# Services Pocket Watch



## Sparky

Hi, just received this little baby from the bay! It appears to run really well.

Does anyone have any information regarding it? i.e. manufacture date, country of manufacture etc. Any info greatly appreciated.










Regards

Mark


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## mach 0.0013137

Sparky said:


> Hi, just received this little baby from the bay! It appears to run really well.
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> Does anyone have any information regarding it? i.e. manufacture date, country of manufacture etc. Any info greatly appreciated.
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> Mark


Services were a Leicester based company, I don`t know when your watch was made but I have found that `Foreign` on the dial indictes that the movement and sometimes the whole watch were made usually in Germany.

Here`s some posts I did earlier on the company...



mach 0.0013137 said:


> I`ve been doing some checking on the Services Watch Co. Ltd., firstly at Leicester Reference Library.
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> The company is not listed in the 1925 edition of the Leicestershire Business Directory however it is in the 1928 edition (1926 & 7 weren`t available) they were still listed in the 1969 edition the latest one the library have.
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> The staff also found the following details from `companieshouse.gov.uk`a company called `Services Watches ( Sales) Limited, 23 Grosvenor Street, London W1K 4QL was incorporated on 29/03/1949 and dissolved on 26/11/2002.
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> I then decided to go and see John Mc Kay, Leicester`s oldest watch repairer ( well he`s @ 80 so I think he`s the oldest
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> Anyway he remembered Services and confirmed they were Leicester based.
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> He told me that they didn`t actually make watches just assembled them using movements and cases etc brought in (sounds like a lot of modern watch manufacturers to me
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Also check out this thread which includes photographs of a couple of the companies old factories....

English Pin-pallets


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## Sparky

Thanks for the detailed reply Mach! Very interesting.

Regards

Mark


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## mach 0.0013137

Sparky said:


> Thanks for the detailed reply Mach! Very interesting.
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> Regards
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> Mark


you`re welcome









I`ve just realised that link did not include these photo`s of the old factory bulidings....



mach 0.0013137 said:


> *Aviation/Services Factory, Tyrrell Street Leicester c1930`s*
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> *Aviation/Services Watch Co.Ltd Factory, 27 Bede St, Leicester, c1950`s)*
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> The building`s address is 25-27 Bede Street, the address I have for The Aviation Watch Co.Ltd is No 27, I don`t know if the whole building was used by the firm.
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> Anyway until a few weeks ago this still being used as a hosery or clothing factory but it is now up for sale as possible conversion to residential flats.


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## Guest

Hi,

Here is a Services watch I bought a couple of weeks ago.

















Rabbit


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## Sparky

Thats a nice looking pocket watch









Regards

Mark


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## mach 0.0013137

Rabbit said:


> Hi,
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> Here is a Services watch I bought a couple of weeks ago.
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> Rabbit


From my discussions with an ex-Services employee I gather that Services watches that had `Made In Gt Britain` on the dial were fitted with movements that were made by the Anglo-Celtic Watch Co.Ltd., Gurnos Works, Ystradgynlais, Wales. ( see here.. The Tick-Tock )


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## Andy2

Hi All,

Picked up a similar "Services" Army pocket watch, and lot of information posted here has been most useful. Very new to the whole poket watch ownership thing, and I was hoping someone can pass on some basic information such as good care and mantenance tips as well as how not to over wind the watch. Also any recomendataions for pocket watch repairers who deal with "Services" Watch Co? Happy to email pic's on request, couldn't get link to work.

Thanks.


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## mach 0.0013137

Hi Andy, welcome to the forum









You could try rytetime watch repairs based near Leicester, they are very good and Steve, the guy who runs it started out working for Services


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## AbingtonLad

Hey Mach, guess what - after all my abandoned attempts at buying a Services wristwatch off the bay (wonder why I didn't manage to get one? :lol: ) my mum revealed today that my granddad (who must have died 20 years ago) left something rather special which she had forgotten about...

A Services 'Army' pocketwatch! Isn't it strange how these coincidences happen.

And its as very lovely piece indeed. I will try to post some pictures tomorrow, snow willing. But in the meantime I can confirm that it winds well, keeps good time and is loud enough to drown out the television! Excellent. :thumbup:

I definitely want to get it serviced, and I think it needs a new 'crystal' - at the moment it just has a plastic cover, which fits extremely well but just falls off when you turn the watch upside down. I can't decide if this cover is original or not (though it seems to have a lot of wear).

