# Sea-gull St19 Movement Pictures



## James (Jul 17, 2006)

I know I posted older pics of this movement used in the Sea-Gull and Alpha, these are a bit better quality. Just got 3 in for a lil project kind of. Anyway always enjoy looking at movements as its more important to me than the actual watches. Since no Chinese forum just posting here for now. These are more generic not signed.


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)




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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

Great photo's James









I do like blued screws (Proper ones and not laquerd), come on Roy what have you got in the pipeline









BTW What project needs 3 movments


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## strange_too (Feb 19, 2007)

Very interesting pictures James.


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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

I still say Roy should use these in a RLT manual wind RLT chrono..................


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

jasonm said:


> I still say Roy should use these in a RLT manual wind RLT chrono..................


Yep I totally agree, it would look great


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

PhilM said:


> Great photo's James
> 
> 
> 
> ...


secret but not my project, my watchmaker gets a free one out of it in the end, something put together from odds and ends, he is doing the dials, someday but soon he is off for a month so maybe not till xmas now as he will be back logged, why I wanted my servicing done before he goes.


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

PhilM said:


> jasonm said:
> 
> 
> > I still say Roy should use these in a RLT manual wind RLT chrono..................
> ...


 Same here









BTW I gather these (& other Chinese) movements are available in the UK


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## Mark_B (May 2, 2005)

PhilM said:


> jasonm said:
> 
> 
> > I still say Roy should use these in a RLT manual wind RLT chrono..................
> ...


Yep I'll second.........err third that!

I've got one of these in the Alpha paul Newman homage and they work nicely and feel good quality.

Where are these available from as I have a project of my own (ongoing for ages awaiting a suitable mov't) that one of these mov't might suit?

cheers,

Mark.


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

QUOTE(Mark_B @ Jul 19 2007, 02:33 PM) ←

Yep I'll second.........err third that!

I've got one of these in the Alpha paul Newman homage and they work nicely and feel good quality.

Where are these available from as I have a project of my own (ongoing for ages awaiting a suitable mov't) that one of these mov't might suit?

cheers,

Mark.

PM Sent


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

mach 0.0013137 said:


> PhilM said:
> 
> 
> > jasonm said:
> ...


Bridlington is in the UK


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

Actually although I don't have an RLT I would think they need some more time tested abuse before you would actually want to see them in an RLT no? They are an attractive movement though


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## jasonm (Nov 22, 2003)

James said:


> Actually although I don't have an RLT I would think they need some more time tested abuse before you would actually want to see them in an RLT no? They are an attractive movement though


Interesting point James, I asked the question on the forum a while ago, are 'we' ( watch type people) ready to accept Chinese movements yet? Some of us have them, but do we really think they are acceptable as a mainstream movement to be taken seriously or are they still a bit of a novelty ?


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

James said:


> Actually although I don't have an RLT I would think they need some more time tested abuse before you would actually want to see them in an RLT no? They are an attractive movement though


I know what you mean but the movement is machined from the Venus 175 tooling sold to the chinese by the swiss in the 60s so its quite tried and tested.

But of course we would all prefer if an RLT would have NOS Venus 175s in them - but then they'd be unaffordable to most of us (and I doubt anyone can find that many NOS at once)

Theoretically using the chinese movement - we'd all get a chnace on an RLT that we can afford.


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## PhilM (Nov 5, 2004)

So it sounds like there's a need for an RLT manual wind Chrono









Just need to see if our in house bespoke watch maker will make it for us


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

Xantiagib said:


> James said:
> 
> 
> > Actually although I don't have an RLT I would think they need some more time tested abuse before you would actually want to see them in an RLT no? They are an attractive movement though
> ...


I think it would be important to consider here that if Roy did decide to make an RLT chrono with a Chinese movement he would probably not be able to sell it at the sort of prices we have become accustom to from the likes of Alpha without making a substantial loss


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

Fair point about the pricing... where an alpha or a seagull would cost you less than an RLT

the RLT would have to be that bit more special - a limited edition of 20 or something, being an RLT would justify the price of Â£149.00 lets say.

The movement costs around Â£50 from UK suppliers - cheaper if you get it from china direct. Case and dials and hands, pushers etc...

say another Â£50-Â£70 ea. Then the time and effort... hmmmmmm

I'm begining to understand why Roy's been silent on this one so far


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## Robert (Jul 26, 2006)

I would pay more for an RLT with a chinese movement than an Alpha with the same movement.

My question would be, is Roy happy enough with the quality of the movement to put his name on the dial?


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

And it would be professionally timed, tuned, checked and lubed where additionally needed with the finest synth lubes! A one by one process vs. the asian factory sweating on them as they pass calling it lube! just kidding I know nothing about lubes but a site never the less.

we oil movement, they respond, with little detail lol


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

*If* Roy were to consider making such a watch (& I`m not aware of his thoughts on the subject) and lets say he felt it would be only worth while him doing if he put a price on them of around Â£200 (I`d like to stress that these are my own thoughts), would people buy them?


