# Have you ever felt like buying a Rolex ...



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

... just for when people say 'For the money you spend on watches, you could have bought a Rolex'?

I am a placid man, but I swear I am going to buy a Rolex and put it on my wall, so that when people say that, I can point to it, and yell '*I HAVE A FECKING ROLEX*!'

I have several watches running inside chronometer spec that I have been bothered to check, a Zeno (unitas 6428) regulated by Greg at Woodland Technical, an Armand Nicolet (Eta 2824 + DD module) regulated somewhere, because I have the lab sheets and I checked it over two months; and a Heinz 57 Russian (Poljot 3133 with OKEAH dial) among them (OK so the 3133 is just a random miracle). None of them will dissolve because they have been made out of the wrong grade of stainless. Two have really decent WR, one is an auto, and they all attract (nice) comments on the wrist, but often followed by "Have you got a Rolex?"!






Have you ever felt the Rolex effect?


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

It gets my goat a bit... Its like this brand just attracts the ignorant, snobs and morons.

I never much liked them, a bit like Iphones - they seem to be for those that swallow the marketing whole.

For the money I think they are extremely average, too common, without much class and to tell the truth I find it irritating when I wear my sub I get asked "is that real?" and then "what's it worth?" likely followed by "you are mad to spend that on a watch... My Timex tells the time and cost me £20"

Its a kind of lowest common denominator of watches. Though the fact they require virtually no maintenance, one knows that they will likely retain their value and are well recognised has some appeal.

I say that without malice, I own 3. I think that's enough... Next watch needs to be less commercial... A vintage memovox or a spring drive.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> Have you ever felt the Rolex effect?


 No.


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

I own a few watches including a couple of Rolex & apart from one individual asking why I was wearing a couple of (Vostok) watches* no one has ever commented on them, maybe it`s because I`m a wee bit scruffy...






​
​
*He looked somewhat concerned & made a hasty retreat when I informed him that one was set to the local time in the UK & the other was set to an island in the East Siberian Sea :huh: :laugh:

Btw just in case anyone is concerned I was joking, both were on UK time :tongue:


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Yes I'd buy a rolex, a porsche a merc a jag a bmw a maserati an aston martin...just for the badge especially when i was young. I would never have bought a sierra cosworth or a seiko then, but i would have bought an omega or longines or etc etc etc. Now i would buy that cosworth and that seiko and ignore that dino. What is in a name? Quiet a lot. Sekonda are good old russian watches say my old mate Bill...but im not ready for one yet.

one day i might be

and then i might buy an old rolex too.






makes the man in the new sekonda sound rich does it not?



mach 0.0013137 said:


> I own a few watches including a couple of Rolex & apart from one individual asking why I was wearing a couple of (Vostok) watches* no one has ever commented on them, maybe it`s because I`m a wee bit scruffy...
> 
> View attachment 20056​
> ​
> ...


 a picture of contentment.

when everyone is happy with what they have and happy for everyone else to have what they have.


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## deano1956 (Jan 27, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> '*I HAVE A FECKING ROLEX*!'


 '*I HAVE A FECKING ROLEX*!'



Daveyboyz said:


> Its like this brand just attracts the ignorant, snobs and morons


 hope not davey :biggrin:

and I agree

" I also own 3. I think that's enough... Next watch needs to be less commercial... a spring drive.

deano :laugh: :laugh:


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## scottswatches (Sep 22, 2009)

Nothing wrong with buying a Rolex because you admire the engineering - the amount of watchmakers I have met that have a Datejust and an Omega 565 is incredible.

Just don't buy one thinking they make you a better or more attractive person.

If you want one that doesn't scream Rolex then look at the dress watches (precision, and later Celleni). Then you tick both boxes


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## bowie (Mar 12, 2005)

up where i live people would think it is a knock off one,you cannot even buy a new rolex in Sunderland as nobody stocks them for a city status place i think it is terrible

Evan earnest Jones has shut when they where open the highest watch on sale was a Dreyfuss cannot even buy a oris omega have to travel to Newcastle for rolex zenith ect,just tells what type of people they cater for in sunderland

*

*


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## deano1956 (Jan 27, 2016)

scottswatches said:


> Just don't buy one thinking they make you a better or more attractive person.


 the wife quickly dispelled that illusion if ever I had any scott when she found out I had one ! :laugh:

deano


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

I often wonder why people who dislike a brand so much talk about it so frequently.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

scottswatches said:


> Just don't buy one thinking they make you a better or more attractive person.


 Quite right, for that you need years of etiquette tuition and the corrrect ensemble,


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## Bonzodog (Aug 29, 2018)

I had two ,my wife one.All gone now ,with hindsight not worth the cost.


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## Iceblue (Sep 4, 2013)

got the t shirt

I had a submariner 1996 and a explorer II polar , sold both would I have another.......................... yes


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## Davey P (Sep 9, 2010)

Jet Jetski said:


> ... just for when people say 'For the money you spend on watches, you could have bought a Rolex'?
> 
> Have you ever felt the Rolex effect?


 No.


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## andyclient (Aug 1, 2009)

I have 3 and clearly move in the wrong circles as my sub which is pretty much my daily wearer never gets a mention (which suits me fine to be honest) the wife wears a 34mm oyster perpetual and works with doctors and consultants and has had more comments than I've ever had, so probably proves my point about the company I keep


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## yokel (Jul 30, 2017)

We had a thread on how your tastes have changed a few days ago. The first line of my contribution was "thirty odd years ago I wanted a Rolex".

So, yes, I have heard the calling. And I still have the only one I have ever owned.
It will remain lonely.

.


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## r-macus (Jun 7, 2018)

I have thought of it, and if funds allow it will. The hype around the brand has somewhat drawn me in. Can't deny that their marketing and fan bois are on par at doing a great job. To be fair though they are good at watch making. At rrp they might be priced even a little high, but when it gets out of hand on the grey market that puts me right off, but that's maybe because I wasn't on board before the hype train and am a little jealous.


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

The quick answer is: Yes.

I've always fancied a James Cameron Double-Blue.


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## Rotundus (May 7, 2012)

:laughing2dw: I tried to buy a sub once , back when they had them in stock many moons ago.

took off the Marcello C I was wearing to try said sub on - took the sub off again and thought something along the lines of "not worth the extra" - and it was considerably less extra than it is now

that said I do like the look of the arctic exp 11 and the miglaus , I think they were an aspirational brand for me when I couldn't afford one , but somehow now not so much. funny ol' game innit.


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## Stan (Aug 7, 2003)

Yes, I fancied a vintage Rolex Oyster, but I can't justify the cost.

I don't like the ones with "Mercedes" hands, I'm on record for that choice. :wink:


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

Rotundus said:


> took off the Marcello C I was wearing to try said sub on - took the sub off again and thought something along the lines of "not worth the extra"


 I consider my Tridente superior to my SMP and Tudor for a lot less money.












Stan said:


> I don't like the ones with "Mercedes" hands, I'm on record for that choice. :wink:


 Agree.They don't look good on small dials but nice on 40mm+.


