# Seiko J or K



## Guest

recently i contacted the Seiko Japan head office to try and put to rest the issue of the J and K on some Seiko's

i asked them whether J was made in Japan

here is their vague response

Dear Mr. Fraser,

We acknowledge receiving your inquiry. We thank you for your interest in our products.

To begin with, please be advised that we do not have any concern about information 
posted in watch forums on the Internet. Due to this, we are not in the position 
to make any comments on such information, even if you ask us about it.

"Seiko" continues to produce watches not only Grand Seiko's but also other categories. 
Such watches have a marking of Japan as the country of origin.

On the other hand, as any other Japanese manufacturers do, 
"Seiko" has expanded its production sites outside Japan in several different facilities.

Furthermore, the quality of all watches manufactured outside Japan is equally controlled 
as is the manufacturing standard in Japan by Japanese management. 
Thus, there is no difference between Japan-made and outside-Japan-made products.

We hope the above is a satisfactory answer to your inquiry.

Since we receive tons of inquiries every day from many customers in general 
and accordingly we would like to treat inquiries about repair service and purchase as well preferentially, 
we might not spare time to reply to you even if you raise any additional inquiries. 
Thank you for your understanding.

With best regards,
CS Dept.
SEIKO WATCH CORPORATION
************************************************************************
Information supplied by our customers will only be shared within the SEIKO organization and its associated entities. 
The above is just our response to the sender of this inquiry and should not be presented to any other person(s) and entities.
************************************************************************

i am a little disappointed with the reply especially as a recently posted youtube video showing the difference between a J and a K 007 or 009 i forget which, there was clearly a difference, but was this just a one off?

i suppose Seiko cant be expected to admit there is a difference [ if there is ] as this would obviously affect sales [ as it already does ] if it became common knowledge

i wish i could find the email i got from them a few years ago where they clearly stated J was Japan and K was Kuala lumpur, but then maybe their manufacturing priorities have changed since then, i guess we can read between the lines though and as Kev said in the other post,maybe J and K are destination countries rather than origin

its all still as clear as mud :biggrin:


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## hughlle

Pretty surprised by that last section. Essentially unless you are contacting for warranty or purchasing, you're not worth our time and effort.

And forgive me if I'm wrong, but quality control does not equal build quality. They might use the same level of coontrol as in Japan but that doesn't therefore means they are the same quality product.


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## Guest

hughlle said:


> And forgive me if I'm wrong, but quality control does not equal build quality.


 i think you are right Hugh, it simply means set standards will continue even if the standards are low, unlikely with Seiko though i would have thought, although i still believe a watch built in Japan will be better than one made in Malaysia :yes:


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## richy176

If the workforce is trained to the same standard and the management is Japanese then there is no reason why the quality should be lower.

Wonder how many people check where their car was made?


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## hughlle

richy176 said:


> If the workforce is trained to the same standard and the management is Japanese then there is no reason why the quality should be lower.
> 
> Wonder how many people check where their car was made?


 That would simply mean there is the same level of quality control. No matter how well trained the staff, if the boss man said we are using X stainless steel because it is a bit cheaper, training won't change the fact. The watch will meet seikos level of QC while being of lesser quality.

Take a restaurant as an example. 2 identical teams if chefs in regard to training and capability. Give one a piece of fillet and one a piece of brisket, both will be cooked with the same care, attention, within FH specification etc, but one is still a better quality piece of meat.


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## richy176

And is there any evidence that they do use different quality materials? That would be down to company policy rather than local management.


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## hughlle

This is all hypothetical and speculation. The point is that 2 factories using the same quality control procedures do not have to make the same quality product. Seiko have neither confirmed or denied anything, responding with an email which means squat in terms of the actual question at hand. Quality control does not equal quality.


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## Guest

i think there are 2 scenarios:

they make identical watches in Malaysia and Japan and the Japanese watches are superior maybe due to work ethics

or

the J and K watches are all made in Malaysia and the quality varies slightly

either way its probably not in Seiko's best interest to admit fully to either as it would affect potential buyers

i would buy either J or K, but given the choice if the prices were the same i would only buy J marked watches and that is only because of the perception that J is better.

one thing is without doubt though, if the word Japanese is anywhere on the watch it IS made in Japan :yes:


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## TONY M

I saw the video last week comparing the K and J SKX009s. Worth watching however I have owned several SKX007/9s all of them the K version and with a close inspection there were many significant minor differences in the fit and finish between them. You could not tell from a distance and I was hesitant to say which one I preferred but the differences were there.

