a few of us that have ordered one and it's looking like they have pretty much sold them all or very nearly. I'm looking forward to that Steinhart Snowflake Friday thread.


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## Kutusov

tall_tim said:


> I would also like to say what a gent Maurice is. We've had a few emails go back and forth, and he's been very accommodating and replies faster than my missus replies to my texts to her!!


Same here. Quick to reply and someone that you feel actually cares and spends 30 seconds more to write back a proper email. Not like some seller that get back to you with an email saying "No" or "Yes".


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## Kutusov

And they are over, just posted by Maurice on the WUS thread. All pre-ordered.

A few news for those of you that don't want to bother with the 20+ page thread over there... there will be a delay in delivery because apparently there aren't snowflake hands available. So they are going to be made in Switzerland especifically for this watch and that could take 8 weeks to get to Gunther. Save estimate is the watch will be with us in May but Gunther said he will try to speed things up and have it ready in April.

Also, there's a possibility that Aramar and Steinhart logos will change place... Gunther suggested having the Aramar logo on the dial and Steinhart on the case back. Two reasons... it's a custom made Aramar watch and second, there was much fuss created by Steinhart official resellers that complained about not being able to sell this watch. As a owner of 3 Steinharts, this is good news to me.

Oh, and if you want to read the WUS thread, here's the link, I think Carl posted it already: http://forums.watchu...ean-802735.html


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## Draygo

The logo swap could be a deal-breaker for me...

(I'm quite fussy about logos.)

...but luckily the Aramar logo is OK.

Phew.

I'd still rather have the Steinhart logo, despite having three others.


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> The logo swap could be a deal-breaker for me...
> 
> (I'm quite fussy about logos.)
> 
> ...but luckily the Aramar logo is OK.
> 
> Phew.
> 
> I'd still rather have the Steinhart logo, despite having three others.


I think it will work well, the logo and text size will be redesigned at Steinhart and proposed to Maurice. As it is, I think it works even better. I've felt from the beginning that the upper side of the dial was a bit naked compared to the lower side and that something from there should move up. If they maintain a decent enough size logo, it will cover that and be closer to the look on the Tudor.... me thinks.


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## Draygo

^ You might be right, Renato. Either way, I'm relaxed. 

I should be unhappy with the Rotor Self Winding text - I've never been a fan of too much text, especially when it's a case of Stating The Bleedin' Obvious. (Automatic would do it for me.) I understand that Tudor do it, so it's homagey, but it's a tad daft, nevertheless. But for some reason, it doesn't bother me.

I'm also not too unhappy about the timings... it'll give me more time to work out how I can justify buying it.

I've subscribed to the WUS thread, but only for daily updates (to many posts were clogging up my inbox). But a lot seems to happen every day at the moment, so I might have to visit more often...


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## Kutusov

WUS workes like TZ... you only get a notification of something else posted after your last read and doesn't matter if it's 1 post or 100. You don't get another notification until you click on the link to read what's new.

And I'm with Alan here... everything is better than "Superlative chronometer" :lol:


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## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> And I'm with Alan here... everything is better than "Superlative chronometer"


x2...!


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## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> Also, there's a possibility that Aramar and Steinhart logos will change place... Gunther suggested having the Aramar logo on the dial and Steinhart on the case back. Two reasons... it's a custom made Aramar watch and second, there was much fuss created by Steinhart official resellers that complained about not being able to sell this watch. As a owner of 3 Steinharts, this is good news to me.


I don't see why the Steinhart dealers should kick up such a fuss. After all they didn't have any claim on the Black Sea or the Proteus either and they are all very limited additions.



Kutusov said:


> And they are over, just posted by Maurice on the WUS thread. All pre-ordered.


A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).


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## tall_tim

Drum2000 said:


> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).


Well done, do you know/choose which number?


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## Drum2000

tall_tim said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, do you know/choose which number?
Click to expand...

 No idea. I went to the sight and it said SOLD OUT. Crestfallen I sent Maurice an e-mail and asked to be put on a standby list should there be a cancellation. He responded saying there was one left. The rest is history. I'm just happy to have one.


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## Draygo

Drum2000 said:


> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).


:thumbsup:


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## Drum2000

tall_tim said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, do you know/choose which number?
Click to expand...

Round and round she goes

where she stops

nobody kno - WAIT

It's number* 26!*


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## tall_tim

Drum2000 said:


> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, do you know/choose which number?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Round and round she goes
> 
> where she stops
> 
> nobody kno - WAIT
> 
> It's number* 26!*
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:

You just need to find some significance in the number 26 now!!


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## Kutusov

Well done!!! I'll know what number mine is by... say... December? :lol:


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## Draygo

Maurice has allocated me #29. His choice; he must be psychic... It's my favourite London bus route


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> Maurice has allocated me #29. His choice; he must be psychic... It's my favourite London bus route


How do you know that? You've asked him? I didn't get any info on number...


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## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> Draygo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maurice has allocated me #29. His choice; he must be psychic... It's my favourite London bus route
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do you know that? You've asked him? I didn't get any info on number...
Click to expand...

Yes, although I wasn't really bothered enough to choose a number, for some reason curiosity got the better of me... I mailed just this evening and Maurice replied (so felt guilty for bothering him late in the day). I asked him to choose for me.


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> I mailed just this evening and Maurice replied (so felt guilty for bothering him late in the day).


Think positive... maybe Maurice is a guy in Beijing starting his morning on an underground webcafe :lol: :lol:


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## Drum2000

Drum2000 said:


> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, do you know/choose which number?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No idea. I went to the *sight* and it said SOLD OUT.
Click to expand...

Ever felt *THIS* "ignant"?


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Ever felt *THIS* "ignant"?


Yeap, but I always excuse my self with "the damn phone predictive text" :lol:


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## Drum2000

tall_tim said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tall_tim said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little secret for you - I got the very last one (but don't tell anybody!).
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, do you know/choose which number?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Round and round she goes
> 
> where she stops
> 
> nobody kno - WAIT
> 
> It's number* 26!*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> :thumbsup:
> 
> You just need to find some significance in the number 26 now!!
Click to expand...

Significance? When I was 26 I didn't end up in either a cage or a bag - THAT'S SIGNIFICANT (at that time amongst my family and friends I was voted the person most likely to)!