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## Craftycockney (Nov 5, 2015)

Just over 2 years of DJ41 ownership and quite frankly cannot get enough of it. Next to no one knows it's a Rolex apart from a few who also wear DJ's at work.

It's tick all the boxes for me & fits neatly under my shirt sleeve without looking out of place. Rhodium dial is stunning and with a Hirch grey leather strap it sets it of nicely. Even the guy in the jewellers actually complemented how well it goes together.

I guess if you find the right model there is a Rolex out there for everyone without all the marketing hype that plagues the true heritage of the brand..


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Stan said:


> Yes, I fancied a vintage Rolex Oyster, but I can't justify the cost.
> 
> I don't like the ones with "Mercedes" hands, I'm on record for that choice. :wink:


 No ?


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

The Rolex Oyster Pep in Black or White , large size , is just about the best watch of its kind for the money ... if that is ... you could actually buy one.

The problem with Rolex is not Snobbery, value, exclusiveness or anything other than they are **** at actually getting time pieces to the shops.

Personally , I just can't be bothered to pi55 about when buying watches , so can't be playing their games. So I bought a Breitling.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Igerswis said:


> People buying things they don't need, to impress people they don't know, with money they don't have...


 I prefer Walter Slezak's take,

"*Spending money you don't have for things you don't need to impress people you don't like."*

:thumbsup:


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

ZenArcade said:


> I often wonder why people who dislike a brand so much talk about it so frequently.


 I don't dislike them at all, they make some quite nice watches. And not sure how many posts I have made or threads I have started but one out of X hundred is not exactly frequent to address the dichotomy of horology Vs commodity (imho).



WRENCH said:


> Spending money you don't have for things you don't need to impress people you don't like."


 But at least you can release some liquidity by selling a watch, more easily than selling, for instance, a tattoo. In fact if you are going to spend money you don't have, there is the logic for buying the badge over the timepiece I guess. You may be in debt, but you at least have an asset.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> I don't dislike them at all, they make some quite nice watches. And not sure how many posts I have made or threads I have started but one out of X hundred is not exactly frequent to address the dichotomy of horology Vs commodity (imho).
> 
> But at least you can release some liquidity by selling a watch, more easily than selling, for instance, a tattoo. In fact if you are going to spend money you don't have, there is the logic for buying the badge over the timepiece I guess. You may be in debt, but you at least have an asset.


 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skin_(short_story)


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Nigelp said:


> Sekonda are good old russian watches say my old mate Bill...but im not ready for one yet.


 Be quick ...












BlueKnight said:


> my Tridente superior to my SMP and Tudor for a lot less money


 That's nice, I know what to buy if I ever give up my search for a white dial Casio mdv-06 'Duro'!


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Interesting thread, and with all this value retention talk. My 1016 Explorer effectively cost (in 1975-76) about £75. Using the B o E inflation calculator that equates to around £530 today. In the early 80's, my mate bought a Milsub for less than £50. I sold my 1016, my mate still has his sub. I've just had a rare look at chrono 24, and some of the prices for both are insane. Being honest, all we bought was a watch, and were lucky enough not to destroy them over the years. Like this one,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/7392129.stm


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## Craftycockney (Nov 5, 2015)

Without Rolex the forum would have 1087 less Topics discussed! To me that represents value in itself lol.

Clearly the marketing is working good or bad.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Craftycockney said:


> Without Rolex the forum would have 1087 less Topics discussed! To me that represents value in itself lol.
> 
> Clearly the marketing is working good or bad.


 How many has Parnis got ? :laughing2dw:


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## richy176 (Aug 7, 2013)

Bonzodog said:


> I had two ,my wife one.All gone now ,with hindsight not worth the cost.


 The watches or the wife?


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## Graham60 (Nov 2, 2018)

Did at one time, but was out of my budget at the time.

But now that I can afford it, no (and that goes for a few other brands), have seen to many alternative, more affordable (and some not so) watches that I like better. As @Ullevi says in another thread, being here opens your eyes to the almost limited amount of beautiful watches that are available out there. Everybody is different and have different tastes, I would rather own a watch I like, rather than own a watch because of it's status or worth in the watch collecting community.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Graham60 said:


> Did at one time, but was out of my budget at the time.
> 
> But now that I can afford it, no (and that goes for a few other brands), have seen to many alternative, more affordable (and some not so) watches that I like better. As @Ullevi says in another thread, being here opens your eyes to the almost limited amount of beautiful watches that are available out there. Everybody is different and have different tastes, I would rather own a watch I like, rather than own a watch because of it's status or worth in the watch collecting community.


 Agreed, just interesting that people can still feel a pull for a brand they don't necessarily covet, just to shut people up. I even accepted a TV from my mum and dad once who seemed concerned that I didn't have one, just to stop them going on. Maybe if I leave a watch box lying around with an empty space marked 'Rolex' , then who knows?

As an aside, when my girlfriend left and took the TV I didn't even notice lol. That the TV had gone, I mean. Obviously I noticed she had gone, more room on the sofa etc. and an eerie calm around the place.


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Jet Jetski said:


> Agreed, just interesting that people can still feel a pull for a brand they don't necessarily covet, just to shut people up.


 Thing is , Rolex is a conversation-rich source.

They used to supply to shops very well made watches at reasonable prices and built a well earned reputation. Because that only came to an end fairly recently, they are a very chit-chat worthy Brand.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> Thing is , Rolex is a conversation-rich source.


 Have a Google search "What your Rolex says about you" :laughing2dw:

Here's a good one from "Watchranker" (typo in there, possibly)

https://watchranker.com/what-your-watch-says-about-you/


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> Have a Google search "What your Rolex says about you" :laughing2dw:
> 
> Here's a good one from "Watchranker" (typo in there, possibly)
> 
> https://watchranker.com/what-your-watch-says-about-you/


 I certainly think a lot of rankers read that and take it seriously ... :laugh:


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## Graham60 (Nov 2, 2018)

WRENCH said:


> Have a Google search "What your Rolex says about you" :laughing2dw:
> 
> Here's a good one from "Watchranker" (typo in there, possibly)
> 
> https://watchranker.com/what-your-watch-says-about-you/


 Well none of my watch brands are there, and i don't have any mentioned, so I must rank as an, unsuccessful, powerless, unadventurous, unsophisticated, horological ignorant unfit watch enthusiast. Sounds about right.  :laughing2dw:



Jet Jetski said:


> As an aside, when my girlfriend left and took the TV I didn't even notice lol. That the TV had gone, I mean. Obviously I noticed she had gone, more room on the sofa etc. and an eerie calm around the place.


 That's a bit mean, taking a TV your mum and dad got you, I would have been no way is that TV leaving here. :aggressive: :laughing2dw:


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## scottswatches (Sep 22, 2009)

WRENCH said:


> Have a Google search "What your Rolex says about you" :laughing2dw:
> 
> Here's a good one from "Watchranker" (typo in there, possibly)
> 
> https://watchranker.com/what-your-watch-says-about-you/


 I own most of the brands there. I didn't know I was so interesting :tongue:


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Graham60 said:


> That's a bit mean, taking a TV your mum and dad got you, I would have been no way is that TV leaving here. :aggressive: :laughing2dw:


 Small price to pay lol, at least my watches were still there.


