# Digital Camera Purchase



## ron

I am considering buying my own digital camera. All my picture posts upto now have been taken using a digital camera borrowed from work.

I want my own camera









I don't want to spend a fortune (ideally Â£200 max)

I'm thinking seriously about the *Kodak DX6440*

Anyone got any thoughts / comments?


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## Nalu

Guess I should have posted this here instead of the Watch Forum [







]



> Ron,
> 
> I've owned two Olympus cameras (3030Z and now a 5050Z) and have been quite pleased. I bought them because Light & Motion makes great U/W housings for them and that was the primary purpose, but I've ended up using them for holiday photos, medical photography and now watch photos. The 5050 is particularly nice for watch photography with it's super-macro mode. They are good all-round cameras with decent lenses (compared to my Nikon flm cameras that is), great color fidelity, and good durability.
> 
> The 5050's menus are complex and you'll need to spend time learning the functions you'll use by heart (esp for U/W photography when the camera is housed and there are other things going on like air supply, current and sharks ). Unfortunately, the camera comes with only a 16Mb card, but you can keep two carsd in the camera, meaning you can have upwards of 512Mb of memory in the camera at any time.
> 
> LMK if you need more info or example pix


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## ron

Whoops!

Not your fault Colin - I think you posted there before I actually started this thread here..

I just replied to your post in the other Forum anyway!


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## pg tips

Hi Ron, My advice would be to go to your local retailer (Jessops, Boots etc) and handle some cameras first. Get a feel for how they handle and how easy they will be to use.

I made the mistake of buying off the spec's and although I love the camera and get great results it is rather fiddly to use at times and makes me wish I'd popped into Jessops first!

Having said that can't fault it for the price to results ratio. I was particually pleased with the shots of the RLT4. Took me a couple of hours and dozens of shots got deleted but well worth it.

btw don't forget if you want good close up shots get a good macro spec. Mine goes down to 6cm.

And think about the praticalities of use, has it got a tripod screw mount in the bottom? If you want to go deeper think about wether you would want to add filters to the lens, or even change lenses, some very nice digi SLR's now but a bit pricey. They will get cheaper eventually.

Also think about manual settings. Auto every thing is great but there are times when you will want to try a manual option.

Ask about battery usage. I would strongly recommend getting one that takes standard AA bateries and bying some 2100 mah Ni-MH rechargeables. Most digi cameras eat NRG esp if you use the screen all the time.

When you finally make your mind up search the net for the best deal. Mine was Â£399 retail in John Lewis, I got it for Â£256 from Amazon.

PS I use Samsung digimax V4.


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## Stan

Ron,

I agree with PG completely. Don't forget, many local shops will often price match so do some price checking on the net and take a printout into a local shop and ask if they will match the price, you have nothing to lose.

Digital cameras do go wrong, software fails to install properly or some other problem can occur. If you buy locally from a retailer that provides tech support you will be much safer.

Think about an extended warranty if it is no more than 10% of the purchase price, digital cameras will cost a minimum of Â£120 to repair if out of warranty.

Consistently good manufacturers are Canon, Nikon, Olympus and Fuji. Most other "camera" manufacturers products can be relied upon also.

Try to avoid makes that are most well known for other than photographic items.


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## ron

PG and Stan - thanks to you both for the good advice - much appreciated

I still fancy the Kodak (it gets a *very good review* in todays Sunday Times)



> Mine goes down to 6cm.


The Kodak's macro spec says: "wide - 10 - 60 cm (3.9 - 23.6 in.); tele - 25-85 cm (9.8 - 33.5 in.)". Full details *here*

I will have a look at some "in the flesh" though - I think that's a good idea

Thanks again for the advice, and I'll keep you posted (pun definitely intended!)


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## Stan

Ron,

Look for a close focus capability of less than 10cm at 90mm for macro work.

Good for watches.

Manual exposure control and focusing is also a boon for taking small objects close up.

Just some tips.


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## ron

> Look for a close focus capability of less than 10cm at 90mm for macro work.


Will do

I'll try to have a good look round over the next week or so (on the net and in real life)

I'll also probably run my intended purchase past you guys here as well, before getting out the plastic!

Thanks Stan (and PG!)


