# O & W Mirage 111



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

The watch is Â£549.

This is the one with 7750 Valjoux movement, i.e. the dog's twitcher of chronograph movements, and the version with operating day as well as date.

The case is heavy, solid, and polished, and in the vein of a Sinn case.

The dia. is 40mm ex crown, and the thickness is 14mm

The lugs are meaty, and by far the most impressive of the O & W range. It is very reminiscent of a Sinn, but more original.

The screw down crown has many turns to the thread, feels very substantial

and positive, and without any hint of a cross threading tendency.

The pushers are also polished, feel very solid and positive, and give a clear

and reassuring click.

The bezel is black st. steel pvd, and is flat, substantial, and with a very positive click on turning. It lines up exactly with the 12 position, and as Roy will tell you, I have eyes that pick out the fly s*** from the pepper.....I kid you not!

The sapphire is 31mm dia. and a tiny midges proud of the flat bezel. To all intents and purposes, it is flat to the surface of the watch.

The hands are white with very tasty narrowing to pointed ends, that give a very clear and sharp dial read.

The dial is a positive black with no slate grey look, the numerals clear and sharp Arabic, and so the whole watch has a very military appearance, and oozes substantial quality.

This is not a watch where the movement sits in a polythene insert, and is very soundly screwed down to the inside of the steel case. The movement looks fully integral to the case. This observation told me this was a real watch of superb quality. The dials are 30min., 12 hour, and continous seconds in a clockwise order of 12, 6, and 9.

The dial hands are smack on the button, and return to such on reset.

The accuracy looks impressive, but not fully determened yet, but it has to be remembered that this is a movement with a superb regulator device.

The movement is breathtaking, and is an impressive 30mm dia.

25 jewels, incabloc, 28,800A/h, 4Hz, power reserve 42hr., hack seconds, and quick set day/date.

This watch is a collectors piece of superb quality, and I believe it is the best

O & W so far by a long way.

It sits heavy but comfortable on the wrist, and it is an eye catcher to others.

I am not a natural O & W eye watering fan, but I'm a big new fan of this particular watch, and consider it to be one of my best finds so far!!


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

Glad you like it Griff,

Very good review.


----------



## Andy (Feb 23, 2003)

Any chance of a pic


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)




----------



## Andy (Feb 23, 2003)

Looks very purposeful.

That Valjoux 7750 seems to be the definitive auto chrono movement in watch enthusiasts circles.


----------



## Garry (Feb 25, 2003)

Griff,

Are you trying to do me out of a job of writing reviews for Roys watches?....... 

G.


----------



## Superted (Jun 17, 2003)

Hello,

Been lurking for a while but thought it was time I said something! I really like the look of this watch but always find it hard to envisage the size of watches, and as my wrist isn't huge I reckon that sort of thing's quite important..so can anyone do a pic of it next to, say, an O&W diver or similar?

Thanks a lot


----------



## Guest (Jun 18, 2003)

Griff

You are right when you compare it to the Sinn Flieger 103. The O&W is to all intents and purposes identical.

Same movement as well although O&W is a couple of hundred cheaper so got to be a good buy.

Sinn pictured below.

Cheers,

Neil


----------



## Superted (Jun 17, 2003)

I've often wondered, do these companies just go and order stock parts from the same manufacturer? Nothing wrong with that if the end result is good quality I suppose. Kobold make a very similar watch too but their website says something along the lines of designing all their own watches, so I don't know what to think!

Cheers

Tim


----------



## Andy (Feb 23, 2003)

If Fred Bloggs the arranger changes a few notes and harmonies in Beethovens 5th Symphony he can write on his score.

BEETHOVENS 5TH SYMPHONY

arranged: Fred Bloggs

Get my drift


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

There are very few good quality case and dial makers. Many watch manufacturers buy the parts from the same places.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

This Mirage 111 is utter Cream!!!


----------



## Superted (Jun 17, 2003)

What's the lume like Griff?

Thanks!


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

The luminosity is excellent, and bright.

All the O & W's are very good for this.

You would NOT be disappointed with this watch.

I am NOT easily impressed as Roy knows only too well.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Congratulations Griff. I do like these, the case on the III is much better for this style of watch than the dressier lugs on the II.

I often think of getting one of these. I think if I actually had one to look at it would be easier to decide. Or harder to resist maybe...

I'd appreciate your thoughts on these queries:

Do you find the colour of the lume onthe numbers and the hands match well? In daylight I mean. I found that not to be the case on the M5.

What is the strap like?

What does the watch come in/with?