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## mach 0.0013137 (Jan 10, 2005)

Davey P said:


> No.


 I`m glad to hear that, we don`t want the hoi polloi lowering the tone of the brand now do we?  :laugh:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

mach 0.0013137 said:


> I`m glad to hear that, we don`t want the hoi polloi lowering the tone of the brand now do we?  :laugh:


 I couldn't possibly comment

:biggrin:


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## PC-Magician (Apr 29, 2013)

I have nothing against the Watches themselves as they are extremely well made, but the whole branding thing puts me off and they are over priced.

That's just my opinion No offense intended to anyone at all.

Most products are over priced to start with, some exceptions granted.


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## Dilly (Dec 23, 2019)

My father was a saturation diver. When I was 10, 30 years ago he had 3 standard rolex submariners in his bedside drawer in plastic bags. He wore an extra thick case version that he used for diving in the north Sea but moaned it wore out shirt cuffs. These were tools to him completely. He wanted £500 for his tool watch 20 years ago. I got it serviced through Rolex and sold it for him on ebay for £2200. I've been a watch collector since being a kid but we are talking seiko cwc yema laco glycine etc £500 ish watches. Back then I would have had my dad's Rolex for £500 but wanted to do right by him and get him it's worth. There was no way I would have paid £2000 for it. Rolex make an amazing watch no questions. The experts on here might argue it's pros and cons against omega or other more expensive makes but the fact now I feel is celebrity fame footballers etc have driven the price way beyond their worth to the point true enthusiasts will never own one. But is this not the case for everything expensive. People buy products to their standard of living. There's plenty a person who owns an aston martin but doesn't give a toss about cars or no anything about motor sport. It's premium products marketing aspirations etc that drive half of us to want these things. How many folk with a submariner have even been snorkeling? Look what happened to Burberry as a brand taken over by chavs. I'm hopeing Rolex becomes uncool so the price falls off a cliff and I can afford a really decent watch because I know what they are and I won't have to be judged either way for having one.


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## ong (Jul 31, 2008)

Some interesting views here. I've had several Rolexes over the years but sold them all except my Steel and Gold Daytona that I bought after I retired. I also remember when Rolex was just a quality brand and Subs were considered tool watches.

Things changed in the 1980s as they became popular among City traders and car salesmen. I've never lost money on a Rolex, unlike other brands of watch and have seen the quality in every one I've owned. I wouldn't pay today's big prices, which I consider to be mainly hype anyway.

When I wanted a Daytona, I found a brand new one that had been sold within the trade and still had the original stickers etc. It was originally supplied to an AD in Greece but I bought it in the UK. Took me a couple of days to source it about 12 months ago and no premium was requested or paperwork retained.


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

*Just as good.*

( Click on picture for Hi-Rez) he he he.....


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## Cyclops930 (Oct 20, 2017)

Interesting thread.

I have to ask what sort of board and planker buys a Rolex when there are so many better watches to be had at a far cheaper price.


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Cyclops930 said:


> Interesting thread.
> 
> I have to ask what sort of board and planker buys a Rolex when there are so many better watches to be had at a far cheaper price.


 Because they can

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:

Big M's son in law recently bought a nice Rolex, he was in an AD and happened to say he liked that bracelet but that watch but with a white dial.

"They don't make one like that Sir"

So how much if I really wanted one was his reply.

And to dispel another bit of Rolex mythology that they have the general public at their knees some time later the watch exactly to his spec turned up.

How did that happen you might ask

Because he's not short of a bob or two and despite what some would have you believe a customer with the wherewithal is still King.


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## mrzee (Jun 22, 2012)

Not so much never had the calling, more never had the cash. Would I have one if funds allowed? Yes I probably would or a Tudor perhaps.

Edited because it would never happen. My missus would chop my danglies off.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Cyclops930 said:


> a far cheaper price


 not really - many people have had Rolexes at zero cost of ownership, even allowing for a service (which they don't actually need that often)

It's tough if you are looking to get on the ladder now, of course, but if you buy from an AD your balance sheet could be much healthier after you walk out the door than when you went in. Not quite as liquid, but healthier.

You can see I am becoming a convert lol - I'll be a zealot soon, like people who give up smoking, I'm giving up knocking Rolex :laughing2dw:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Jet Jetski said:


> You can see I am becoming a convert lol


 Hypocrisy doesn't suit you

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:

But you are bang on the money

If I sold mine tomorrow I would have worn various Rolex's and Omegas and Tag's and fashion "tat" for the last 20 years for free

The haters don't like to hear that but hey ho one day I might give a [email protected]

:biggrin:


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Jet Jetski said:


> It's tough if you are looking to get on the ladder now,


 I love this phrase ...... it perfectly separates the Rolex appreciators from the Rolex Knobs ...... :thumbsup:


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

Do people realise a Breguet type XX is cheaper than the retail price of a Daytona or the Blancpain FF can be easily found for the price of a Hulk?

For all this rending of garments over Rolex prices, lack of availability etc there are plenty of brands out there with equal if not better pedigree readily available. Strange there is little internet traffic about these brands especially on the forums of "Watch enthusiasts"


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

ZenArcade said:


> there are plenty of brands out there with equal if not better pedigree readily available.


 The other mass producers Omega and Breilting have more heritage and pedigree also .... but because they can actually manufacture the watches they "release" , they are less drooled over in some quarters. The Blancpain FF is a sublime watch , great shout. Superior to the Submariner in many people's eyes .... Breguet are a bit to "Dali" for many I am suspecting ... :thumbsup:


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## Craftycockney (Nov 5, 2015)

mrzee said:


> Not so much never had the calling, more never had the cash. Would I have one if funds allowed? Yes I probably would or a Tudor perhaps.
> 
> Edited because it would never happen. My missus would chop my danglies off.


 I use to think the same but I got my Mrs a watch, she got loved up and now makes it so much easier to buy my next 'last watch'.

Mate we live in a world of credit, I never use my own funds, instead I look for discounts on rrp & IFC purchases that way it doesn't hurt the bank balance and you get what you want.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> I love this phrase ...... it perfectly separates the Rolex appreciators from the Rolex Knobs ...... :thumbsup:


 I think you are close, but perhaps I should have titled the thread "This house believes that Rolex as horology can no longer be separated from Rolex as commodity."

The badge simultaneously increases the cost of the substance but diminishes the value of the essence.


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## ANDI (Mar 14, 2006)

Yes and errrr no.In 1993 i was about to go back to Goldsmiths to buy the Rolex Submariner i had looked at and tried earlier that morning(yes can you imagine that NOW-Rolex sports models in stock and in the window!!!;but then i saw and tried a Breitling Shark in another jewellers.At the time i thought the Breitling was better than the Rolex in every way and it was considerably cheaper. I bought the Breitling. I have never come that close to buying or affording a Rolex since. A few years later a Rolex Submariner came up for sale on this very Forum.I could not afford to buy it but i actively encouraged a very good friend and fellow collector to buy it though.He did and he still has that Rolex sub today!!