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## Silver Hawk

Hi Ron,

Take a good look at the Canon A80 --- very nice little cameras with full manual override in all areas and a very close macro lens

Cheers

Paul


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## ESL

Hi there,

I have used a Nikon 4500 for about 18 months and you get superb shots with it. It is a brilliant 4MP digicam if that is what you are in the market for. There is a review of it here:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikoncp4500/

The shots I took of an Omega f300 Chronograph on the sales/swaps forum are an example of general and some hand held close-up work.

I now have a Nikon 2100 as I did not really need the full bells and whistles on the 4500. It should be OK but is only 2.1MP and may not be what you need. I will get some shots taken with the new camera on the forum when I can, as I always looking to make improvements to my shots.

Cheers.


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## ron

Paul & ESL - many thanks for that

I'll certainly look at all models mentioned (at least on the net, if not in person)


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## Roger

Ron

I have had an Olympus C40 Zoom for a while and that has been satisfactory in all respects. I recently updated to a Sony DSC 717, but the Olympus I also use because its 4 Megapixel and small enough to slip in youir shirt pocket.

My advice, go for the most megapixels you can afford and beware of some lesser brands that have a chunk of plastic for a lens.

Roger


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## namaste

Ron, I bought a camera a month ago and asked for the same kind of info, and here's what I found:

PG's samsung digimax V4 has very good reviews, and can be found at a very good price with some searching. Paul's taken some great pictures with it so I can only be impressed.

Stan's comment about brands is very true: Kodak cameras take pictures in"proprietary" format, which means you need their software to edit them and import/export/share them. (Not sure if it's the case with ALL there cameras).

And he's also right about the macro: 10cm is poor for macro. Look at 1-4cm.

Silverhawk mentions the A80. I bought the A60. Only 2M pixels, but I didn't want more. It's got a good macro (4cm), full manual control ability, and good performance.

ESL mentions Nikon 2100: that was my alternative. Price was the decisive factor for me: the Canon A60 can now be had for Â£99 at Amazon. For double that, you should have a good 4M pixel camera.

Check pricerunner for best prices...


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## namaste

PS: if you only want a camera to take pictures of watches, Casio made excellent cameras wit huge zooms and amazing macro (1cm!!!) such as the one used by our host and master photographer. I have only been able to find them used on ebay...


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## ron

Roger & Pieter - more sound advice - thankyou both

I wasn't aware of Kodak's proprietary picture format - I think that's









Having said that, the tech specs for the Kodak do say JPEG - so for this model at least, that wouldn't be a problem

My problem now is that there are more options than I thought! (ie of good reasonably priced cameras)

Would you believe a saw a 6.6 Megapixel one for Â£130? (yes, 6.6!). I'm not buying it though - if something looks to good to be true, it usually is









It was on a gadget site and caught my eye (yeah, I know...)

I'm convinced though now - from forum advice, talking to friends and people at work, that the best option is to spend a bit more on a good 'brand' model - ie Canon, Olympus etc etc

Pieter - I had a look at the A60 you mentioned on Amazon. One of the reviewers mentioned that pictures taken with it were (in his opinion obviously) better than some taken with 3Megapixel cameras... The spec for Â£99 does seem very impressive

Can I ask a favour? Did you take any watch photos with your A60? If so, is there any chance you could email me a couple of pics taken with the A60 (at max resolution). Or post an example, if easier?

Alternatively, if you have used any A60 shots in a previous post, could you direct me to the picture in the post?

Hope you don't mind me asking this









Decisions, decisions, and a lot to think about...


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## Stan

Ron,

The A60 is a good camera but it's not as good as the A70, trust me.

The A60 is "cheap" in build quality compared to the A70, though my Canons have always been good cameras at the price charged. The A 80's LCD screen is a little small compared to the other two but the output is very good.

The dearer the camera, the better the resolution, the lens quality and the implementation of the firmware. Yes, some are marginally better than others "in certain areas" but only by a minimal amount.

You do get what you pay for in most cases. Buy from a good retailer. 

Buy the camera that "feels" right to you, ergonomics is a very important issues with cameras. If you don't like it, you won't use it.


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## ron

Hi Stan



> The dearer the camera, the better the resolution, the lens quality and the implementation of the firmware. Yes, some are marginally better than others "in certain areas" but only by a minimal amount.


Yes - you're right. If I got a 2MP camera now, I can see me just wanting to replace it in a year or so.

I think whatever camera I go for, I've decided on 4MP. That's one decision made at least!

One of the guys at work gets Which? magazine, and I asked him to bring in the latest issue that reviewed digital cameras. He actually has just given it to me while I'm writing this - and it's the February 2004 issue! Talk about good timing. I'll read that tonight. Hopefully I'll get some more pointers from that.