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

The strap is a US oiled black leather strap, good quality, softish. comfortable, with st. steel buckle. It's a good strap.

The dial is either to your liking or not. It is to mine, hence my purchase.

It is white hands and numerals on a very black dial, in a very military style of the kind I like. I have to say, I DO like the M5, and have one of those also.

The Mirage 111 though is a division up in the Premier League.

It comes with a chrono leaflet and a plain but nice box.

If you like the Sinn, then you like this.

It's EXTREMELY well made. Exceptional build quality

It's really whether it rings your bell or not Simon, but mine has been well dinged!


----------



## Superted (Jun 17, 2003)

I like it..but don't have Â£550 lying around at the moment unfortunately!

I have an M1, which I have had for a year and absolutely love, but in some ways it's a slightly frustrating watch just because it's sooo close to being perfect but doesn't quite get there..

extremely accurate (about -3s a day), good looking, wonderful dial, 200m, comfortable, great value...

But (and I'm being 'discerning' here!)I just wish the M1's bezel would line up, the bezel dot was centred in the triangle, the crown fitted the guards better, it had a sapphire crystal.. and it has to be said that while the dial does glow very well this isn't much use when the hands do not. All tiny changes which couldn't put up the cost much.

Sapphire crystals aren't expensive, whatever the manufacturers tell you..

As I say, I really do like the M1 , just a few tiny niggles really


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Thanks Griff, as I said I do like these, thanks for the review.

My M5: in many waysd I really really liked it. I liked its weight and size, compact and not a very heavy watch, in the long run it was very comfortable on the wrist and I wore it a lot. There were a lot of good things about it.

But I must agree with Superted: a bit more care in manufacturing would make the M series so much better. Such as: lume brightness and colour matching - both very poor on my M5, sorry O&W fans, I like these watches too but I'm just being honest.

Not very good bezel action at all, and I agree the luminous dot on the bezel is not centred. And not luminous for that matter. The smaller dots around the bezel on the M5 not luminous.

As said above: so close to being perfect. I am about to get an M4 to fit Bill Yao dial to, so I do thnik these watches are great, how about a little more quality control?

The Mirage though must according to what Griff says be finished to a much higher standard than the M series. If I am convinced of this I will eventually get one of these.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Simon,

That's all fair enough, and you take as you find. All I can say is I've not had ANY of the snags with my M5 that you have described. Maybe Roy can comment on any variations in production. Mine is a good 'un.

Back to the Mirage 111, re: Accuracy

Have adjusted mine with the dead easy and superb regulator pointer, and the gain is 1.5 s per day!! I am well chuffed.

A special mention of the bezel..........it's a cracker. It's very meaty, ultra positive, smack on the markers, and looks VERY impressive.

The 7750 movement is SUPERB!


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

The bezel dots on all the M series watches are luminous.

All the dots on the M5 are luminous.


----------



## Guest (Jun 20, 2003)

Simon

I think you are being a little picky on a Â£150 watch.

The O&W's are a superb Swiss watch for the money, I was impressed when I had one.

I have got what I consider better watches in a similar style but they are nearly 10 X the price!

Cheers,

Neil.


----------



## Mrcrowley (Apr 23, 2003)

Just looked at my M4 in the darkest situation I can find in the afternoon. It looks fine. For a screw down crown, it is very easy to handle one handed. Yes they are light, which sometimes puts me off. However rest of build quality & looks are great. My wife doesn't think there's much between the two at all, so refers to it as the Sub. Is that a compliment?


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Yes I realise I am being critical. Obviously I wouldn't be getting another one if I didn't think they were good value for money. Likewise, I owuldn't be considering a Mirage if I didn't think highly of them. I did try not to disparage anyone in my post but obviously not too successfully.

Â£150 or not, a little more attention to detail / fresh lume wouldn't cost a lot. The hands on mine are very hard to see in the dark even after exposure to light in comparison to the numerals, which are not bad but not good for a new watch. The bezel clicks on mine are quite imprecise and do not without a bit of a tweak line up too well.

Yes the dots are meant to be luminous, but on my M5 the lume is virtually non-existent and ineffective in the dark, particularly the small dots around the bezel. Just telling it like it is, and of course it may not apply to all M5's. I suppose the point of my post is this: Roy sells many watches for O&W, they would value his feedback and maybe make an improvement or 2 that would cost virtually nothing.


----------



## Superted (Jun 17, 2003)

That was my point as well really, as I said I love my O&W and would definitely recommend it, it's just that the slight niggles could so easily be remedied by the makers.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

How do you think the Mirage III would look on a bracelet? Is there one available for it?