Tony


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## graham1981

Bruce said:


> Since we receive tons of inquiries every day from many customers in general
> and accordingly we would like to treat inquiries about repair service and purchase as well preferentially,
> we might not spare time to reply to you even if you raise any additional inquiries.
> Thank you for your understanding


 Like Hughlle I find this bit of the response particularly surprising bordering on rude IMHO I could almost read this as 'We as a company like to take your money as a customer but don't you dare question us about our manufacturing process' Unfortunately that seems to be quite a prevalent attitude nowadays :angry:


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## Guest

graham1981 said:


> Like Hughlle I find this bit of the response particularly surprising bordering on rude IMHO I could almost read this as 'We as a company like to take your money as a customer but don't you dare question us about our manufacturing process' Unfortunately that seems to be quite a prevalent attitude nowadays :angry:


 i get what you are saying, but see it from Seiko's point of view [ i am not defending them in any way].

imagine if the reply read: thank you for your enquiry, we make two standards of Seiko watches......the superior Japanese made watches and the lesser Malaysian made watches.

that would be a PR disaster

personally..i think there are J marked seiko's that are made in Japan with a better overall finish than the K marked ones, but there probably are not many



TONY M said:


> I saw the video last week comparing the K and J SKX009s. Worth watching however I have owned several SKX007/9s all of them the K version and with a close inspection there were many significant minor differences in the fit and finish between them. You could not tell from a distance and I was hesitant to say which one I preferred but the differences were there.
> 
> Tony


 thats interesting, i wonder if there would be any noticeable differences in a group of J marked ones?

the plot thickens :yes:


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## TONY M

Bruce said:


> ...thats interesting, i wonder if there would be any noticeable differences in a group of J marked ones?
> 
> the plot thickens :yes:


 No idea, differences in the monster cases are also noticeable with the K versions as well as minor differences in the dial (lettering, lume colour etc).

Tony


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## graham1981

Bruce said:


> i get what you are saying, but see it from Seiko's point of view [ i am not defending them in any way].
> 
> imagine if the reply read: thank you for your enquiry, we make two standards of Seiko watches......the superior Japanese made watches and the lesser Malaysian made watches.
> 
> that would be a PR disaster
> 
> personally..i think there are J marked seiko's that are made in Japan with a better overall finish than the K marked ones, but there probably are not many
> 
> thats interesting, i wonder if there would be any noticeable differences in a group of J marked ones?
> 
> the plot thickens :yes:


 I can see what you are saying Bruce and do agree. However if a company is producing goods in two different places (and lots of companies do, not just Seiko) and those goods incur different costs that should be passed on to the customer, some companies do pass the savings on, their high end offerings may be made in one country and their lower end products made in another but as a customer you don't mind as you are paying less for the lower end products ( I have seen the same on Cameras in the past)

At least they are employing people in the end I suppose !


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## Guest

graham1981 said:


> I can see what you are saying Bruce and do agree. However if a company is producing goods in two different places (and lots of companies do, not just Seiko) and those goods incur different costs that should be passed on to the customer, some companies do pass the savings on, their high end offerings may be made in one country and their lower end products made in another but as a customer you don't mind as you are paying less for the lower end products ( I have seen the same on Cameras in the past)
> 
> At least they are employing people in the end I suppose !


 i think the cost are different though, there seems to be a price difference between the K and the J, is that customer driven or Seiko driven?

i think sometimes silence can be deafening and Seiko's response to my question says a lot if you read between the lines, but at the end of the day regardless of where their watches are made, i still like Seiko and always will


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## Damo516

Thanks for the read, was about to post asking about J or K seiko's seeing as I've just had a nosey for prices on the bay.

What would people suggest given the price difference?


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## SBryantgb

Hmmm are replacement movements also designated J or K?


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## Montybaber

Looking from Seikos perspective Its a very awkward question to answer, they know that every word will be scrutinised by watch enthusiasts the world over, i am not surprised they have played it safe.

i wonder how much of the emails 'tone' can be put down to the language etc but i agree it does sound a little harsh, i am wondering how many times they have answered this particular question over the years 

i love what Seiko do (i admit i am a bit of a fanboy) but i think its sometimes worth considering that the cost of a SKX J or K watch is less than a replacement bracelet link from some other watch manufacturers, the quality does vary and as an owner of two 'K' divers i think the J are probably worth the premium (from what i have read/seen) that said the 'K's i have are wonderful watches for their price

Thanks for posting OP it is a genuinely interesting subject, am i right in saying that the only guarantee on buying a genuine Japanese manufactured/assembled Seiko is by adding the word 'grand' to the dial?