I think this weekend will be the best time to go round the shops and handle them - then onto the PC to find the cheapest price. Asking the shop to pricematch is also a good idea.


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## Roger

> Would you believe a saw a 6.6 Megapixel one for Â£130? (yes, 6.6!). I'm not buying it though - if something looks to good to be true, it usually is


Ron,

Beware some brands, especially Fuji claim to be 6 megapixel when, in fact, the CCD is just 3.....its a software "trick"

Roger


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## pmsbony

I got a kodak 6530 for christmas (5mp) the zoom is good, battery life is pretty good (compared to other cameras people I know have). i have played with some pictures in the macro mode and they are not too bad, you can see the detail quite well, although it depends very much on the ambient light to get a good shot.

The 6530 was purchased from amazon for Â£199 - a good price for a good camera.

the images come in jpeg format. The issue with kodak's own format, is more to do with the easy share software than anything else - so far as I can tell. All I use the kodak software for is to copy the images to my machine, then fiddle around with them in another imaging software (either PSP, photoshop or fireworks) as the tools on the easy share software are not that great.

Pete


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## pg tips

Take the which report with a pinch of salt. They are generalising on what the average person would use one for. They marked the Samsung down purely on it's low battery life (IMO) which is true, but Â£20 on a good recargeable set and your in business.

Someone mentioned lenses. In all probability the most vital part of the camera, if it can't get a decent image to start with it ain't ever gonna be good! If you look at the non big camera brands you will see some of them use very good quality lenses such a schneider etc. If a cheap camera has a cheap lens it could have 100 million pixels you still won't get top quality.

Been over my dad's this morning he's photography nuts. The latest mags are all raving about the canon's EOS 300D looks fantastic but at nearly a grand a bit expensive for every day use


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## ron

Hello Pete - the Kodak 6530 seems worth a look - I'll check the exact spec tonight. Thanks

Hi Roger:



> some brands, especially Fuji claim to be 6 megapixel when, in fact, the CCD is just 3.....its a software "trick"


The 6.6MP one I was referring to earlier used this same trick - the blurb says "3.2-megapixel CCD which, when combined with some cunning software trickery, produces 6.6-megapixel images". Mmmmm. It can be seen here if anyone is interested!

But that one is NOT on my shortlist. You get what you pay for - and so on.


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## ron

Hi PG - I agree - the Which? idea was just to get more info and spec details. I like the way they lay out the specs in a table form - so you can read across and compare the resolution of 10 cameras at once, and so on.

At the end of the day it will be my decision - I think I'll probably end up printing this thread out and highlighting the 'potentials' based on specifications - then try to see and handle as many as possible in the flesh this weekend.

When I do make the decision, I think I'll also post it here - before I buy it. Then, as long as nobody replies with something like "don't do it!" - that will probably be the one I buy.

Finally - I would just like to thank everyone very much for taking the time and trouble to respond to this post. The information you have all provided has been extremely useful, and I'm sure I'll end up with something good - hopefully in the next week-10 days


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## ron

Decision?

Yesterday I looked in Boots, Jessops, Currys etc at cameras.

Saw PG's Samsung Digimax V4 in Boots - was able to handle it as all the cameras were laid out (attached by security cords etc)

I must admit - I am being drawn to this model as the one..

I can get it (delivered) for under Â£204 - *see here for details*

*Price / quality - fits my requirements exactly

*Size - fine (smaller than the one I borrow from work)

*Macro mode - 6cm (so fits the "less than 10cm" needed for watches)

*Results - I have looked at PG's RLT4 pictures on this forum. They are very impressive, and taken with this make/model

I won't ever want to get "professional" with the camera I get - so lack of ability to attach filters (for example) just is not an issue.

The (I think very good) price and proven results of this camera are leaning me to it. I looked at other cameras - but all were let down by one thing or another (for me personally) - ie some were too small, some had everything but a good macro spec etc etc

So - unless anyone says "don't do it!!" - it looks like I'll be placing an order for the Samsung Digimax v4.........


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## namaste

Can't find better than your 203.99 Ron, you've done some searching! I would have gone for the same camera if I'd had another Â£100 to spend (instead those Â£100 are going towards a Poljot!). I can't even find ANY 4M pixel camera at a price that comes close. The quality of Paul's pictures was enough to convince me.