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Significance? When I was 26 I didn't end up in either a cage or a bag


So at what age did you try S&M stuff???


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## dowsing

What terrible will power all of us have. Did anyone else here get one?


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## rossi46

dowsing said:


> What terrible will power all of us have. Did anyone else here get one?


I got One, or should I say Aramar got Â£330 off me and hopefully one day soon I will receive a watch !!!

Apparently delivery has already gone from 6 - 8 weeks to 12 - 16 weeks


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## Draygo

dowsing said:


> What terrible will power all of us have. Did anyone else here get one?


What do you mean?!

I hesitated, ummmed, aahed, deliberated and pondered for more than a day...!


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## dowsing

Compared to me Dave you are a Jedi of willpower. I think I lasted 30 minutes maybe an hour.

rossi46 delays are usually par for the course with forum editions. I'm certain we'll all be happy with the results and some delayed gratification will probably be good for us.



Draygo said:


> dowsing said:
> 
> 
> 
> What terrible will power all of us have. Did anyone else here get one?
> 
> 
> 
> What do you mean?!
> 
> I hesitated, ummmed, aahed, deliberated and pondered for more than a day...!
Click to expand...


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## tall_tim

I took about 2 days before deciding to order (read that as - persuade the missus).

This will be the first watch I have had to wait significantly for - don't mind at all, but very much looking forward to it.


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## Kutusov

rossi46 said:


> dowsing said:
> 
> 
> 
> What terrible will power all of us have. Did anyone else here get one?
> 
> 
> 
> I got One, or should I say Aramar got Â£330 off me and hopefully one day soon I will receive a watch !!!
> 
> Apparently delivery has already gone from 6 - 8 weeks to 12 - 16 weeks
Click to expand...

Look at the MkII Kingston Plank owners... how many years did those guys waited for the watch?? :lol: :lol:


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## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> Compared to me Dave you are a Jedi of willpower. I think I lasted 30 minutes maybe an hour.


Well Carl, you are a Jedi master to me then! A Steinhart diver was something that I though I was completely done with. Then you opened the thread and it took me less than 5 minutes, including finding the watch on the Steinhart site (wasn't there) and realizing you had included the Aramar link. And I wasn't even drunk!


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## Drum2000

Being the last to secure a watch I think it's safe to say that I win the collasping wil

lpower 2013 award.


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Being the last to secure a watch I think it's safe to say that I win the collasping wil
> 
> lpower 2013 award.


Bhuuuuu.... Drum was the last to get one!!! Gutless!! :lol: :lol:


----------



## Drum2000

Posted Today, 01:39 AM



Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm quite happy to protest a new dial. After all (almost) everyone purchased under the understanding that *this* was the dial. If it were up to me so should it remain.
> 
> 
> 
> Join the WUS crowd... some people apareltly have canceled the pre-order because of this... But honestly, I think it's going to be even greater. A lot more exclusive and the Aramar logo might suit this watch better. Because the brand name is smaller (and on letter count closer to Tudor), we'll probably be getting something that resembles the Tudor dial closer. I've always felt that the upper side of the dial was a bit empty...
> 
> Anyway, nothing but waiting now... or cancel the order which I wouldn't do if I was you. At least until we see the final design. After all, we don't even now for sure that this won't be the final version, it's just most likely not but no 100%s.
Click to expand...

I shant be cancelling but it is a little cheeky to alter the dial after so many orders have been placed.To me there is not a lot of cop between the two logos in style though Steinhart are a brand that I recognise where Aramar isn't. Maybe that's just me but... Besides the Aramar logo makes a very attractive case back. Steinhart on the front and Aramar on the back. That's my vote. In the end, no matter what happens, I'm sure I'll be more than happy with the watch.

Is it April yet? :sadwalk:

Oh, and the reason I switched the conversation back over to this thread is that I feel it's more relavent here. No need to hijack Draygo's 1,000+ thread.


----------



## Draygo

^ Cheers Drum. But I'm, like, chillaxed so don't worry on my behalf


----------



## dowsing

Most of you have probably seen this but if not here's the update from Maurice on Watchuseek.

"IMPORTANT UPDATE:

Today finally Steinhart and I agreed on the final design of the Arctic Ocean. And for those who wonder, it will remain exactly the same as the orginial design. Meaning Steinhart logo on the dial and Aramar logo on the back. Nothing will change. I made this decision since everybody ordered their watch from the first design I made, and I think it is not fair to alter it afterwards. If I would make something in the future with Steinhart it will only be with Aramar on the dial. The watch will be ready in May Steinhart confirmed me again today, this due to the ETA movements which are hard to get and the totally new hands which have to be made. We have really something to look forward to, and when I have more updates on the production process I will place it here."


----------



## Drum2000

Gosh, I feel myself welling up... mostly because I have to wait until May.

Never mind, it'll soon be Christmas.


----------



## Draygo

"Oh, it's a long, long time from February to May

But the days grow short when you reach September

When the autumn weather turns the leaves to flame

One hasn't got time for the waiting game."

...D'you see what I did there?!

Sinatra is all very well and good (actually, great) but this is the version I have permanently lodged in my brain...


----------



## Drum2000

Oh, and thanks for the update Dowsing. I know that you like cats so here's a little prezzie for you -


----------



## Kutusov

....and we don't even get the Aramar logo.... 

Like I said on the other side, I WANT a black and white Aramar version!!! I'll even preorder it NOW!!! :lol:

Oh, and...

Time has told me

You're a rare rare find

A troubled cure

For a troubled mind.

And time has told me

Not to ask for more

Someday our (Arctic) ocean

Will find it's shore.






:lol:


----------



## dowsing

That cat's as happy as you Drum with the news about Steinhart staying on the front 

*Nice to see a Nick Drake reference Kutusov



Drum2000 said:


> Oh, and thanks for the update Dowsing. I know that you like cats so here's a little prezzie for you -


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


>


A cat like that might come in handy to clean the inside of bottles and stuff like that :lol:


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> A cat like that might come in handy to clean the inside of bottles and stuff like that :lol:


Careful Renato, Molly is not amused!!


















:lol:


----------



## Kutusov

Molly is a beautiful cat! Are the whiskers black? Seems that way in the picture but I never saw a cat like that.