Does your advice re using Steve at Rytetime still hold good? No idea who else to send it to - and I'm guessing this isn't Roy's bag?

Cheers!


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## mach 0.0013137

AbingtonLad said:


> Hey Mach, guess what - after all my abandoned attempts at buying a Services wristwatch off the bay (wonder why I didn't manage to get one? :lol: ) my mum revealed today that my granddad (who must have died 20 years ago) left something rather special which she had forgotten about...
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> A Services 'Army' pocketwatch! Isn't it strange how these coincidences happen.
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> And its as very lovely piece indeed. I will try to post some pictures tomorrow, snow willing. But in the meantime I can confirm that it winds well, keeps good time and is loud enough to drown out the television! Excellent. :thumbup:
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> I definitely want to get it serviced, and I think it needs a new 'crystal' - at the moment it just has a plastic cover, which fits extremely well but just falls off when you turn the watch upside down. I can't decide if this cover is original or not (though it seems to have a lot of wear).
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> Does your advice re using Steve at Rytetime still hold good? No idea who else to send it to - and I'm guessing this isn't Roy's bag?
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> Cheers!


Nice one :thumbsup:

Steve still Services my Services 

BTW I don`t try to nab all the Services on ebay, just the most interesting ones :lol:


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## AbingtonLad

mach 0.0013137 said:


> BTW I don`t try to nab all the Services on ebay, just the most interesting ones


Ha, I believe you but millions wouldn't 

So pleased to get this from my long departed (and much missed) g'dad. Must be honest and say its lost a few minutes since I wound it, earlier today, but like I care! The resonant tick-tick coming from the left-hand side of my desk is making me smile...


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## mel

AbingtonLad said:


> mach 0.0013137 said:
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> BTW I don`t try to nab all the Services on ebay, just the most interesting ones
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> *Ha, I believe you but millions wouldn't *
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> So pleased to get this from my long departed (and much missed) g'dad. Must be honest and say its lost a few minutes since I wound it, earlier today, but like I care! The resonant tick-tick coming from the left-hand side of my desk is making me smile...
Click to expand...

I'm one of those millions, anytime I miss one, I'm bl**dy sure it turns up later and Mac has it! :yes:

Sparky, that's a nice piece that started the thread, one that Mac let get away, or didn't know about. Lovely dials some of these old Services watches. They often seem to be mistakenly advertised as being "armed Services" watches by some sellers when clearly they were not all made for the Army, Navy or Airforce.









Mac is the guy with the knowledge on these, he's done a fair amount of research on them, and has some nice examples - Mac, can you post a photo or two of the collection please, go on - you know you want to! :yes:


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## mach 0.0013137

mel said:


> AbingtonLad said:
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> BTW I don`t try to nab all the Services on ebay, just the most interesting ones
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> *Ha, I believe you but millions wouldn't  *
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> So pleased to get this from my long departed (and much missed) g'dad. Must be honest and say its lost a few minutes since I wound it, earlier today, but like I care! The resonant tick-tick coming from the left-hand side of my desk is making me smile...
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> I'm one of those millions, anytime I miss one, I'm bl**dy sure it turns up later and Mac has it! :yes:
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> Sparky, that's a nice piece that started the thread, one that Mac let get away, or didn't know about. Lovely dials some of these old Services watches. They often seem to be mistakenly advertised as being "armed Services" watches by some sellers when clearly they were not all made for the Army, Navy or Airforce.
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> Mac is the guy with the knowledge on these, he's done a fair amount of research on them, and has some nice examples -
Click to expand...

I know what you mean Mel, check out the descrpition on this one Original WW2 Pilot's Wristwatch, "Services Airman" 

As far as I can tell this type watch was produced sometime after WWII to possibly sometime in the late 50`s. The dial is basically the same as my two-tone Newmark, from the little information I`ve gathered Newmark seem to have supplied movements, cases & possibly complete watches to other companies such as Services/Aviation, Stirling (the Airman`s case is identical to my Stirling), Guildhall, Horsham & Aircraft, I don`t know if any of these were associated with each other like Services/Aviation.