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

he is so quiet lol

honestly, would you place your branding on a chinese movement, everyone still remembers the chinese doxa's, lmao. maybe best to leave the chinese movements to the chinese, one breaks then Roy gets called communist supporter. there are many things to think about. we all buy the chinese and love them even I, yet we collect the swiss, german etc.


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

Roy has used Russian movements in his watches before....

the same was said of Russian movements not so long ago what is being said in this thread about the chinese and their movements...

the photos speak for themselves, and the timekeeping is excellent.


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

James said:


> we all buy the chinese and love them even I, yet we collect the swiss, german etc.


I have a small collection of old Chinese watches all of which are running well


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

an FYI.......I have edited out some sensitive information









Here is a complete list of available ST19 movement variants:

Known variants

ST1901

2 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

(Ex Venus 175 - parts compatible, Venus parts can be used for repair)

ST1902

3 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

12 h register at 6 (non chrono),

The 12h is directly geared to the main hour hand - useless. See the pictures of the "xxxxxxxxxxxxxx" 3-register chrono, the 12h in the register is always in the same position as the main hour hand.

ST1903

3 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

24 h register at 6 (non chrono,

The 24h indicator is directly synchronized with main hour hand, either used as 24h indicator or with the hand replaced by a day/night disk as a faux moon phase - day night indicator.

New variants 2007

ST1905

2 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

decentral power reserve at 4:30

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

ST1907

2 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

central power reserve indicator

ST1908

4 register,

small seconds at 9,

30 min counter at 3

date at 12

day/night window at 6

No info about the "missing" denominations ST1904 and ST 1906.

But Seagull is developing or considering:

A true 3-register chrono with a 12h chronograph counter at 6, prototypes have been built, this might be one of the missing denominations.

A GMT variant of the ST1903, where the 24h register can be set independently - only in consideration.

The following 5 points are for nondisclosure please:

1. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

2. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

3. The ST19 movement family is currently sought after. Lead time for large scale orders went up from 1 month to 3 months since May.

4. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

5. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

About the quality:

The quality of the movement is generally quite good, accuracy is a nonissue. Factory acceptance for the daily rate is +30 / -10 sec per day. Statistically most movements should thus be in the +5 to +15 sec per day range - they are, this I can confirm. Best reported performance in the +2 to +5 range. Power reserve is nominal 38 hours, lowest factory acceptance at 36 hours. The mainspring is able to provide 50+ hours power reserve - but to reach this one needs a perfectly assembled and lubricated movement / watch.

Main known movement problem is the "chrono reset fault" where the chrono seconds hand does not reset perfectly to 12 after some time of use.

Problems with complete watches assembled at Seagull result mostly from inaccurate (or simply dirty) assembly of the watch, not from a faulty movement.








don't ask for the edited info, James. but I will tell you xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx chuckles


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

mach 0.0013137 said:


> *If* Roy were to consider making such a watch (& I`m not aware of his thoughts on the subject) and lets say he felt it would be only worth while him doing if he put a price on them of around Â£200 (I`d like to stress that these are my own thoughts), would people buy them?


I forgot to mention there is at least one Â£200+ Chinese powered chrono already on the market, so there is a precedent


















Whilst it would be nice, I suppose we probably won`t be seeing an `ST-19` powered RLT chronograph any time soon, but it`s nice to dream


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

yea saw that one, same guy in China who states he uses real Swiss 2824-2's I think

and we always refer to Sea-Gull but they are not the only one manufacturing this specific movement


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## 91greyhound (Oct 31, 2007)

James,

I just received an Alpha Newman with this movement and would like to replace the hour/minute/center chrono hands with hands that are more legible and will stand out more.

Can you please tell me what size mounting holes these hands should have? By the way, BEAUTIFUL pictures of the movement!!! I hope that it is running well for you.

Thanks


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## James (Jul 17, 2006)

Ah first post from the guy from PA, USA









Dunno but will PM you.


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## neilg77 (Oct 2, 2007)

I love these chinese movements and I missed out on a Seagull recently that Tertius was selling.

Where am I best to look for Seagull chrono's? I've been searching but found very little.

Cheers,

Neil


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

I know a man who can help...


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## neilg77 (Oct 2, 2007)

now, now, stop teasing...;-)

I can't PM yet so will watch this thread closely.


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## Julian Latham (Jul 25, 2005)

Xantiagib said:


> I know a man who can help...


If it's the same name you passed on to me may I add my positive recommendation. Takes time but it's well worth the wait.

Julian L


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## Xantiagib (Apr 22, 2005)

Yes it would be - he's the only one i've dealt with ever

Neil - post your email address and I'll send you the info - I tried to PM you but it failed.


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