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Thanks, she is truly magnificent & yes her whiskers are black


----------



## Kutusov

Amazing! Or maybe Scotcats are different from Portcats... :lol:


----------



## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> *Nice to see a Nick Drake reference Kutusov


2 perfect albums from start to finish! :notworthy: :notworthy:


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Time seems to really dragging :sadwalk:


----------



## Kutusov

May is the advertised delivery date... you're not on the list, are you Mach?


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> May is the advertised delivery date... you're not on the list, are you Mach?


Having problems with your memory, Field Marshal?



Kutusov said:


> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, I finally gave in to temptation
> 
> Hopefully I`ll get the number I ordered :wink2:
> 
> 
> 
> Well done, congrats!!!
> 
> As they are pretty much all sold, we'll be getting them pretty much at the same time. It will be funny to see a Friday thread crowded with Steinies snowflakes :lol:
Click to expand...


----------



## Kutusov

Seems so McMach!! ldman:

It's just that this has been debated on a more regular basis over at WUS and I was remembering seeing you there. I was just a few minutes ago on Steinhart website and all the Oceans are out of stock. Some say they will be ready "not before 23th of April" and part of the reason of the delays with the Aramar was movement availability. So I'm assuming the Snowflake will be done along with all the other Oceans... if all goes well, we should have them 2 months from now.

I'm a bit apprehensive with the aged lume thing, I hope it's not as orange as it looks in some pictures of the OVM. I was discussing this with Draygo the other day and then found these watches that I believe have Fricker's touch... they do seem very Dreadnought-ish...



















Assuming that that is the lume on Aramar, the blue seems to me to be more forgiving, it actually looks quite good.


----------



## dowsing

I've not seen those Fricker models before Renato do you have any more info about them?


----------



## Kutusov

I'm not even sure they are in fact from Fricker... I came across these while googling I can't recall what. I can tell you they are called Alphatime Sawfish, so I can google that later on and try to find out something more specific...


----------



## Drum2000

I want my watch...

I need my watch...

must have my watch...

where's my watch?...


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> I want my watch...
> 
> I need my watch...
> 
> must have my watch...
> 
> where's my watch?...


If we're lucky and has been no delays, it's in bits and pieces :lol:


----------



## dowsing

Thanks for that Renato, I've done a bit more googling and that snowflake model is a custom by Kent Parks and owned by Nalu who is a member here. It does appear to be a Fricker cased model.


----------



## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> Thanks for that Renato, I've done a bit more googling and that snowflake model is a custom by Kent Parks and owned by Nalu who is a member here. It does appear to be a Fricker cased model.


Was I right in thinking this is, if not the same, very close to a Dreadnought? It's becoming apparent to me that the PRS-2 is a lot less exclusive than we tend to believe. There was non-Precista Dreadnought for sale on TZ the other day, do you remember?


----------



## dowsing

Yes I saw that the WatchScout one from Jesper.


----------



## Rod Stunt

i could be interested in some of these steinhart homages if they stayed faithful to the case size of the watches they were homaging


----------



## Kutusov

Rod Stunt said:


> i could be interested in some of these steinhart homages if they stayed faithful to the case size of the watches they were homaging


There are other alternatives out there. Take a look at Davosa, they have the Ternos diver at 40mm or so and a proper ceramic bezel.


----------



## Rod Stunt

Kutusov said:


> Rod Stunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> i could be interested in some of these steinhart homages if they stayed faithful to the case size of the watches they were homaging
> 
> 
> 
> There are other alternatives out there. Take a look at Davosa, they have the Ternos diver at 40mm or so and a proper ceramic bezel.
Click to expand...

ok thanks kutusov


----------



## Kutusov

Rod Stunt said:


> ok thanks kutusov


Don't thank me yet... it's a bit more expensive than the Oceans and I only gave you an example. Google "sub homage" and you'll get lots and lots of threads on different forums (including ours) where this has been discussed ad nauseam. There are lots of alternatives from really cheap and faithful ones like Alpha, to very expensive alternatives like MkII.


----------



## Rod Stunt

yeah sure ok,

i was thinking it would be a snowflake homage haha

thanks anyway man


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Ok, it`s May already - I WANT MY SNOWFLAKE!!! :taz:

:sadwalk:


----------



## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> Ok, it`s May already - I WANT MY SNOWFLAKE!!! :taz:
> 
> :sadwalk:


Have you been following the WUS thread? If all goes according to plan (and so far it has), you'll be getting the watch in the first week of June... so still a month to wait.


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, it`s May already - I WANT MY SNOWFLAKE!!! :taz:
> 
> :sadwalk:
> 
> 
> 
> Have you been following the WUS thread? If all goes according to plan (and so far it has), you'll be getting the watch in the first week of June... so still a month to wait.
Click to expand...

No I haven`t, last I`d heard they were due in May, I`m just like a kid waiting for Christmas


----------



## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> No I haven`t, last I`d heard they were due in May, I`m just like a kid waiting for Christmas


They still are... Aramar should be getting them on the last week of May and shipping them out by then... or the week after. Some members will be on holiday by then, Draygo being one of them... poor chap... or not. :beach: :lol:


----------



## Drum2000

June will never come!
​
​


----------



## Trigger

Some of us already have their Steinhart and are not minded to skip past the month of May.










:tongue2: :tongue2: :tongue2:


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Trigger said:


> Some of us already have their Steinhart and are not minded to skip past the month of May.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :tongue2: :tongue2: :tongue2:


Very nice but it`s not a Snowflake


----------



## Kutusov

I was worried when I saw the news tittle... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22408341 ... but it's the actual ocean, so no big deal :lol:


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> .... Some members will be on holiday by then, Draygo being one of them... poor chap... or not. :beach: :lol:


I booked my holiday for the first week in June to ensure delivery would be ...in the first week in June.

I only did this because I care about you all and thought this would be the way to pin down a delivery date.









BTW, I'll be in Norway, not on a beach, so there's a double irony in there somewhere...


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> I was worried when I saw the news tittle... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22408341 ... but it's the actual ocean, so no big deal :lol:


:lol: ...I saw that headline. Thought about the Steinhart. Obviously. Then thought: I bet I'm the only person in the world who thought about a watch when he first read that...!


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> I bet I'm the only person in the world who thought about a watch when he first read that...!