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## SBryantgb

The letter suggest a tone of equal quality between the two places of manufacture, but that Japanese is better.... because for no other reason other than it is Japanese. However they weren't going to say that.


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## Roger the Dodger

I did some research on this several years ago, as there were urban rumours that the J stood for 'Made in Japan' and the K for 'Made in Korea'.... or J meant the watch came with a bracelet and K meant a strap....and this is what I eventually found...

Seiko J1 and K1 models

FAQ: What's the difference between Seiko J1 models and the K1 models.

The J1 models are for the Far and Middle East markets. They have the days in English and Arabic. They have to say 'Made in Japan' on the face. Some have a rubber strap, others have a bracelet. The J1 models often have a shorter bracelet to suit the smaller wrist of that market place.

The K1 models are for the European market and they have the days in English and French/Spanish. Again, they can come with a rubber strap, or a bracelet, but for the European market, they have the full size bracelet*. *





* There is absolutely no difference in build quality.*


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## Montybaber

It would make me laugh if after all these years people have been paying more for a 'J' not knowing all they were getting was a shorter bracelet

:laugh:


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## TONY M

Damo516 said:


> Thanks for the read, was about to post asking about J or K seiko's seeing as I've just had a nosey for prices on the bay.
> 
> What would people suggest given the price difference?


 Given the price difference I would buy the K version for no reason other than it is cheaper.

Tony


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## Guest

i doubt we will ever know for sure, its not in seiko's interest to confirm or deny IMO


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## Roger the Dodger

Roger the Dodger said:


> I did some research on this several years ago, as there were urban rumours that the J stood for 'Made in Japan' and the K for 'Made in Korea'.... or J meant the watch came with a bracelet and K meant a strap....and this is what I eventually found...
> 
> Seiko J1 and K1 models
> 
> FAQ: What's the difference between Seiko J1 models and the K1 models.
> 
> The J1 models are for the Far and Middle East markets. They have the days in English and Arabic. They have to say 'Made in Japan' on the face. Some have a rubber strap, others have a bracelet. The J1 models often have a shorter bracelet to suit the smaller wrist of that market place.
> 
> The K1 models are for the European market and they have the days in English and French/Spanish. Again, they can come with a rubber strap, or a bracelet, but for the European market, they have the full size bracelet*. *
> 
> * There is absolutely no difference in build quality.*


 Thanks for the 'Likes'.....but please don't take this as read.....this was a bit of research I did about 4 years ago...I think the above was copied and posted from the SCWF*

* Seiko and Citizen Watch Forum.


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## Justinoliver

As far as I know Seiko 'J' stands for Japan made and Seiko 'K' for Korea... Since Seiko also has its manufacturing units in Singapore & Malaysia , there is also a possibility of manufacturing it in any of these countries. And also the series for J & K , there may be a price difference of 10% .

For Deals on all Fashion , Luxury Watches & Smartwatches -  Best Watch Deals


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## Guest

Justinoliver said:


> As far as I know Seiko 'J' stands for Japan made and Seiko 'K' for Korea... Since Seiko also has its manufacturing units in Singapore & Malaysia , there is also a possibility of manufacturing it in any of these countries. And also the series for J & K , there may be a price difference of 10% .
> 
> For Deals on all Fashion , Luxury Watches & Smartwatches -  Best Watch Deals


 have you been eating Spam for breakfast ?


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## Bob Sheruncle

Bruce said:


> have you been eating Spam for breakfast ?


 He doesn't sell the watches, it just directs you to various sites selling them at that price.

Can't see the point.


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## Guest

Bob Sheruncle said:


> He doesn't sell the watches, it just directs you to various sites selling them at that price.
> 
> Can't see the point.


 probably his site.

there was a new member a couple of weeks back, who was trying to promote a watch site, he made the mistake of using his own name as a user name for TWF which coincidently turned out to be the same as the owner of the web site based in exeter in devon [ not rog :laugh: ] funny how they always get caught :yes:


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## Roger the Dodger




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## Justinoliver

Bruce said:


> have you been eating Spam for breakfast ?


 I'm Sorry if you feel that as a spam. I believe I have provided an advice that I know.