> Mac, can you post a photo or two of the collection please, go on - you know you want to! :yes:


Soon Mel, I`m waiting for a couple more to come back from Steve including something rather special which arrived last week from Germany :wink2:

BTW I am biding on a rather nice Services as we speak


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## Julian Latham

I have what is clearly a 3602 Molnija that is badged 'Services' - I'll try and post a photograph later today.

Julian (L)


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## mach 0.0013137

Julian Latham said:


> I have what is clearly a 3602 Molnija that is badged 'Services' - I'll try and post a photograph later today.
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> Julian (L)


That`s interesting, as far as I knew the pocket watches were made by *The Anglo-Celtic Watch Company Ltd* using Smiths movements, I presume yours has `Foreign` or `Foreign Made` on the dial.

Mind you Services did have watches made by UMF such as my Services Electric so it shouldn`t come as too much of a supprise for them to sell a rebadged Molnija :wink2:

*Services Electric, UMF #25 17 Jewels, circa 1970 *(`Made & tested for Services`)


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## AbingtonLad

And here is the (very) recently inherited Services Army pocket watch










Love the dial - nice and clean, with two-tone brushed and polished surface and excellent green numbering. Incidentally, this one says 'Made in Gt Britain' (as you can clearly see) whereas most of the wristwatches I've seen say 'Foreign Made'.

Mach, over to you...


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## Julian Latham

*The Molnija Services.*


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## mach 0.0013137

AbingtonLad said:


> And here is the (very) recently inherited Services Army pocket watch
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> Love the dial - nice and clean, with two-tone brushed and polished surface and excellent green numbering. Incidentally, this one says 'Made in Gt Britain' (as you can clearly see) whereas most of the wristwatches I've seen say 'Foreign Made'.
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> Mach, over to you...


Very nice, I may have to get one of those B)

As far as I can gather The Services Watch Company never actually made watches, they either bought in parts ie movements,cases, dials & hands which were then assembled in their factory (this is how Steve Burrage started his apprenticeship) or complete watches. I don`t know but presume they had the dials printed by the suppling manufacturer.

Over the years the following were printed on the dials..

`*Foreign*` or `*Foreign Made*` this was used on watches made in Germany(pre-WWII), Switzerland, France & post war East Germany (there maybe others I`m not yet aware of)

`*German Made*` used pre-WWII, some `Despatch Rider` & `Competitor` models have this & others have `*Foreign Made*` I presume that this could be for periods when Germany was, shall we say out of favour with the British public eg either just after WWI or the late 1930s.

`*Swiss Made*`` *Swiss*` & `*France*` have also been seen on dials.

`*Made In England*`which appears to have been used on watches using parts/complete watches made/supplied by Louis Newmark Ltd., Perfect Works,Stafford Road, Croydon, Surrey.

`*Made In Gt Britain*`made by the Anglo-Celtic Watch Co.Ltd., Gurnos Works, Ystradgynlais, Wales



Julian Latham said:


> *The Molnija Services.*


Very nice Julian, if you ever want to let it go :wink2:

This is the second Services I`ve come across which doesn`t have it`s country of origin printed on the dial, the other was a quartz that was made in Hong Kong.

BTW do you have any idea when it was made, as far as I can tell Services ceased trading sometime around the late 70s /early 80s.


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## pg tips

Kev, that's a beauty!


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## pg tips

I have this Smiths which I bet has the same movement. Can't find it at the moment, house is upside down, am decorating ... again :no:


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## pg tips

And here's my timex with a movement pic.


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## mel

Julian's Molnija is a wee beauty - that dial is something like Uncle Roy should use if he ever gets round to a Pocket Watch - Railroad Special-ish, maybe a more modern font for the figures, but certainly as clear as that! :yes:


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## AbingtonLad

pg tips said:


> I have this Smiths which I bet has the same movement. Can't find it at the moment, house is upside down, am decorating ... again :no:


That's pretty sweet too! (Oh god, wait until the 710 discovers I'm now showing an interest in pocket watches).

I'll probably send mine off to Steve as per Mach's suggestion, and I might ask him to take a picture of the movement when he gets the back off (I'm still shying away from prying things open).

I've just noticed that I need a chain loop thingy as well. Good job I'm minted :no:

The back of mine is completely devoid of any markings and I guess this is pretty much standard for Services of this era.