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## Mrs Wiggles (Nov 7, 2018)

I can fully understand what the OP is saying. As soon as someone knows about my interest in watches, out pops the question "have you got a Rolex". Never an Omega, Patek, or even a bloody Timex, always, Rolex. The thing is that even if I could afford a luxury brand watch, it wouldn't be a Rolex


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

Igerswis said:


> Breguet = jewellery


 According to who exactly?


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

ZenArcade said:


> According to who exactly?


 Hmm, :hmmm9uh:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breguet_(brand)

"Breguet is one of the oldest surviving watchmaking brands and a pioneer of numerous watchmaking technologies such as the tourbillon, which was invented by Abraham Breguet in 1801. Abraham Breguet also invented and produced the world's first self-winding watch (the Perpétuelle) in 1780, as well as the world's first wristwatch in 1810 (the Breguet No.2639, for Caroline Bonaparte, Queen of Naples).


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

WRENCH said:


> Hmm, :hmmm9uh:
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breguet_(brand)
> 
> "Breguet is one of the oldest surviving watchmaking brands and a pioneer of numerous watchmaking technologies such as the tourbillon, which was invented by Abraham Breguet in 1801. Abraham Breguet also invented and produced the world's first self-winding watch (the Perpétuelle) in 1780, as well as the world's first wristwatch in 1810 (the Breguet No.2639, for Caroline Bonaparte, Queen of Naples).


 Indeed, I am aware of Breguet long history of horology not to mention its long history of supplying military watches, being worn by numerous significant people in history I am just trying to work out how Breguet = jewellery

Perhaps its phrases such as "Breguet hands" and "Breguet numerals" being commonplace in horology must mean that Breguet = jewellery


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

ZenArcade said:


> Indeed, I am aware of Breguet long history of horology not to mention its long history of supplying military watches, being worn by numerous significant people in history I am just trying to work out how Breguet = jewellery
> 
> Perhaps its phrases such as "Breguet hands" and "Breguet numerals" being commonplace in horology must mean that Breguet = jewellery


 Funny old thing this watch collecting game of "name calling" isn't it ?


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> I can fully understand what the OP is saying. As soon as someone knows about my interest in watches, out pops the question "have you got a Rolex". Never an Omega, Patek, or even a bloody Timex, always, Rolex. The thing is that even if I could afford a luxury brand watch, it wouldn't be a Rolex


 The last ' WIS' person who noted my watch said to me ; " You should get a 'proper' watch , a Rolex ". No one else has ever commented.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Igerswis said:


> Rolex = GADA
> Breguet = jewellery
> 
> Bear in mind many people who have Rolex also own other brands so your post is a little strange. Are there many people on this forum with only one watch?


 I think there are quite a lot of people for whom a luxury watch is a luxury, and that in deciding which watch they should choose for this singular treat, Rolex is difficult to move from top spot. So I would say that among people who may have several watches, but only one 'special', I would wager my last shirt button, against your country mile, that the majority will be eyeing up the Rolex catalogue. I would also guess that the majority of people who decide to 'splash' for their special birthday or whatever are not necessarily horological afficionados. They might watch James Bond films though, so Omega are in with a shout too. Although have you seen the price of some of them? You could get a Rolex for that.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Igerswis said:


> Rolex led the market many years ago in this department. Things changed post 2000 and people started to wear them as jewellery. But as a single piece they're undoubtedly extremely versatile and part of their charm.


 Ok


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## Cyclops930 (Oct 20, 2017)

Is GADA Lady GAGAs father if not :sign_wtf: is its meaning.

Confused of Derbyshire. :yes:


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

The term jewellery when used in the context of a watch has nothing to do with frequency of wearing it.

As far as I am concerned a watch can only be called jewellery if it is made by a manufacturer with no experience in producing horology. For instance, though I like the brand and things have somewhat changed in this regard, Cartier are more of a jeweller than a watchmaker and you pay more for design and precious metals etc than movement in many of their 20th century watches.

To use the term about a Breguet is the polar reverse of the term, there's nothing Breguet doesn't know about watchmaking.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

So is anyone feeling like buying a Rolex ? :laughing2dw:


----------



## Cyclops930 (Oct 20, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> So is anyone feeling like buying a Rolex ? :laughing2dw:


 More than ever


----------



## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

Igerswis said:


> Breguet is not an everyday tool watch unlike Rolex sports models. Hence the term 'jewellery'. Nothing to do with cost, rather than how it is perceived and worn. When you see the craftsmanship in a Breguet especially the tourbillons then you really do appreciate them as high end hand crafted jewellery.
> The Swatch Group have Blancpain and Omega that are much more tool-like and versatile so more in line with Rolex sports watches. Then you have Longines, Tissot etc who are further down the


 No you don't.... Jewellery has no function, no moving parts.... it is for aesthetics not function. When you see the craftsmanship you see it is horology not jewellery.

It has nothing to do with whether it is a tool watch or a dress watch, whether it is worn every day or once a year. Jewellery means it is aesthetic and the horology is an after thought. A watchmaker is concerned more with the function and movement on the other hand... which makes Breguet a watchmaker and its watches anything but jewellery.

Also I own some Rolex, when I am critical it is being realistic rather than "putting them down" I was accused of hating on them a few threads back for merely saying that when judging purely on the watches they are quite expensive for what they are and that a Breguet Type XX is not £11,000 difference in quality when compared to a Daytona.

Still none of us have a clue what GADA means.


----------



## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

Igerswis said:


> I highly doubt many people purchase a Breguet for the sole purpose of being a functional timepiece. Hence the term jewellery.
> 
> I think your under the impression I'm belittling Breguet when I am far from doing so. Calling it 'jewellery' is a compliment in my eyes as many of them are a work of art. I just wouldn't want to wear one daily whereas I could happily wear a Sea Dweller or Daytona as an only watch all week long.
> 
> Whatever ones personal definition of 'jewellery' is, I still hold my opinion that Breguet is not defined as a tool or GADA watch. Rolex on the other hand have traditionally been seen as such watches.


 That is exactly what they buy into... they are buying the tradition and history of the brand as a leading watchmaker. Hence nobody in their right mind would ever refer to them as "jewellery" maybe if they produced lots of blingy watches covered in diamonds but that is not their style. They are as far away from jewellery as possible from a watchmaker. Neither are they a tool watch either, but that doesn't make them jewellery. The key point is they are a refined watch which makes them neither a tool watch nor jewellery.

I don't have the opinion you are belittling them, I have the impression you are using a thoroughly inappropriate term.

And you are obfuscating using the term GADA which you have been asked multiple times about and nobody has the slightest clue what you mean.


----------



## Speedy112 (Jan 24, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> ... just for when people say 'For the money you spend on watches, you could have bought a Rolex'?
> 
> I am a placid man, but I swear I am going to buy a Rolex and put it on my wall, so that when people say that, I can point to it, and yell '*I HAVE A FECKING ROLEX*!'
> 
> ...


