# Never Seen This One Before



## MIKE (Feb 23, 2003)

Spied this on E-Bay, can't say I have seen one before. Not sure as I would want it either at nearly a Â£1000









Looks a right "hotch pot" to me

Description

_Vintage O&W - Ollech & Wajs Watch_

INCABLOC

All Stainless Steel

Slide rule bezel for 2nd timezone

Screw down crown

Automatic

17 Jewels

20 ATMOS Waterproof

Spot the deliberate mistake in there









Pics from listing



















Mike


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

Not to sure what to think of that, again haven't seen one before but that's a lot of money









As for the mistake, there's a couple... the slide rule bezel could be used at for a second time zone but I can't see the inner ring and how you could actually use the slide rule


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

PhilM said:


> Not to sure what to think of that, again haven't seen one before but that's a lot of money
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I agree with Phil. It doesn't look like a slide-rule to me. I've never seen one before.....could be a franken.

The dial markers are reminiscent of Squale and Aquastar divers of the time.


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## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

If that's a genuine and original O & W I'll vote Tory!!!


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

MIKE said:


> Spied this on E-Bay, can't say I have seen one before. Not sure as I would want it either at nearly a Â£1000
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I think what the seller means is that it is a bidirectional 12hr friction bezel and inner tachymeter chapter ring.


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## Fulminata (Feb 23, 2008)

Griff said:


> If that's a genuine and original O & W I'll vote Tory!!!


I agree with Griff.

Its a wrong-un and no mistake, a real cut-and-shut job.

The only thing I like about it is the ship on the back. Does anyone recognise that from anywhere?

And how are you supposed to use the tachymetre scale without the means of stopping the second hand, short of unscrewing the crown?

Nonsense at any price, but Â£1k.


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

Fulminata said:


> Griff said:
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> > If that's a genuine and original O & W I'll vote Tory!!!
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Definitely too expensive by a factor of 10 IMHO









The weird second hand looks like that seen on some Enicar Sherpa divers too









Doxa Subs, pre-Synchron, used a sailboat on the back if I'm not mistaken. I believe that some Tissot divers and/or Yacht timers used a boat/ship as well. Not the best idea given that Blue Peter was already on air by the time these watches were made.  Almost implies that they are made out of toilet rolls and bits of sticky-backed tape


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

DaveE said:


> Fulminata said:
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Hi everyone,

I am a newcomer here







and also spotted it on eBay.

I like this Watch, please can you help me decide what price to offer on it, since he will accept offers and will refund if its NOT 100 % Authentic.

I would take the risk


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## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Yves said:


> DaveE said:
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10 Rupees


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## blackandgolduk (Apr 25, 2005)

Yves said:


> DaveE said:
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I definitely wouldn't take the risk - the only thing O&W about this is the dial. You'd have to be able to 100% prove that the watch is a franken and this could be difficult. If you've got up to a grand to spend on a watch, there are far more worthy candidates out there...

Just my tuppence  Hope it helps!

EDIT: You could also try to email a pic to Mr. Wajs - he may be able to confirm the watch's origins... Just a thought.


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

blackandgolduk said:


> Yves said:
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Thanks indeed.

I am gonna ask him to email me pictures of the inside movement, hope will know more there


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

Yves said:


> blackandgolduk said:
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Missed out your idea: Can you provide e-mail pls ?


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## kpaxsg (Mar 11, 2008)

no link to live auction also in this forum









seller : weddingbands-are-forever

a little too pricey even if it is the real thing IMHO...


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## Fulminata (Feb 23, 2008)

Sorry Yves, the only offer I'd make the seller is the use of this...










Best to do some serious digging on this one, as it doesn't look or smell right to us.









Here's a prediction: the seller can't open the case and Mr Wajs disowns it.

If you want a one-off, speak to Roy at RLT. He'll sell you a proper O&W and do some sensible mods to your requirements, and it won't cost you Â£1k.

Use of my skip is free.


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2008)

The only thing I like is the sellers ebay name







...sounds very reputable to me 

all the best

Jan


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

JHM said:


> The only thing I like is the sellers ebay name
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Thanks everyone for the assorted replies and images









Does Roy from RLT knows better about this Watch ?

The seller looks to be a honest guy with 100% +fb and a few Watch buyers.

I am awaiting his response about showing the inside of the Watch.

Will wait a bit more before decide,

I like you forum guys, very friendly and to the point









Yves


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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

My take is this..