Nha, the world is filled with crazy people


----------



## Drum2000

Maurice has replied to the Watchuseek thread with the following -

"I spoke with Steinhart a few days ago and he comfirmed me that the watches would be ready end of May. Once we get the watches in (will be in the begining of June) we will notify our customers before shipping the watches. I can't hardly wait to see the Arctic Ocean in real life!"

So nothing new really but reassuring none the less.


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> So nothing new really but reassuring none the less.


Nothing major but yes, it's something new... We thought that Aramar was getting the watches on May and we would get them on the first two weeks of June. But that means that it's Steinhart that is getting the watches on the end of May, Maurice somewhere along the first two weeks of May and then he'll have to ship out 100 watches. That means end of June for us... like I said, nothing major, we've waited a lot already (or a ridiculous short time if you are a MKII project customer :lol: ...)


----------



## Draygo

"On the floating, shapeless Oceans, I did all my best to smile..."


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> "On the floating, shapeless Oceans, I did all my best to smile..."


4AD classic!!


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> 4AD classic!!


Sure is! I think it's in my top ten favourite songs of all time. I was lucky enough to see/hear Liz Fraser sing it live last year during a very rare gig in London, her first for 20 years I think. Fabulous.


----------



## Kutusov

Ok, I'm now officially on 1 month countdown mode. If everything is going according to plan like we've been told, the watch has to be with us one month from now, already considering the time to ship the whole batch from Germany to Holland and from there individually to us. Just saying for the hell of it...


----------



## mach 0.0013137

T minus one month & counting


----------



## redmonaco

if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:


----------



## Kutusov

redmonaco said:


> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:


Keep an eye out on the SC... my guess is that a few will sell in the 2 weeks after delivery :yes:


----------



## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> redmonaco said:
> 
> 
> 
> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:
> 
> 
> 
> Keep an eye out on the SC... my guess is that a few will sell in the 2 weeks after delivery :yes:
Click to expand...

Odds are that it will be Kutusov!


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Odds are that it will be Kutusov!


If you go by my latest record... I haven't been happy about 90% of the watches I have bought recently.

...and I still don't know what I'll feel about a blue watch with that sort of trying-to-look old tritium lume. That's a trepidation I been feeling more and more the closer the delivery date comes. Not alone in this too... So who knows, you might be right. If it was a black and white snowflakie, I know it would be a keeper... as it is, it remains to be seen.


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> .... that sort of trying-to-look old tritium lume. That's a trepidation I been feeling more and more the closer the delivery date comes....


Yep, if it's too custardy, I might have to give someone else custody.

(Sorry.)


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> (Sorry.)


Don't be, I'm sure a lot of people would be glad if we didn't get along with it (glad not in a petty way :lol: )


----------



## Kutusov

Where's Mach post? We do get the new post notifications one by one, you know? ... Are you moderating yourself now?


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Having made the post I realized it was a pile of poo so I deleted it 

We do have standards to keep you know


----------



## Coldwarkid

redmonaco said:


> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:


And me.


----------



## delays

Coldwarkid said:


> redmonaco said:
> 
> 
> 
> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:
> 
> 
> 
> And me.
Click to expand...

Me too. If anyone decides to flip upon arrival, feel free to drop a PM.


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> Draygo said:
> 
> 
> 
> (Sorry.)
> 
> 
> 
> Don't be, I'm sure a lot of people would be glad if we didn't get along with it (glad not in a petty way :lol: )
Click to expand...

I was actually apologising for my terrible pun - custardy / custody - which you very politely ignored so as not to embarrass me. (I know your English is better than mine...)


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> I was actually apologising for my terrible pun - custardy / custody - which you very politely ignored so as not to embarrass me. (I know your English is better than mine...)


Of course it isn't and if you need proof, it wasn't politeness that made me miss the pun :lol:


----------



## Mikeeb

nice looking watch, not sure i like the fake patina.


----------



## Kutusov

Mikeeb said:


> nice looking watch, not sure i like the fake patina.


Fake patina... well said! :thumbup:


----------



## Draygo

Mikeeb said:


> nice looking watch, not sure i like the fake patina.


Yep, you're not the only one who's unsure - even amongst those who've ordered one!


----------



## Kutusov

T minus 28 days and counting...


----------



## BondandBigM

In the time it has taken you could have bought a real one, enjoyed it and sold it on with little or no loss, maybe even a small profit. I doubt if you'll be able to say that about the look a likey.

:lol: :lol:


----------



## Kutusov

BondandBigM said:


> In the time it has taken you could have bought a real one


Are you saying I bought a fake Steinhart?? :blink:

:thumbsup:


----------



## BondandBigM

Kutusov said:


> BondandBigM said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the time it has taken you could have bought a real one
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying I bought a fake Steinhart?? :blink:
> 
> :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

:lol: :lol:


----------



## mrteatime

Right...this is basically a knock off isn't it?

Im sorry, but this is sailing way to close to the wind to be a "hommage" and is a blatant copy of a classic....."with aged patina" surely this is a piss take?

A nod to a classic is cool, but to do such a blatant rip-off really is taking the piss....

There's a touch of double standards and hypocrisy around what is/is not acceptable....

the line between wearing a hommage and a fake is so blurred its laughable.......

I couldnt care less one way or another if someone wants to wear a turkish beach knock off rep of a rolex, or this...it really doesn't bother me......but, some of you are so quick to get on a bandwagon if someone does wear a replica/knock off/panny-a-like or whatever......


----------



## BondandBigM

Actually it wouldn't surprise me that some fakes did turn up, I noticed recently they were offering a rip off of a Tag Carrera..........nearly â‚¬1000 !!!!

I bought and sold a real Tag Carrera for that :lol: :lol:


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Does it have Tudor on the dial?

No!

Would I like a Tudor Snowflake?

Yes but I really can`t be arsed spending the (IMO) ridiculous amount of money they cost so I`m quite happy to buy the Steinhart version & I really don`t give a flying fig what other people think about it :tease:

Have a nice day


----------



## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> I really don`t give a flying fig what other people think about it :tease:


There's the problem right there... if you cared you wouldn't be caught dead wearing anything but a Tudor... because you know everybody knows what a Tudor Snowflake is anyway 

Almost Tminus 27


----------



## Drum2000

Today construction of the new STEINHART headquarters started. They must be doing something right.