 Yes I own 7 Rolex.. along with several Omega Breitling Tudor Panerai Heuer (Not TAG) Seiko Spinnaker Tissot Raymond Weil Casio Nomos IWC Cartier Longines Maurice Lacroix Apple Citizen Gucci Timex Vacheron Constantin and several other brands I cant be arsed to list.

Was there any point to this thread apart from the stereotypical Boring predictable slant from attention seeking individuals...


----------



## richy176 (Aug 7, 2013)

Daveyboyz said:


> And you are obfuscating using the term GADA which you have been asked multiple times about and nobody has the slightest clue what you mean.


 It was answered but you needed to follow the thread to see it.

Posted 59 minutes ago



> 2 hours ago, Cyclops930 said:
> 
> Is GADA Lady GAGAs father if not [IMG alt=":sign_wtf:" data-ratio="95.83"]http://xflive.thewatchforum.co.uk/uploads/emoticons/sign_wtf.gif[/IMG] is its meaning.
> 
> Confused of Derbyshire. [IMG alt=":yes:" data-ratio="100.00"]http://xflive.thewatchforum.co.uk/uploads/emoticons/yes.gif[/IMG]


 Go anywhere do anything


----------



## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Speedy112 said:


> Was there any point to this thread apart from the stereotypical Boring predictable slant from attention seeking individuals...


 I think this was involved.


----------



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Speedy112 said:


> Yes I own 7 Rolex.. along with several Omega Breitling Tudor Panerai Heuer (Not TAG) Seiko Spinnaker Tissot Raymond Weil Casio Nomos IWC Cartier Longines Maurice Lacroix Apple Citizen Gucci Timex Vacheron Constantin and several other brands I cant be arsed to list.
> 
> Was there any point to this thread apart from the stereotypical Boring predictable slant from attention seeking individuals...


 of course, the point is has 'peer pressure' ever been a factor in buying any, or, looking at your list, indeed all, of your watches (ie Not TAG - what would make you say that?) - I think that's a legitimate topic, and lots of people have chipped in perfectly sensibly without being rude



ANDI said:


> Yes and errrr no.In 1993 i was about to go back to Goldsmiths to buy the Rolex Submariner i had looked at and tried earlier that morning(yes can you imagine that NOW-Rolex sports models in stock and in the window!!!;but then i saw and tried a Breitling Shark in another jewellers.At the time i thought the Breitling was better than the Rolex in every way and it was considerably cheaper. I bought the Breitling. I have never come that close to buying or affording a Rolex since. A few years later a Rolex Submariner came up for sale on this very Forum.I could not afford to buy it but i actively encouraged a very good friend and fellow collector to buy it though.He did and he still has that Rolex sub today!!


 I did something similar 25 yrs ago - bought a Tag 6000 which was then their flagship, and it really was not a much bigger stretch to get a Rolex, but I was THAT sporty lol - Tag Heuer all the way! Still, I got a screw down crown, a bracelet upgrade, and a cyclops thrown in, so I don't feel cheated! But if I had bought a Rolex, I could have sold it now and bought three or four Tags!



Daveyboyz said:


> And you are obfuscating using the term GADA which you have been asked multiple times about and nobody has the slightest clue what you mean.


 Go anywhere do anything - maybe not painting or gardening, but I guess if you have a Rolex you have someone to do that for you .


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> I think this was involved.


 Not this time, I was just tired yet again by my work situation - I have and wear lots of watches, they almost all go unnoticed, but there are a couple (and I think it is watches that are obviously 'vintage') that do get remarked on - not every time I wear them, not by everyone, but now and again and it's always one of three. But the conversation always ends with the admirer saying 'I fancy a Rolex - So-and-so (one of the sub-contractors) wears a Rolex. Don't you fancy a Rolex?' It's a fact, and I have it on good authority (OK, I made it up, but it is a good story) that @yokel keeps his Rolex, not for wearing, but so that when someone notices one of his fantastic watches and then says 'But don't you fancy a Rolex?' he can beat them round the head with it, like James Bond in the novel On Her Majesty's Secret Service.


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## richy176 (Aug 7, 2013)

If I bought a Rolex it would be the 42mm Explorer 2 polar but I would be put off if I had to go on a waiting list for a year or two. Is this a UK issue or is it the same around the world? Any members from outside the UK able to comment. Are prices pretty similar around the world? The UK rrp is just over £5200 before adding our 20% VAT - what is the price like elsewhere?


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## yokel (Jul 30, 2017)

Jet Jetski said:


> @yokel keeps his Rolex, not for wearing, but so that when someone notices one of his fantastic watches and then says 'But don't you fancy a Rolex?' he can beat them round the head with it.


 You have no idea how near the truth that conjecture is :blush:


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

A Holiday Tradition on TWF since 2001. :laughing2dw:


----------



## wrenny1969 (Jun 24, 2008)

If I had the money and they had stock, I'd buy one, why not? I like watches


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## martinzx (Aug 29, 2010)

No not really, but I like the brand and several of their watches particularly the Datejust and Daytona. I just can't afford one. I don't understand why the brand gets so much hatred. They are obviously doing something right, and they have an excellent heritage.

Cheers Martin :thumbsup:


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

martinzx said:


> I don't understand why the brand gets so much hatred.


 Short-sightedness ?


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

martinzx said:


> hatred


 I think hatred is a bit strong, certainly for me, I think most people just find the adulation a little irritating!


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## martinzx (Aug 29, 2010)

Jet Jetski said:


> I think hatred is a bit strong, certainly for me, I think most people just find the adulation a little irritating!


 Maybe so, but it gets boring after a decade of similar posts,
no offense intended!

I love the Undertones btw I bought that single back in day 78/9...lol

Cheers Martin


----------



## Mrs Wiggles (Nov 7, 2018)

Jet Jetski said:


> I think there are quite a lot of people for whom a luxury watch is a luxury, and that in deciding which watch they should choose for this singular treat, Rolex is difficult to move from top spot. So I would say that among people who may have several watches, but only one 'special', I would wager my last shirt button, against your country mile, that the majority will be eyeing up the Rolex catalogue. I would also guess that the majority of people who decide to 'splash' for their special birthday or whatever are not necessarily horological afficionados. They might watch James Bond films though, so Omega are in with a shout too. Although have you seen the price of some of them? You could get a Rolex for that.


 But how many people do you thing that buy a Rolex know anything about watches, and to be honest, why should they. A friend of mine recently sold his Rolex Deep Sea, because he was pretty desperate for cash. After selling it he told me how good it was because after five years he never had to change the battery. Funny but true


----------



## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

What I find a tad baffling..... is why so many people just believe what Rolex/Rolex ADs say.

Since the company is Family owned governed trust effectively , then they can say and announce what they like and only come under very vague scrutiny in a couple of jurisdictions ( the UK is one ) where profits and revenue figures must be published and audited to greater extent than many other places. I say vague scrutiny because Rolex can very legally use various "carousel" methods to keep a shroud of secrecy with regards detail.