Good old (step) granddad. He had size 16 feet, taught me how to skin a rabbit, made me into a champion darts player (ish) and left me this pocket watch. What more could a boy ask for. :notworthy:


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## AbingtonLad

Incidentally, Steve (RyteTime) tells me the 'plastic' glass is likely to be some kind of Perspex, which may be original and has shrunk until it now plops out when you least expect it.

No rude jokes.


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## bridgeman

well-have just acquired Services black faced pocket watch-looks exactly like the silver one on this thread with the chain for style-previous owner and I cannot get in the back-presume just the usual press on which now needs tlc to press off-rather than screw.? Its press in crown to set..Any advice welcome-chris


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## bridgeman

brute force got it off-asked wife to help.says great britain inside and 67-just to try and time it now .


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## brgkster

i think i have two of them, they have being relaxing in a drawer for 5 or 6 years now.


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## mach 0.0013137

brgkster said:


> i think i have two of them, they have being relaxing in a drawer for 5 or 6 years now.


Photographs would be interesting :wink2:

Oh & welcome to :rltb:


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## brgkster

i will try in a few days, but i am not very tech minded, and it seems daunting.


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## mach 0.0013137

brgkster said:


> i will try in a few days, but i am not very tech minded, and it seems daunting.


This might help...  Photography Hints And Tips


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## brgkster

thankyou.


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## brgkster

Rabbit said:


> Hi,
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the one i have has the logo similar to this but worn, the movement has made in great britan on it also the no.72, the case is almost perfect, plus with a share it started to run, considering i have not tried it in a number of years is an achivement


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## brgkster

Rabbit said:


> Hi,
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the one i have has the logo similar to this but wornoff, the dial has all the numbers bar 6 joined with 3 circles, close togeather, the movement has made in great britan on it also the no.72, the case is almost perfect, plus with a shake it started to run, considering i have not tried it in a number of years is an achivement,


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## Chascomm

I saw a 1920s/30s Services pocket watch at my watchmaker's a couple of weeks ago. I can't remember if it was marked 'Foreign' or 'Made in Germany', but it was a re-branded Thiel Brothers (forerunner of UMF Ruhla). So I droppped into a technical bookshop, found a pocket-watches book and looked up Thiel Bros, and found that besides supplying Services, they were also sold branded as 'Champion', which is interesting as the East German-built Ruhla Electric (cal 25 and 26) from the 1960s was also sold both as 'Champion' and 'Services'.

More recently my watchmaker has been trying to tempt me with an absolutely spotless no-jewel 'York Lever' by Kienzle. Seems like there was quite a tradition of German-made British-branded cheap watches.


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## Welsh Wizard

mach 0.0013137 said:


> From my discussions with an ex-Services employee I gather that Services watches that had `Made In Gt Britain` on the dial were fitted with movements that were made by the Anglo-Celtic Watch Co.Ltd., Gurnos Works, Ystradgynlais, Wales. ( see here.. The Tick-Tock )


 Not quite sure about that. The watches that were manufactured at the Gurnos Works in Ystradgynlais were predominantly Smiths/Ingersoll . I have copied a link here which hopefully you are able to download. It was a fascinating setup and interestingly it employed more female workers than male counterparts, something completely unusual in those days. 
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwirvdOU2_zxAhUIV8AKHTZZA-EQFjABegQIAxAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fhistory.powys.org.uk%2Fhistory%2Fystrad%2Fanglo1.html&usg=AOvVaw3Kpb8Qs1aIVBFAy1WHkfkf


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## spinynorman

Welsh Wizard said:


> Not quite sure about that. The watches that were manufactured at the Gurnos Works in Ystradgynlais were predominantly Smiths/Ingersoll . I have copied a link here which hopefully you are able to download. It was a fascinating setup and interestingly it employed more female workers than male counterparts, something completely unusual in those days.
> https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwirvdOU2_zxAhUIV8AKHTZZA-EQFjABegQIAxAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fhistory.powys.org.uk%2Fhistory%2Fystrad%2Fanglo1.html&usg=AOvVaw3Kpb8Qs1aIVBFAy1WHkfkf


 Your link goes to the same place Mach's does



> ( see here.. The Tick-Tock )


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