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## Guest

Justinoliver said:


> I'm Sorry if you feel that as a spam. I believe I have provided an advice that I know.


 first post with a link, doesnt look good

why would you post a link that has absolutely no contact info, seems a bit dodgy to me IMHHO of course :yes:


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## Justinoliver

Bruce said:


> first post with a link, doesnt look good
> 
> why would you post a link that has absolutely no contact info, seems a bit dodgy to me IMHHO of course :yes:


 Hey man, that site lists only deals and they are not merchants .The site lists the watches from various merchants. We are not retailers.


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## hughlle

Justinoliver said:


> We are not retailers.


 So you joined this forum for free advertising.. not very cool 

Hence calling it out for the spam it is.


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## Justinoliver

hughlle said:


> So you joined this forum for free advertising.. not very cool
> 
> Hence calling it out for the spam it is.


 Sorry man. I joined this forum to receive updates on latest watches in market. I dont want to my website to promote it with a limited number of users.. The website was started by our group of friends as a startup . So , please dont mistake us. This is our first Startup. Please dont mistake us that we are using watforum only for promoting.You can also provide feedback on how the site looks and how can we change it for the users ? :thumbsup:


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## Guest

Justinoliver said:


> Sorry man. I joined this forum to receive updates on latest watches in market. I dont want to my website to promote it with a limited number of users.. The website was started by our group of friends as a startup . So , please dont mistake us. This is our first Startup. Please dont mistake us that we are using watforum only for promoting.You can also provide feedback on how the site looks and how can we change it for the users ? :thumbsup:


 you just admitted its your website !

had you introduced your self and explained who and what you are things may have been different


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## artistmike

Justinoliver said:


> Sorry man. I joined this forum to receive updates on latest watches in market. I dont want to my website to promote it with a limited number of users.. The website was started by our group of friends as a startup . So , please dont mistake us. This is our first Startup. Please dont mistake us that we are using watforum only for promoting.You can also provide feedback on how the site looks and how can we change it for the users ? :thumbsup:


 I'd give up digging if I were you .... :biggrin:


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## Guest

artistmike said:


> I'd give up digging if I were you .... :biggrin:


 :laugh:


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## Justinoliver

I m Justin Oliver from Manchester , U.K. I am doing my education in Computer Science at University of Manchester . My Favorite Watch brands are Seiko, Citizen , Daniel Wellington . My favorite Luxury watch brand is Omega ( But i dont have any ) . Me along with my friends decided to start a company on 'Deals on Watches' as we are more interested in it . That gave rise to Best Watch Deals  . This is a new company and we are trying to build it as a brand.. Hope I have introduced enough to ur satisfaction. :yes:


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## Guest

Justinoliver said:


> I m Justin Oliver from Manchester , U.K. I am doing my education in Computer Science at University of Manchester . My Favorite Watch brands are Seiko, Citizen , Daniel Wellington . My favorite Luxury watch brand is Omega ( But i dont have any ) . Me along with my friends decided to start a company on 'Deals on Watches' as we are more interested in it . That gave rise to Best Watch Deals  . This is a new company and we are trying to build it as a brand.. Hope I have introduced enough to ur satisfaction. :yes:


 too late, TWF is not a wagon for your ventures IMO


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## artistmike

Justinoliver said:


> Justinoliver said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is a new company and we are trying to build it as a brand..
Click to expand...

 If I were you I'd pack up the advertising or speak to the owner of this site and pay him a fee for the privilege. If this is you first venture into business, you're not very good at it .....


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## BASHER

Bruce said:


> too late, TWF is not a wagon for your ventures IMO


 Quite. . . .

Your advertising strategy is not acceptable. . . . .


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## hughlle

Maybe get someone taking business management to join you  your marketing strategy is truly awful. In 5 posts of attempted advertising all you achieved was to drive people AWAY from your business 

In short. You're doing it wrong


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## Guest

its amazing, the truth always comes out :yes:


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## richy176

One problem with building a website is that you then need people to find it and that often means getting ranked on the first page or two by the search engines.

I did a Google search on `best watch deals' and it came up with 356,000,000 results so not an easy category to get yourself noticed.

It is claimed that you can get a higher rating by getting good back links - links from other sites to your site. The search engines do not just count the number of sites that are linked to yours but also look at how popular the other site is and how relevant it is to your site and so any watch forum is a magnet for people building a website about watches.

I agree with all the other comments - talk to Roy and offer payment in return for the use of the forum - otherwise just go away.


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