Personally I think most info that is drip fed to potential watch buyers and enthusiasts is a load of old cobblers [ Other more devoted opinions are available :laugh: ]



Mrs Wiggles said:


> But how many people do you thing that buy a Rolex know anything about watches,


 Currently , I would say most. Because Rolex watches are mostly not available to buy in the shops, the traditional walk-in buyers no longer exist , and its those who used to buy not knowing much about watches I would suggest.....


----------



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> Currently , I would say most. Because Rolex watches are mostly not available to buy in the shops, the traditional walk-in buyers no longer exist , and its those who used to buy not knowing much about watches I would suggest.....


 I suppose that makes it harder to buy one because of peer pressure lol, which was the point of this thread. Hmmm.... wonder which brand we need to learn to 'hate' next then, where the walk-in punters will sink their lolly? Hmmm.... I wonder ...


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## Speedy112 (Jan 24, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> I think hatred is a bit strong, certainly for me, I think most people just find the adulation a little irritating!


 Maybe you could share some of the Rolex "Adulation" posts that you mention from this Forum that clearly get under your skin and cause you "irritation" .as I cannot remember seeing any such posts from any member


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Jet Jetski said:


> I suppose that makes it harder to buy one because of peer pressure lol, which was the point of this thread. Hmmm.... wonder which brand we need to learn to 'hate' next then, where the walk-in punters will sink their lolly? Hmmm.... I wonder ...


 Loads of people hate Breitling ..... And loads of Omega "special editions" are awful ..... !?!?


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

I would say not that many know much about watches... they know you cant go wrong with a Rolex, its safe, everybody knows they are decent.

A small minority of Rolex owners know the ins and outs of a ducks arse... of all watch fanboys the Rolex ones seem to be the most thorough in knowing every model number and detail of these watches... but on the whole I would say they are a pretty clueless bunch who just believe the hype and create this bullet proof market which self perpetuates the value of the brand.

When I was the one watch guy it was the AP royal oak classic. Very few comments on that one...in ten years I think only three comments were made. I had that many comments on the Rolex in the first week.

On this forum the adulation is not strong, we are all watch guys...I would like to think we appreciate watches for less shallow reasons. Go into the world though...its all aspirations of German cars and Rolex watches.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

I some times think the inverse of the statement "A watch says a lot about its owner" is true. The owner says a lot about the watch.


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Daveyboyz said:


> its all aspirations of German cars and Rolex watches.


 it might just be they are the best who knows?

[IMG alt="Image result for porsche 928 gts" data-ratio="50.00"]https://hips.hearstapps.com/roa.h-cdn.co/assets/16/01/1600x801/gallery-1452384481-wallpapers-porsche-928-1991-1.jpg?resize=480:*[/IMG]

....Porsche. And Rolex?


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

Daveyboyz said:


> I would say not that many know much about watches... they know you cant go wrong with a Rolex, its safe, everybody knows they are decent.
> 
> A small minority of Rolex owners know the ins and outs of a ducks arse... of all watch fanboys the Rolex ones seem to be the most thorough in knowing every model number and detail of these watches... but on the whole I would say they are a pretty clueless bunch who just believe the hype and create this bullet proof market which self perpetuates the value of the brand.
> 
> ...


 Thought the car of choice for the watch forum user was the MX5 or Porsche Boxter? Otherwise known as the "Mid life crisis no honestly I dont look ridiculous driving this and under no circumstances does this car look like it should be driven by a female in her mid 20s"


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

ZenArcade said:


> Thought the car of choice for the watch forum user was the MX5 or Porsche Boxter? Otherwise known as the "Mid life crisis no honestly I dont look ridiculous driving this and under no circumstances does this car look like it should be driven by a female in her mid 20s"


 There's more backlash in that comment than there is in Parnis Crown. :laughing2dw:


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

ZenArcade said:


> Thought the car of choice for the watch forum user was the MX5 or Porsche Boxter? Otherwise known as the "Mid life crisis no honestly I dont look ridiculous driving this and under no circumstances does this car look like it should be driven by a female in her mid 20s"


 Blimey, I only wondered out loud if anybody had bought a R*l*x kind of, accidentally. Now I'm too old to own one!



WRENCH said:


> There's more backlash in that comment than there is in Parnis Crown. :laughing2dw:


 Ouch lol


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

Nigelp said:


> it might just be they are the best who knows?
> 
> [IMG alt="Image result for porsche 928 gts" data-ratio="50.00"]https://hips.hearstapps.com/roa.h-cdn.co/assets/16/01/1600x801/gallery-1452384481-wallpapers-porsche-928-1991-1.jpg?resize=480:*[/IMG]
> 
> ....Porsche. And Rolex?


 I dont think either are and thats the problem...

Reputations are 20 years behind the times at least... German cars are now notoriously unreliable for electronics (and did you know Italian cars cured their rust issues 30 years back?) yet the reputations are intact... now Mercedes and Rolex charge for a badge while offering nothing particularly outstanding when compared to the Japanese.

I say this without malice... and have been driving an Audi TT which is quite frankly very average to drive 2litre Turbo but not particularly rapid and nothing like an Italian car for chasis/steering.


----------



## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Daveyboyz said:


> German cars are now notoriously unreliable for electronics


 agreed mercedes make some of the worst cars on the road have done for 40 years.



Daveyboyz said:


> compared to the Japanese.


 im a seiko man and a Jensen man.

Oh and golf gti mk5 turbo thats the best real world car ive ever had.

It went to the tip like a builders lorry the other day and still felt good doing it.


----------



## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

Daveyboyz said:


> I dont think either are and thats the problem...
> 
> Reputations are 20 years behind the times at least... German cars are now notoriously unreliable for electronics (and did you know Italian cars cured their rust issues 30 years back?) yet the reputations are intact... now Mercedes and Rolex charge for a badge while offering nothing particularly outstanding when compared to the Japanese.
> 
> I say this without malice... and have been driving an Audi TT which is quite frankly very average to drive 2litre Turbo but not particularly rapid and nothing like an Italian car for chasis/steering.


 Hmmm the Japanese you say. There is a thread on TZUK where someone purchased a Grand Seiko only to find issues with the batons on the dial. Seems they use some kind of base metal on the batons (Unlike Rolex and Omega on some that use white gold) either way the whole fantastic workmanship of GS kind of went out of the window for me, that and the fact that like the Swiss they have cottoned onto the fact that there are plenty of mug....sorry customers out there just desperate to have their wallets emptied for the latest "Limited edition" Watch something Seiko seem to produce on a weekly basis.

GS produce some great watches but people are just as caught up in the hype as they are on a Rolex. Good example is the Citizen actually has a better spec than the GS quartz but hardly gets a mention.


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

Daveyboyz said:


> German cars are now notoriously unreliable for electronics


 There is just too much electronics controlling our lives. And you are correct. Not only unreliable but annoying. I took a BMW X3M for a test ride recently equipped with the "Driver Assistance" package. The car kept on pulling me back into my lane when I was passing a vehicle on a four lane highway. Thankfully the system can be modified or defeated.