Griff do you feel the Mirage III is better finished than the M series and in what way? Or does the extra cost only reflect the more expensive movement?

Sorry for all the questions but I do like these a lot; if I thought the minor details I mentioned applied only to the M series I would go for one.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Simon,

The Mirage 111 is 14mm thick, so I think a standard bracelet may not look right. I think it would need a specific bracelet for its model, or is best on a strap as I am going to do with mine.

Surely I've already said enough about its build etc. What more do you want to be told about it Simon. Read my review again. I've nothing really more to add except to repeat the build quality is excellent, and the 7750 movement is superb!

It is a league up from the M series, but it is a more expensive watch, and you get what you pay for!


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

It would look great on a Swiss sold oyster bracelet.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Sorry for all the queries Griff, you did do a very comprehensive review.

As well as liking thse Mirage, at the moment I am going through a decision making process about getting an Omega "Moon" like you have done so hence my interest.

No substitute for having one to actually look at.

Roy: the bracelet on your site for the M series: would it match up well in finish with the Mirage III case?

Is it possible to remove the case back to look at the movementadjust it without affecting water resistance? I was told not.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Re: Accuracy:

I can report that after a little tweaking, this watch is now gaining 1 s in THREE DAYS, which means it is now my most accurate mechanical watch, I kid you not!!!


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

Simon, Yes the bracelet would match. No water resistance cannot be guaranteed once the back has been removed.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Hi Roy, could you at some point post a pic of the Mirage on a bracelet? I think it would look very good, whereas the lugs on the earlier Mirages would only suit a leather band.


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

I beleive Grif has fitted one to his, how about a picture Griff ?


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

I did fit a bracelet, but only to try it.....didn't really prefer it, so it's now back on a black leather strap, and may try a military strap later, so I'm not opting for metal bracelet on this particular watch, unless I can find a particularly heavy steel mesh type bracelet as got by Chrisb from Eddie, so no pic. to post just at the moment!


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Hello all

I remarked above that I had an M5 which I was not that happy with in a few minor ways.

I traded that in against another watch, but I really liked the M series size and shape, and was thinking of a Bil Yao dial/hand set so I ordered a no date M4 off Roy.

It arrived this morning and once I managed to get it out of the packaging ! I was really delighted with it









Its bezel action/precision is much better than on the M5, and the lume is, well, luminous, much better again than my M5. It is immaculately finished.

I think it looks much better in no-date form, the date bubble was just a little bit much on a relatively small dial.

The big surprise was the bracelet, I think this is exceptiional value (the M5 was on a NATO) and suits the watch and my wrist perfectly. Roy's pin tool makes sizing it easy.

Thanks Roy, great watch and excellent for the money, by any standards actually.


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

Thank you Simon,


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Re accuracy: Can confirm this is still an astonishing 1 s + per THREE DAYS.

I kid you not.................this is my most accurate mechanical watch to date, although I'm sure there was an element of luck with the adjustment.

I think the 7750 movement, at the risk of repeating myself, is about the finest auto chronograph movement around.

Would be interested on a thread on auto chronograph movements if anyone feels like starting one up.

How about 7750 v 3133!!!........Garry......you about ****!!!!?


----------



## Garry (Feb 25, 2003)

Still around Griff. Works been mad lately, that's why I've not been on much. Off on holiday on Monday for a week. I'd be interersted in starting an auto chrono thread, because we all know very well the 3133 is the mutz nutz......... 

G.


----------



## Garry (Feb 25, 2003)

...........Hang on a minute, the old brains not working. The 3133 is manual wind...









G.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

I posted a new thread a while back about chrono movements, Lemania 5100 vs Valjoux but it did not carry on for long, maybe you could resurrect it, people might be more interested now this new Mirage is out, and there is lots of Speedmaster talk.

That is incredible accuracy Griff. That's quartz territory.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Yeah..........I know.......but it's true. It maintains this when kept fully wound on the wrist. If left laid down it goes to + 1 s PER DAY as it becomes less wound up. When fully wound again it goes back to 1 s + in THREE days.

I'm utterly amazed by it........but it is no exaggeration!!


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

I like them a lot, Griff, and would like a 7750 but am arranging to buy a Speedy off Roy at present so until that is paid for I will not be buying any expensive watches.

Was the bracelet you tried on it one of Roy's that come with the M series O&W? I would have thought it would look well on it. But as you say it is a nice strap with the stitching.

I will see if I can find that chrono thread and get it going again.


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Can't find that thread.

Talking of chronos though, aren't the Breitling Top Time and the Kraiko fantastic! on the Recent Arrivals bit.