----------



## apm101

delays said:


> Coldwarkid said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> redmonaco said:
> 
> 
> 
> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:
> 
> 
> 
> And me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Me too. If anyone decides to flip upon arrival, feel free to drop a PM.
Click to expand...

Can I add myself to that queue? Stunning looking watch.


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Today construction of the new STEINHART headquarters started. They must be doing something right.


Where did you find that?


----------



## crsj

Homage! Lol....... Stienhart marketing dept must be geniuses. They've convinced a load of WIS's to buy copies!


----------



## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Today construction of the new STEINHART headquarters started. They must be doing something right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where did you find that?
Click to expand...




crsj said:


> Homage! Lol....... Stienhart marketing dept must be geniuses. They've convinced a load of WIS's to buy copies!


Steinhart's Facebook page.And they are geniuses - they convinced us to buy top quality at a great price. Say no more. :yes:


----------



## Mr Cracker

apm101 said:


> delays said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coldwarkid said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> redmonaco said:
> 
> 
> 
> if I hadnt come to the party 5 months too late I'd have bought one too!! :mda:
> 
> 
> 
> And me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Me too. If anyone decides to flip upon arrival, feel free to drop a PM.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Can I add myself to that queue? Stunning looking watch.
Click to expand...

I will be waiting for any unwanted watches too, beautiful looking watch!


----------



## mrteatime

crsj said:


> Homage! Lol....... Stienhart marketing dept must be geniuses. They've convinced a load of WIS's to buy copies!


still a hommage however way you look at it......

er.....LOL


----------



## Kutusov

:eat:


----------



## Kutusov

We should be seeing real pictures of the thing this week... that would mean Gunther got the watches within the estimated time.

No pictures this week = delay...


----------



## dowsing

It does seem awfully quiet still, a picture would be great I'm beginning to forget what the watch looks like 



Kutusov said:


> We should be seeing real pictures of the thing this week... that would mean Gunther got the watches within the estimated time.
> 
> No pictures this week = delay...


----------



## Draygo

dowsing said:


> It does seem awfully quiet still, a picture would be great I'm beginning to forget what the watch looks like


Yeah, I've got a feeling that I may have ordered one once, but I can't remember... :lookaround:


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> dowsing said:
> 
> 
> 
> It does seem awfully quiet still, a picture would be great I'm beginning to forget what the watch looks like
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I've got a feeling that I may have ordered one once, but I can't remember... :lookaround:
Click to expand...

'twas a black and white snowflake, surely... I don't think I would ever go for a blue and pink watch :sweatdrop:


----------



## Draygo

Kutusov said:


> 'twas a black and white snowflake, surely...


Maybe they'll send me the Top Secret Project Watch by mistake.

After all, it's easy to confuse Arctic Ocean #29 with Antarctic Ocean #1.


----------



## Mechanical Alarm

mach 0.0013137 said:


> Kutusov said:
> 
> 
> 
> A cat like that might come in handy to clean the inside of bottles and stuff like that :lol:
> 
> 
> 
> Careful Renato, Molly is not amused!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :lol:
Click to expand...

Molly is not amused aroused. :lol: (Similar look to other females)


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Mechanical Alarm said:


> Molly is not amused aroused. :lol:


You`re lucky, Molly is in a good mood today otherwise you`d be in deep trouble :fear:

Actually this isn`t true - she`s a very placid & tolerant lady


----------



## Kutusov

Seen the news already, haven't you? Steinhart ordered 500 movements (400 for the Oceans and 100 for the Arctic Ocean) and ETA delivered... 40. No Snowflake any time soon. I'm dropping out... I wasn't all that sure about a blue watch with orange lume to beguine with...


----------



## mach 0.0013137

That is disappointing, I was really looking forward to getting the Snowflake


----------



## Kutusov

Maurice is talking about a delivery date somewhere further in the Summer. Post 517: http://forums.watchuseek.com/f275/steinhart-aramar-arctic-ocean-802735-52.html


----------



## Drum2000

I best not comment beyond this at this time for fear of what I might say.


----------



## Kutusov

My comments are on WUS but I've just got my money back.


----------



## Draygo

I'm going to take a week's cooling off time and see how I feel about it then. The delay, plus my continued worry about the custard-coloured lume, means I might well be with Kutusov in pulling out. Photos of a sample (assembled with one of the rare and precious movements kindly and graciously supplied by ETA) might make me keep my patience. Maybe.


----------



## rossi46

Kutusov said:


> My comments are on WUS but I've just got my money back.


Did you get all your money back ?

I cancelled a few weeks ago but because I paid by PayPal and it was over 3 months ago Maurice couldn't just issue a full refund, he had to just send me a payment. Cost me about Â£30 in fees for the pleasure of someone else having my money for 3+ months !!!


----------



## Drum2000

*I'm not cancelling.* I'm in it for the long haul. The people I'm sorry for are Gunther and Maurice as I'm sure they must feel as if they were standing before us with their pants down. Gunther perhaps even more so as he also has orders for his long promised general stock to fill. These two men are honourable and eventually I will have a well crafted watch that I had to wait what seems more than a lifetime. Perhaps for that reason I shall cherish it that much more.

*Very, very low class shabby business ethics by ETA/Swatch Group! * :yucky:


----------



## Kutusov

rossi46 said:


> Did you get all your money back ?
> 
> I cancelled a few weeks ago but because I paid by PayPal and it was over 3 months ago Maurice couldn't just issue a full refund, he had to just send me a payment. Cost me about Â£30 in fees for the pleasure of someone else having my money for 3+ months !!!


I was paid by paypal also but I initially placed the order through BT. That's a free of cost operation for me, as far as I know (SEPA, that British banks signed but apparently don't honour as I've seen with in a few buys and sales over the SC). I'll still have to check that but I'll let you know. (And, obviously, if there was a BT cost, I can't expect Maurice to cover that).


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> *Very, very low class shabby business ethics by ETA/Swatch Group! * :yucky:


Yeap, and completely congruent with their bank system and... let me shut up before this gets into the political section...

But I tell you... it's our fault. The only thing that might make a brand insist on using an ETA when there's the Miyota 9015 alternative, is only that people care about the Swiss Made on dial. I would be soooo glad that all these small businesses dropped the ETA altogether and would let them deal only with their home brands... it would be the end of them seeing my money.