Computers can be downright dangerous especially when flying a plane. Don't get me going.


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## yokel (Jul 30, 2017)

ZenArcade said:


> Thought the car of choice for the watch forum user was the MX5 or Porsche Boxter? Otherwise known as the "Mid life crisis no honestly I dont look ridiculous driving this and under no circumstances does this car look like it should be driven by a female in her mid 20s"












:tongue: :blush: :swoon:


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## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

Nigelp said:


> and a Jensen man this week.


 Fixed it. :laughing2dw:


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

BlueKnight said:


> Fixed it. :laughing2dw:


 Im thinking of selling it to my old mates wife. Its a pain in the bum. And no one but no one can get the six pack if thats what it really is to hold fuel. Im 120 mile away from it and happy to leave it that way until prices go north. Then im selling it to Quintin Wilson.


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## Speedy112 (Jan 24, 2016)

This may or may not help to explain why some of us have been wearing the brand for 40 plus years..IMO James Dowling gets it just about right..

I guess its like a question I am often asked why do you have 20 motorcycles "if I have to Explain you wouldn't understand"


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## Mrs Wiggles (Nov 7, 2018)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> What I find a tad baffling..... is why so many people just believe what Rolex/Rolex ADs say.
> 
> Since the company is Family owned governed trust effectively , then they can say and announce what they like and only come under very vague scrutiny in a couple of jurisdictions ( the UK is one ) where profits and revenue figures must be published and audited to greater extent than many other places. I say vague scrutiny because Rolex can very legally use various "carousel" methods to keep a shroud of secrecy with regards detail.
> 
> ...


 New possibly. My local jeweller presently has a very good condition hulk in the window. When I said most people who buy a Rolex know nothing about them, I was referring to specification, rather than value or model name etc


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> New possibly. My local jeweller presently has a very good condition hulk in the window. When I said most people who buy a Rolex know nothing about them, I was referring to specification, rather than value or model name etc


 Indeed the guy that sold wifey her Merc and liked talking about his shiny Submariner did not even know what a Chronometer was ....


----------



## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Speedy112 said:


> if I have to Explain you wouldn't understand"


 If you have to ask you don't understand in the first place. 

Back to Rolex. From my point of view a 36mm explorer or 34mm Air King, just about perfect , not because of cost/brand image, but merely from design. The "looky Likies/ homages, never get close, but the 36mm Black Bay in some ways (for me) is a better watch, and I wear it more than anything else.


----------



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> If you have to ask you don't understand in the first place.
> 
> Back to Rolex. From my point of view a 36mm explorer or 34mm Air King, just about perfect , not because of cost/brand image, but merely from design. The "looky Likies/ homages, never get close, but the 36mm Black Bay in some ways (for me) is a better watch, and I wear it more than anything else.


 Thanks, cue another 6 pages on Mercedes hands.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> Thanks, cue another 6 pages on Mercedes hands.


 Pity you don't get BMW hands, that would include a further 12.


----------



## Mrs Wiggles (Nov 7, 2018)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> Indeed the guy that sold wifey her Merc and liked talking about his shiny Submariner did not even know what a Chronometer was ....


 Absolutely, buy the way, what's a chronometer ? :laughing2dw:



WRENCH said:


> If you have to ask you don't understand in the first place.
> 
> Back to Rolex. From my point of view a 36mm explorer or 34mm Air King, just about perfect , not because of cost/brand image, but merely from design. The "looky Likies/ homages, never get close, but the 36mm Black Bay in some ways (for me) is a better watch, and I wear it more than anything else.


 I have nothing against small watches, but I struggle to see the time on a 40mm watch, so how do you cope ?


----------



## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> but I struggle to see the time on a 40mm watch, so how do you cope ?


 He is small , like a borrower .... so the watch is always closer to his face ..... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


----------



## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> Absolutely, buy the way, what's a chronometer ? :laughing2dw:
> 
> I have nothing against small watches, but I struggle to see the time on a 40mm watch, so how do you cope ?


 Because I'm not Mr Magoo.


----------



## odyseus10 (Jan 26, 2012)

BlueKnight said:


> There is just too much electronics controlling our lives. And you are correct. Not only unreliable but annoying. I took a BMW X3M for a test ride recently equipped with the "Driver Assistance" package. The car kept on pulling me back into my lane when I was passing a vehicle on a four lane highway. Thankfully the system can be modified or defeated.
> 
> Computers can be downright dangerous especially when flying a plane. Don't get me going.


 Bugger, I'd decided to buy a new AMG C43 next year? That said I'd never touch a VAG car again, after the fiasco/cover up of the Siemens fuel injectors (I fell foul of that design flaw on my Golf GT 170)


----------



## Mrs Wiggles (Nov 7, 2018)

odyseus10 said:


> Bugger, I'd decided to buy a new AMG C43 next year? That said I'd never touch a VAG car again, after the fiasco/cover up of the Siemens fuel injectors (I fell foul of that design flaw on my Golf GT 170)


 This is my hobby car. No electronics, just electrics, and not many of those either. 29 BHP and a 0-60 of 39 seconds. Cost me an absolute fortune in the last 18 months, but how beautiful is Josephine ?


----------



## Speedy112 (Jan 24, 2016)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> This is my hobby car. No electronics, just electrics, and not many of those either. 29 BHP and a 0-60 of 39 seconds. Cost me an absolute fortune in the last 18 months, but how beautiful is Josephine ?


Just needs a roll cage a 1275 engine and take Josephine racing and unleash a whole lot of fun in the classic race series..saw these A30/35s down at Goodwood this year.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Speedy112 said:


> Just needs a roll cage a 1275 engine and take Josephine racing and unleash a whole lot of fun in the classic race series..saw these A30/35s down at Goodwood this year.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 They go even better with a 6 cylinder Holden.


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Mrs Wiggles said:


> This is my hobby car. No electronics, just electrics, and not many of those either. 29 BHP and a 0-60 of 39 seconds. Cost me an absolute fortune in the last 18 months, but how beautiful is Josephine ?


 Have you got the little parking light that you hung in the door window when you parked at night.

My early years were spent getting carted around in an old Standard 8, my sister was always car sick and used to chuck up all over the parcel shelf everywhere we went.

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:


__
https://flic.kr/p/2i7YBnP

My father had a little parking light which plugged in and he religiously used it every night. White light to the front, red to the rear. I'm not sure if you actually had to use it or not.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

BondandBigM said:


> My father had a little parking light which plugged in and he religiously used it every night. White light to the front, red to the rear.


 My dad had one of these.










and looking at it, if it was hung in the drivers window, the lenses are on the wrong way round.


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

WRENCH said:


> My dad had one of these.
> 
> 
> 
> and looking at it, if it was hung in the drivers window, the lenses are on the wrong way round.


 Yep one of those.

Maybes that is one of those reverse images that often pop up on google or the lenses are just screwed in the wrong way round.

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:

Or he just parked the car the other way round and stuck it in the passenger side window.