The only thing is that the retailer you found is as a rule not the cheapest, and when they come with a competitive price, someone else beats them a week later or so. But you can't wait forever, I bought a new camera a month ago and 2 weeks later it went down in price by about %20









The big downside for you is that everybody will expect you to post pictures the same quality as Paul's







!!


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## ron

Hi Pieter



> The quality of Paul's pictures was enough to convince me.


I think that (and the price) is what's convinced me too

I agree with your comments about "the retailer" (Dixons in case anyone's wondering!) being the cheapest etc. True, but like you said, I have to buy it sometime. The price is also an "internet only" price - though I dare say there's a possibility of 'persuading' them to price match themselves in a store.



> The big downside for you is that everybody will expect you to post pictures the same quality as Paul's !!


Well - I'll try!


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## Sargon

I've said it before but http://www.epinions.com/Digital_Cameras is a very good link to reviews and places to buy. I got an Olympus C-4000 based on what I read there for very cheap and I absolutely love it.


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## ron

*Just ordered a Samsung Digimax V4*

Not an easy decision - but that was the one I felt was right in the end.

Sargon - I looked at http://www.epinions.com/Digital_Cameras - and agree it's a very useful site (have bookmarked it). Both your C4000 and the V4 I just ordered get excellent reviews.

When it arrives (hopefully this week) - the first pictures posted will be of my







Gammamaster watch







!









Thanks again to all who posted advice - much appreciated


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## Stan

Good for you Ron, I hope you enjoy it.


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## pg tips

Nice one Ron. Took mine up to Newcastle last weekend for the obligatory shot of the bridge etc. Really is a great all rounder. I set mine on the easy mode and let my 4 year old take some shots and they are really quite good.

Remember to get some decent rechargeables for it and your away. For everyday snaps just use the easy mode at the middle size setting and you'll get about 100 or so pics on the 32MB card.

For taking watch pictures just practice and see what works best. It will come eventually.

I think I should write to Samsung for a commission!


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## pg tips

Here's a shot my baby took (she's 5 in May). Alright I've got a flat top but that's only because she stood a bit too close. Just shows what a good camera it is. Had it set on Apature priority at it's max (f6.7) so as to get good depth of field as she was supposed to get the bridges in the background! I'm obviously bringing her up right as she got a good shot of my "4" in the frame as well!!


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## ericp

Nice shot.....

WOuld have been nice to see Mrs. Tips shoes though.


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## pg tips

She had her black leather knee length boots on Tim!!!


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## ericp

Snap !!!


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## Stan

PG,

I noticed the "4" and how you had your cuff pulled up just enough to show it off. 

Do we all walk round with our sleeves rolled up in winter? Yes we do, that's why watch men are HARD! (or mental).
















Tim,

What type and colour of boots?


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## ericp

Black leather knee length, 3 inch heels. I bought them from Ravel.


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## ericp

And a Schumacher Omega on my wrist....

perfect


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## Stan

Tim,

I can see you in my mind's eye, riding the Harley Davidson.
















Cool.









My turn. A pair of 23 year old Royal Stewart brouges (well bulled on the instep), Levi 501's and a Nike sweatshirt. As I'm in fatigues the watch can't be a dress watch.

Oh, I drive a black Ford KA.









This might do it?


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## pg tips

Stan said:


> PG,
> 
> I noticed the "4" and how you had your cuff pulled up just enough to show it off.


 Walked round Newcastle most of last week with the watch showing and no one said a bloody word, not even the wife's parents. Mind you dad wears his fake qtz datejust he got from saudi years ago so what does he know?!?!

Nice s/h America's cup in Goldsmiths btw if anyone's interested Â£900 and the Jewelers at Royal Quays outlet has those new mechanical Rotary's for Â£180. The had a huge bright red fossil chrono (qtz) that I saw on Sunday and left, went back Monday to get it and it had gone!

Apart from those the North east had nothing of interest really unless you want to pay over inflated retail. Mind you didn't get chance to get to Tynemouth station car boot on sunday so I bet I missed a bargain.


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## Stan

PG,

No one noticed the RLT4? The bugger's must be blind!

When you're a grandfather, you will have the pleasure of saying " yes, I have an RLT4, one of the last, true English watches. It is comparable with some Omega's of the day, you know."

The you can do a Grandpa Simpson and go into instant sleep mode.









RLT = Omega? Well, perhaps. Similar parts bin, but the attention to detail is better on the..........

RLT.


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