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## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Same case. Same bezel. *Same movement.* Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent.
> 
> 
> 
> What do you mean same bezel?? Your Ocean is green!!! *And about the movement, it's the same thing you'll find in a huge lot of automatic watches... I must have a 2824-2 in about 10 watches or so....*
Click to expand...

So said the man who replied to the above - :yes:



Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Very, very low class shabby business ethics by ETA/Swatch Group! * :yucky:
> 
> 
> 
> But I tell you... it's our fault. The only thing that might make a brand insist on using an ETA when there's the Miyota 9015 alternative, is only that people care about the Swiss Made on dial. I would be soooo glad that all these small businesses dropped the ETA altogether and would let them deal only with their home brands... it would be the end of them seeing my money.
Click to expand...

Fair enough but the situation isn't as clean as that. A large part of the history of watchmaking is based around those alps and many, myself included, feel enriched by that heritage. I'm not besmirching the quality of Miyota or any other alternative but one must admit when walking in the footsteps of the distinguished pioneers. Perhaps I'm a luddite...

My grievance is with Swatch and their arrogance. It has how the world has, sadly, (de)evolved.


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## Kutusov

...so... I assume you agree with me? That it's our own fault that small businesses get hostage by ETA?


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## Drum2000

I do agree. Time to kick the ankles of giants.


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> I do agree. Time to kick the ankles of giants.


 :yes: :yes:


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## watchking1

All sold out now...


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## Kutusov

watchking1 said:


> All sold out now...


What do you mean? They are sold out a long time ago... what exists is a waiting list for people that asked to take the place of whoever drops out. My guess is that there will be a few more drop outs on the weekend, when people that haven't the chance/time to check this stuff out during a working week find out about it.

A word of solidarity with Maurice, as he most be losing money already... he refunds people through paypal and I at least got the exact same money back as I've sent him. So he paid PP fees himself... Mighty decent of him but I wish he hadn't as this is sure to hurt and put off these small businesses or trying such projects.


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## mach 0.0013137

After giving it some thought I`ve decided to hang on, I really like the look of this watch & maybe it`ll arrive in time for my birthday in a few months


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## mach 0.0013137

I`ve just had confirmation that a similar problem with ETA is the reason a Steinhart Marine I ordered recently is being delayed 

Fecking ETA :taz:


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## Draygo

mach 0.0013137 said:


> I`ve just had confirmation that a similar problem with ETA is the reason a Steinhart Marine I ordered recently is being delayed


...I've ben keeping quiet about the brand spanking new Ocean One Black that arrived with me just last week. I suspect I had one of the 40 movements that ETA deigned to send. Now... where's the Guilty Face emoticon?


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## Drum2000

Draygo said:


> ...I've ben keeping quiet about the brand spanking new Ocean One Black that arrived with me just last week. I suspect I had one of the 40 movements that ETA deigned to send. Now... where's the Guilty Face emoticon?


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## mach 0.0013137

It`s obviously all his fault!


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## Kutusov

This whole thing sucks but I really, really hope it start happening in mass with all the small manufacturers. It's about time to let those pompous pricks playing their little games aloe an move on with decent and honest business partners like Seiko and Miyota.

And I'll say it again... I think the Germans have plenty of room here to introduce a cheap auto movement and tap into this market.

"Swiss Made".... pffff... :beee:


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## Draygo

Drum2000 said:


>


Yep, that'll do it. :lookaround:



mach 0.0013137 said:


> It`s obviously all his fault!


Gulp.


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## Drum2000

Draygo said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, that'll do it. :lookaround:
> 
> 
> 
> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> It`s obviously all his fault!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Gulp.
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm sure we would *ALL* like to see more photos of your *NEW* Steinhart Ocean One . You know, the one that features the *ETA 2824-2* movement that are apparently *extremely* hard to come by. Yes, *MORE* photos please!


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## Kutusov

I want a black and white Steinhart Snowflake with a Miyota 9015... there!! A customer has spoken


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## Stinch

Perhaps they should go over to Sellita?

I was intially a liitle disappointed when a Laco that I ordered came with a Sellita SW200 rather than an ETA 2824-2. Then I remembered Roy saying some time ago that he thought the Sellita was just as good. The Sellita in in mine has in fact turned out to be slightly more accurate straight out of the box than my ETAs although I don't know if Laco carry out any work on them.


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## Kutusov

I honestly don't know if there is a difference between the SW200 and the 2824-2, they seem the same movement to me...


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## Phillionaire

I don't get it. The patent has expired on the 2824, hasn't it?? I thought there'd be a literal flood of clones to the market to compete.

So far there's only the sw200, valanvron 24 and the Asian st2130 that I know of.

There's probably more, but surely there's a massive market for a quality alternative at a great price. Especially if eta can't deliver on orders.


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## Drum2000

I'm sure that most of you are up to date but just in case here is a post from Maurice over on WUS -

* Re: Steinhart by Aramar Arctic Ocean*

Small update: I spoke with Steinhart and he told me to have a couple of watches ready in three-four weeks from now. I truely hope so, but this would be amazing. No pics of the watch parts yet, they are still in Swiss. Steinhart informed me that he has a back order now of 600-700 watches, thanks to these nice ETA guys................. I am busy at this moment via another supplier if I can get the ETA2824-2 myself and have them built in by Steinhart. If I can get them I will post it here immediately of course.


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## Kutusov

Jebus F Christ... 600/700 watches... That seems to me like a catastrophe for a company the size of Steinhart.

It's really a Catch 22 thing... I would ditch such a lousy business "partner" for a better one (lots and lots) but then people wouldn't want my watches because "Oh, it's no Swiss watch" ********.

I said before it's our fault as customers but then again, Steinhart motto is something like "Affordable Swiss", so he also put himself in the trap. Much easier for companies like Helson and such to use other movements.

I'm not even on the list any more but this kind of behaviour from the all mighty and powerful over the little guy always makes my blood boil... :taz:


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## dowsing

This is the latest over on watchuseek.