Unless you *know* what that watch is and *know* that its worth aprox Â£1k ( lets face it he wont take offers of Â£100 will he) then all you have is his word that its worth a lot of money, some of the guys here who have commented really really know their cheese and this ain't looking like good cheese.

He might be an honest guy and might have bought the watch as rare to sell on, that doesn't make it real.

He may also not be as straight as he seems, you just don't know.....

You could get a fair few genuine, recognised classic O+Ws for this kind of money, have a browse of the O+W section in the photo gallery at the top of the page to see some of our members examples, like I say, unless you are certain you know different, please trust the people here who are....

We/they are only trying to help not see you burned....


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## Robert (Jul 26, 2006)

Am I looking at the right auction? Has he changed the description?



> The Black ring outside turns around (2nd timezone ?)
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> I have asked a few experts and nobody knows about this Model
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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

I think hes changed it...

Its the same guy that sells Â£900 Aviations for Â£2k









Good for him I guess, but thats ebay for you...


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

I've checked all of my O&W catalogues, but this watch is not in there. That doesn't mean it's not kosher as I have vintage O&Ws that are not shown in my catalogues.

I've also checked out the eBay seller. He is selling a lot of O&W watches (overpriced Aviation chronographs) that probably come from Albert Wajs. Thus, on balance, I do not think it is a fake. However, it could still be a franken.

In conclusion, I think that the issue as to whether it is real, fake or franken is besides the point. Even if the watch is a rare kosher O&W, it is never worth Â£1000. You don't see Moon Orbiters or Early Birds going for more than Â£350-400 so why should this one be worth more than double what these 2 desirable watches fetch? It makes no sense to me. As I hinted earlier, this one is worth no more than Â£100 IMO. It wouldn't be so bad if it was a looker. However it is not.


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

Forgot to add in my first post, that crown looks a bit suspicious as well


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

PhilM said:


> Forgot to add in my first post, that crown looks a bit suspicious as well


I agree. That could be a crown that refuses to push in and screw down. Well worth a question to the seller on this point.


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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

Well, thinking about it and re-reading his spiel, I think he probably did get this from Mr Wajs, ( the 'First Hand' he talks about ) that must be where he gets his Aviations from...

The price tag is stupendously optimistic though...As has been said before, its not a good looking watch


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

Oh well after seeing the watch and then seeing how much it's gone for... afraid somebody has got a bit of a unique time piece here









Edit: What it is with the second hand, that dosen't go with the watch either ...


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

PhilM said:


> Oh well after seeing the watch and then seeing how much it's gone for... afraid somebody has got a bit of a unique time piece here
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Think will just leave it as it is too rare and unknown, unless will find some reliable reputation about it.

Thanks for all you care.

Is the early bird available in nos condition ? and for what price ?

Yves


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## Yves (Apr 16, 2008)

Yves said:


> PhilM said:
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> > Oh well after seeing the watch and then seeing how much it's gone for... afraid somebody has got a bit of a unique time piece here
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Bravo !!

I told the seller in my email that we were discussing this watch and the other Aviation watches on a Forum (didn't told him where).

He replied now that he found you guys in here, and he is happy to get the real prices for the watches since he got them from the Family of a late Jeweller who bought them directly by Ollech & Wajs in Zurich 40 yr ago. They are asking very high prices and he adds a small profit + ebay and PP costs and those are the outcomes.

He tried to tell them that the prices are too high, but they reffered him to a Website where they sell the 18 K Watches for 6000 EURO









Now i have a job to prove the real prices and maybe we gonna get Beauties for cheap









Do you guys have history of sales for those very same Watches ?

Yves


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

Might be worth having a search on the forum


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

Yves said:


> Yves said:
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It doesn't matter whether another website shows them advertised very expensively. It only matters what price they sell for. I bet those 18 kt watches remain unsold at 6000 Euros on that website! I think your seller needs to consider finding another supplier.

Here, the acid test is what price they will fetch in a global market such as eBay, that is if they they are priced sufficiently competitively to sell at all! If they are too expensive, they won't sell unless some gullible fool and his money are soon parted. It's as simple as that.


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## DaveE (Feb 24, 2003)

PhilM said:


> Might be worth having a search on the forum


It's worth trying the other watch forums too for wider coverage to see a true cross-section of O&Ws sold. Always worth doing a completed items search (advanced search preferences) in eBay as well because market prices are constantly fluctuating.


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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

The 'real' market price is a ebay auction with no reserve and no schill bidders..

Has he got the balls for that?


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

I want him to sell the Aviation's for as much as possible..


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