Rather like that Kraiko but am otherwise committed.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Simon,

Yes it was an M series metal bracelet I tried. It did look ok, and it did fit, but as a 7750, the case is a little thick at 14mm, so the bracelet links that fit to the case could have done with being a little bigger, so they fit more to the top of the case, if you get what I mean. The M5 bracelet looks fairly good on it, but I've ordered a brown leather Nato off Roy as I think it will look the danglers on that, and give it a real military look. I'll be in the mood then to drive up Ben Nevis in a Land Rover lightweight with canvas hood!!!


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Hi Griff

I know what you mean about the end links. Pity.

I like those leather NATOs, I tried one on briefly, but it might make an already chunky watch sit high on your wrist.

Post a pic whenyou get it.

Cheers

Si


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Simon,

Yes, I have thought about that, and you may well be right, but the leather gets softer and flatter as it gets worn, but I'll also have it for my other watches, and I like swopping straps/bracelets around a lot on different watches.

It may be you don't need two layers under the watch as you tend to do with the nylon Natos.

The accuracy of the watch though is incredible!!!


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Hi Griff

How accurate was the Mirage before you regulated it?

Good to see someone happy with their purchase.

The other thing with NATO in leather is that they can be quite hard to fit between spring bar (or fixed bar) and case. Maybe Roy's are a finer leather than the one I tried.

I like straps though, they are great craftsmanship in themselves, eg Sirtoli.

Not too many people making perforated ones though for my Heuer though. I might just get a nice strap and find a leatherworker / saddler to perforate it for me.

I do like that Mirage, I will have one eventually, unless something equally good value with a 7750 comes along.

Just now I am finding myself a bit partial to 70s chronos though.

Si


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

When I first got it it was losing 3 s per day.

The leather strap has just arrived and it is quite fine.

Not tried it on the watch yet, but will later when I get home from work.

There is a 7750 Swartz Etienne for Â£300 on Roy's site under S in the Vintage section if you want a cheaper 7750.

For a new 7750 I doubt you'd find cheaper than the Mirage!


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Like the strap Roy and thanks for the '53!!


----------



## Foggy (Feb 25, 2003)

> thanks for the '53!!


'53, as in Omega military issue airmans watch from 1953 ?? Enquiring minds want to know









Cheers

Foggy


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

Thanks Griff,

No Foggy just a 1953 Omega.

I still have the '53 airmans.


----------



## Foggy (Feb 25, 2003)

Thanks Roy

For a minute there I thought Griff had captured one of the holy grails of watches for the military enthusiasts  (not that there's anything wrong with other Omega's from 1953, of course - pics when you're ready, Griff







)

Cheers

Foggy


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

The military '53 Omega I have is for sale if there are any takers ?


----------



## Foggy (Feb 25, 2003)

Hello Roy

I thought that one was a keeper









Any idea of a price ?? (I doubt I'll be in the running as I already have one, but you never know)

Cheers

Foggy


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)

Can't keep anything, need the brass.

Make me a silly offer Foggy


----------



## Foggy (Feb 25, 2003)

Hi Roy

I'm afraid I'm in the same position - spent far too much lately. I would say to anyone else on the forum who is interested in the '53 - get one now whilst you can 

Cheers

Foggy


----------



## Andy (Feb 23, 2003)

Picture ?


----------



## Roy (Feb 23, 2003)




----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

My actual Mirage 111, with the 1s + gain in three days!!!!:


----------



## john b (Jun 11, 2003)

Beautiful....


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)

Have now put this on one of Roys oyster st. steel bracelets, and it does fit and feel extremely good. I'm convinced this suits the watch very well, and provides a good contrast to the black pvd st steel bezel.


----------



## Andy (Feb 23, 2003)

A superb looking piece.

You made a good choice there Griff...


----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Hi Griff, could you post a pic of the Mirage on its bracelet? I think it would look great on a suitable bracelet. I find that I avoid leather in this weather - metal feels much more comfortable.


----------



## Griff (Feb 23, 2003)




----------



## 036 (Feb 27, 2003)

Very nice Griff, thanks for the photo. They are a good bracelet I think - it can seem to have alot of lateral give but they are very comfortable and quite well well finished for the money.

It is a pity the maker does not offer a choice of end pieces for the bracelet as this would make it much more versatile.


----------



## Mrcrowley (Apr 23, 2003)

Mmmm

Not been overexcited about those. However, seeing it on a bracelet has very much changed my views. Can't have one yet though. I have others in the pipeline, then my credit card will have to go into rehab for a while


----------