"Hi Folks, a new update on the Arctic Ocean. I managed myself to get 100 pieces through a Swiss contact of mine. The movements are really TOP ETA 2824-2 movements, meaning blued screws, Geneva stripes etc. etc. So that's very good news on the movements. I just got of the Phone and Steinhart told me he gave the manufacturer the order to start producing everything. Since the Swiss Holidays are upcoming he informed me to let you all know that the 100 watches will be ready end of August. For those wondering what the colour would be, it is exactly as shown in my pics, so dark blue. I am really excited about it that I finally can deliver the watches at the end of August!"


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## Kutusov

TOP grade? Without price increase? Well, at least that's a treat for you guys still waiting for this thing :yes:


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## mach 0.0013137

As the saying goes... good things come to those who wait :thumbup:


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## Drum2000

mach 0.0013137 said:


> As the saying goes... good things come to those who wait :thumbup:


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## mach 0.0013137

Re-reading the post on Watchuseek I realize the watch should be ready in time for my birthday







:jump: :yahoo:


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## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> Re-reading the post on Watchuseek I realize the watch should be ready in time for my birthday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :jump: :yahoo:


Which one?


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## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Re-reading the post on Watchuseek I realize the watch should be ready in time for my birthday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :jump: :yahoo:
> 
> 
> 
> Which one?
Click to expand...

The Snowflake of course 

There`s no news on the Marine so I`ll just have to keep waiting for that :sadwalk:


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## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> There`s no news on the Marine so I`ll just have to keep waiting for that :sadwalk:


The Polish one?


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## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> mach 0.0013137 said:
> 
> 
> 
> There`s no news on the Marine so I`ll just have to keep waiting for that :sadwalk:
> 
> 
> 
> The Polish one?
Click to expand...

I thought you meant the Steinhart Marine I`ve got on order, I`d forgotten about the Gerlach Dzik


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## Kutusov

Oh, I didn't know you had ordered a Marine... wonderful watches and, as usual with Steinhart, best bang out there for such things. I wished they did a 42mm version, the 44 uses the same case as the fliegers and they just don't sit right on my wrist for some reason...

I take it you've ordered the Roman version (well done!) as the Arabic is available.


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## mach 0.0013137

No, I ordered the Arabic version from Chronomaster .


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## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> No, I ordered the Arabic version from Chronomaster .


Bad move... you have PM reply :thumbsup:


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## Draygo

There's something going on with this project. I'm confused, though, as WUS have removed/locked the thread over there. Seems Aramar and Steinhart have fallen out? I've not heard from Aramar, though. Anyone care to enlighten me?


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## Draygo

From Aramar's website:

The Aramar Arctic Ocean:

Due to the fact that Steinhart has on-going delivery problems, we decided to stop with Steinhart. As you all might know we already sourced 100 pcs. of the ETA2824-2 TOP. Since we managed to get a factory to built the watches for us as well, the Arctic Ocean became a complete Aramar watch. The Aramar Arctic Ocean will be built by the orignial manufacturer of Steinhart and therefore the quality will be awesome, combined with the TOP ETA movements. The Aramar Arctic Ocean will be the launch of a totally new brand with many new models to come!

With a pic.

Aramar logo on dial.

But no direct comms from Aramar... which is disappointing, to say the least...


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## Drum2000

Dear,oh dear... The heart was a RACING after that first post! If I ever see this watch I promise to love and cherish until death do us part!


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## Kutusov

So much for all the talk about keeping the Steinhart logo on the front...


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## Draygo

"...with many new models to come!"

You know what that means, don't you, Renato?


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## mach 0.0013137

Drum2000 said:


> Dear,oh dear... The heart was a RACING after that first post! If I ever see this watch I promise to love and cherish until death do us part!


Very nice B)

Hmmm, I wonder if I could persuade them to put Services on mine instead 

Seriously, I`m quite happy with Aramar


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## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> "...with many new models to come!"
> 
> You know what that means, don't you, Renato?


I know what you mean... but it would be a nice xmas 2014 gift :lol:


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## dowsing

I've decided to pull out now and have emailled Maurice


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## Kutusov

dowsing said:


> I've decided to pull out now and have emailled Maurice


Well, now you've suddenly have funds to that next watch :sweatdrop:


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## Drum2000




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## Drum2000

Sent Maurice and e-mail requesting an update. His reply was as follows -

*Grovana is at this moment busy making the special parts for the watches. It will be app. 8 weeks from now. I will pay them a visit next week.*

*
*

*
**Best regards,*

*
*

*
**Maurice*

And there you have it. Anyone other than me still on the list?


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## mach 0.0013137

I`m still on the list & had a similar reply to an email I sent Maurice a week ago though mine didn`t mention how much longer we need to wait so yours is encouraging :wink2:


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> Sent Maurice and e-mail requesting an update. His reply was as follows -
> 
> *Grovana is at this moment busy making the special parts for the watches. It will be app. 8 weeks from now. I will pay them a visit next week.*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> **Best regards,*
> 
> *
> *
> 
> *
> **Maurice*
> 
> And there you have it. Anyone other than me still on the list?





mach 0.0013137 said:


> I`m still on the list & had a similar reply to an email I sent Maurice a week ago though mine didn`t mention how much longer we need to wait so yours is encouraging :wink2:







:lol: :lol:


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## mach 0.0013137

Patience is a virtue


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## Draygo

Drum2000 said:


> Anyone other than me still on the list?


Not me. I bailed a few weeks back, I'm afraid. Impatience, mild annoyance - and another watch - got the better of me.


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## Kutusov

Ok, something I don't get about this project...

1- The watch was announced, pre-orders opened and we got in.

2- First set back: there were no snowflake hands available, so it would take an extra month or two as they had to be made by some factory over at Switzerland.

3- Everything ready but Steinhart only got an hold on 40 movements, so the Snowflake had no movements and it would have to wait or Maurice would get them from another supplier.

4- As far as I understand it, that led to a major fall out with Gunther and the Snowflake went from being a Steinhart back to being an Aramar.

Fine, but what about the cases and dials and hands that were all ready? Now it seems that this watch will have completely new everything. What happened to what was said was already ready and just waiting for a movement dropped in? It makes no sense to me but maybe I'm missing some critical information as I haven't been following closely.


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## Drum2000

I'm not too sure that the hands were actually ready. Also surely, as any business, there must be scheduling issues. I doubt that Grovana downed tools on other projects to dedicate themselves to the Snowflake. I for one would very much love to have mine on my wrist asap and it appears that only Mach and I from RLT remain on the list. I suspect that there may be quite a few tongues wagging at the end of October. Good things come to those that wait... :yes:


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## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> I suspect that there may be quite a few tongues wagging at the end of October. Good things come to those that wait... :yes:


I hope so, for you guys sake...

But tell me... am I right or not in my event sequence? And, if so, what happened to all the movement-less watches that were announced as already made? I don't know who told me these, but the Grovana version will be an altogether different watch from a Steinhart... different case, etc.


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## therooster

Drum2000 said:


> I'm not too sure that the hands were actually ready. Also surely, as any business, there must be scheduling issues. I doubt that Grovana downed tools on other projects to dedicate themselves to the Snowflake. I for one would very much love to have mine on my wrist asap and it appears that only Mach and I from RLT remain on the list. I suspect that there may be quite a few tongues wagging at the end of October. Good things come to those that wait... :yes:


I am on the waiting list for the list. People dropping out is all gravy to me at the moment......


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## Drum2000

Kutusov said:


> Drum2000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I suspect that there may be quite a few tongues wagging at the end of October. Good things come to those that wait... :yes:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope so, for you guys sake...
> 
> But tell me... am I right or not in my event sequence? And, if so, what happened to all the movement-less watches that were announced as already made? I don't know who told me these, but the Grovana version will be an altogether different watch from a Steinhart... different case, etc.
Click to expand...

Well the dial would have to have been redone for a start.


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## Draygo

Just for the record, I really hope I live to regret losing patience. I want it to be a great watch. And I reckon it will be. As Mach says, Patience is a virtue. Just because I lost mine doesn't mean I don't wish the project well.


----------



## Kutusov

Draygo said:


> As Mach says, Patience is a virtue.


********... that's just Mach trying hard not to be a grumpy old man and I don't know why! :lol:


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## mach 0.0013137

Kutusov said:


> Draygo said:
> 
> 
> 
> As Mach says, Patience is a virtue.
> 
> 
> 
> ********... that's just Mach trying hard not to be a grumpy old man and I don't know why! :lol:
Click to expand...

I can`t be grumpy all the time, I like to take a break every now & then :beach:


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## Kutusov

mach 0.0013137 said:


> I can`t be grumpy all the time, I like to take a break every now & then :beach:


Ok, now we have a rational explanation... it's Mach's day off :thumbup:


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## mach 0.0013137

We apologise for any inconvenience, normal service will be resumed as soon as possible
​









ldman: 
​


----------



## Drum2000

Update. I just received this e-mail from Maurice -

Hi Dan,

The latest info:

> Hi Maurice,

>

> We must be getting very close now to delivery. Any news?

>

> Regards,

>

> Dan

*Hi Dan,*

*The latest info:*

*Grovana is busy at this moment sourcing all the parts for the watch, so everything is finally looking good right now! The problems were that everything had to be made from scratch especcially for this watch only. I expect it to be released in about 2-3 months time. We already paid Grovana and the supplier of the top ETA movements. *

*Best Regards*

*Maurice*

Read it and weep...


----------



## Kutusov

So there's stull not even a picture of how it is going to look?

This one is starting to sound like those MKII sagas...


----------



## Draygo

Drum2000 said:


> ...everything is finally looking good right now!


I've no axe to grind, as I pulled out a few months back, but I wonder to whom exactly Maurice thinks it's looking good... he certainly seems to be a half-glass-full sort of chap.


----------



## Drum2000

I ordered and paid for a watch in January when this thread was in its infancy. 288 posts and 10,866 views later I'm told it will be another 2-3 months. I think only Mach and I are still hanging on. Right Mach? Mach? Mach?...


----------



## mach 0.0013137

Drum2000 said:


> I ordered and paid for a watch in January when this thread was in its infancy. 288 posts and 10,866 views later I'm told it will be another 2-3 months. I think only Mach and I are still hanging on. Right Mach? Mach? Mach?...


I`m still in & BTW, I may be shortsighted but I`m not blind :blind:


----------



## Kutusov

Drum2000 said:


> 288 posts and 10,866 views later I'm told it will be another 2-3 months. I think only Mach and I are still hanging on. Right Mach? Mach? Mach?...


And don't forget the (now closed) WUS thread. It might still be a great watch (I hope so) but note that there isn't a single thing from the original project that still stands.... movement, case, etc. And I would still like to know what happened to the said ordered hand sets. Remember that that was the only thing initially said to be missing?


----------



## Chromejob

Did anyone ever get one? Pics? This model s beginning to seem like the Mk II Kingston....


----------



## Kutusov

Oh, yeah. They were delivered months ago. Drum and Mach have one, I don't recall anyone else that stayed for the long run. Ended up being an Aramar Snowflake, not a Steinhart.

Speaking of which, Steinhart ended up coming up with a blue sub but it's more of a Rolex look-alike than a Tudor. Still I reckon it might be something that spawned out of this project.


----------



## Drum2000

*Mine! All Mine!!! Bwahahahahahaha!!!!!*


----------



## mach 0.0013137

David Spalding said:


> Did anyone ever get one? Pics? This model s beginning to seem like the Mk II Kingston....


You asked for photos, here`s a selection of mine for you...









IMO it`s an excellent watch and worth the rather long wait I had to get it :thumbup:


----------



## richy176

They are currently taking orders for their Artic Marine with Black or Blue dial. Comes with a Miyota 9015 automatic movement, 28.800 beat per hour, 24 jewels.

Anyone know much about these movements and how they compare to the ETA previously used?


----------



## Chromejob

Ahhhhh! Lovely, Mach, thanks.

I believe Maratac uses Miyota movements in their Marathon watches, with excellent results.


----------



## Kutusov

People will disagree with me but for me they are better. Essentially the same specs, cheaper and better built. What I mean by this is what Eddie at TF reveiled about his experince shipping watches with both those movents. Some ETAs wouldn't survve the post but virtually ever Miyota did.

The Miyota is Citizen's, so a much bigger and experienced manufacturer om mass production... and Japanese. They are obsessed with quality control.


----------



## Wookie_66

Why they couldnt get that colour pip on the OVM??


----------



## Kutusov

Wookie_66 said:


> Why they couldnt get that colour pip on the OVM??


These watches ended up not being made by Steinhart, I think it was Grovana who made them.


----------