:biggrin:


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

BondandBigM said:


> Yep one of those.
> 
> Maybes that is one of those reverse images that often pop up on google or the lenses are just screwed in the wrong way round.
> 
> ...


 which proves nothing...he didnt say 'it' was his dads.



WRENCH said:


> My dad had one of these.
> 
> 
> 
> and looking at it, if it was hung in the drivers window, the lenses are on the wrong way round.


 as above.

would i buy a rolex? yes.


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

WRENCH said:


> My dad had one of these.
> 
> 
> 
> and looking at it, if it was hung in the drivers window, the lenses are on the wrong way round.


 Logical you hand signal from the drivers side and it would be hung on the passenger side.


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Daveyboyz said:


> Logical you hand signal from the drivers side and it would be hung on the passenger side.


 its only a picture.


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

Nigelp said:


> its only a picture.


 Why would you hang a picture of an indicator from the drivers side?


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Daveyboyz said:


> Logical you hand signal from the drivers side and it would be hung on the passenger side.


 It's for when the car is parked unattended at night.

All German cars I've owned right back to my MK1 Golf GTI's have this wired in. Depending on which side of the road you park you flick the indicator stalk left or right and when you turn off the ignition the front and rear sidelights on the side you select stay on on that one side.

Your TT will be the same.


----------



## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Daveyboyz said:


> Why would you hang a picture of an indicator from the drivers side?


 have you bought a rolex?


----------



## BlueKnight (Oct 29, 2009)

BondandBigM said:


> All German cars I've owned right back to my MK1 Golf GTI's have this wired in.


 True. It looks from the picture that by twisting the knurled knob, the light could be used left or right.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Daveyboyz said:


> Logical you hand signal from the drivers side and it would be hung on the passenger side.


 Bearing in mind you won't be sitting in the car at night when the lamp is hung out of the window,

If you had a garage fit a parking light, it would always be fitted on the drivers side, as the logical way to park a car at night (and the safest) is facing the way it will be driven. As per the Highway Code.

"Rule 248 of the Highway Code states 'you must not park on a road at night facing against the direction of the traffic flow unless in a recognised parking space."

So putting a parking light on the passenger side would be pointless as it is there to warn other motorists (not pedestrians) that there is a parked car in their path.



BondandBigM said:


> Maybes that is one of those reverse images that often pop up on google or the lenses are just screwed in the wrong way round.


 I just got Frank Cannon to blow up the image, the letters are correct, so it's the lenses, maybe it was last used in France. :laughing2dw:


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

WRENCH said:


> I just got Frank Cannon to blow up the image, the letters are correct, so it's the lenses, maybe it was last used in France. :laughing2dw:


 Have you seen how they park in France

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

BondandBigM said:


> Have you seen how they park in France
> 
> :laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:


 Do they ? :laughing2dw:

I spent some time in Paris, and on flat streets they always left the handbrake off and the car in a high gear, so you could "shunt it" to get a wider space to get in and out of. Mind you that was when all you saw were these things.


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## yokel (Jul 30, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> I spent some time in Paris, and on flat streets they always left the handbrake off and the car in a high gear, so you could "shunt it" to get a wider space to get in and out of.


 Lived three fabulous years there in the 1980s. What you describe is exactly how it was done - except that, on properly flat roads, you didn't even bother putting the thing in gear.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

yokel said:


> Lived three fabulous years there in the 1980s. What you describe is exactly how it was done - except that, on properly flat roads, you didn't even bother putting the thing in gear.


 I used a bicycle, how I am alive I do not know. :laughing2dw:


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> My dad had one of these.
> 
> 
> 
> and looking at it, if it was hung in the drivers window, the lenses are on the wrong way round.


 maybe you could rotate it



BlueKnight said:


> True. It looks from the picture that by twisting the knurled knob, the light could be used left or right.


 I just said that.

Is this thread still going? I feel a bit like that chap in the song Eton Rifles - just nipping off for some tea, be right back, that's the spirit!

Jet Jetski in 'Revolutionary R*l*x thread proves divisive' shock.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> maybe you could rotate it


 Remember, it was designed by "the Prince of darkness" Joseph Lucas. Rotation would be beyond their scope. :laughing2dw:


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

WRENCH said:


> Bearing in mind you won't be sitting in the car at night when the lamp is hung out of the window,
> 
> If you had a garage fit a parking light, it would always be fitted on the drivers side, as the logical way to park a car at night (and the safest) is facing the way it will be driven. As per the Highway Code.
> 
> ...


 I didn't think it was a parking light... I thought it was an indicator.... Hence I was way off.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Daveyboyz said:


> I didn't think it was a parking light... I thought it was an indicator.... Hence I was way off.


 When these things were available, this was an indicator.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> When these things were available, this was an indicator.


 trafficator, non?

I still remember my dad using the verb 'to trafficate' and I seem to remember seeing an old car at a rally with one flinging out at around shoulder height of the door pillar with 'trafficator' actually on it, like a brand name. Patent pending lol


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## JoT (Aug 12, 2003)

What's really baffling is why people who don't own a Rolex get all bent out of shape about people who do and although they have never owned one seem to know EXACTLY why somebody buys one.

I have owned several Sub 5513, Sub 116610LV, GMT Master II 16710, Milgauss 116400GV, Deepsea 116660 and still own two classics Explorer II 16570 and Sea Dweller 16600

But apparently I am an ignorant snob, moron, planker etc etc - it is so clichéd - in all the years I have worn a Rolex I have only had one comment and it wasn't to ask me if it was real.


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

JoT said:


> What's really baffling is why people who don't own a Rolex get all bent out of shape about people who do and although they have never owned one seem to know EXACTLY why somebody buys one.
> 
> I have owned several Sub 5513, Sub 116610LV, GMT Master II 16710, Milgauss 116400GV, Deepsea 116660 and still own two classics Explorer II 16570 and Sea Dweller 16600
> 
> But apparently I am an ignorant snob, moron, planker etc etc - it is so clichéd - in all the years I have worn a Rolex I have only had one comment and it wasn't to ask me if it was real.


 its the 'porsche mentaility' john, they want a rolex but can't afford one, etc. thats how it seems. Hence Parnis etc.


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## Daveyboyz (Mar 9, 2016)

I have to come back on those points.... I am sure some of it is jealousy but there is a great deal of observation and logic involved in the non-Rolex position.

Was my opinion not valid on this before I owned Rolex and is somehow more valid now I own some? I could write a book on the issue purely based on the thousands of conversations I had when working in the industry and from the fact that a lot of these frankly average watches 20 years back which I considered no value at under £1000 each and that I ignored then are even less value now that they are £5000 each.

The buyers of these watches are people, so obviously there are different kinds, and when I make generalisations I am not inferring that all are like this; to think that anyone here would call other users of this forum ignorant should be cast out of your mind.

The fan boys who endlessly research the most obscure details and know the ins and outs of the brand supply information that people try to leverage profit out of. Dealers trade and re-trade the same watches at higher and higher values when there is no supply (despite there being minimal demand) until the fact that the watch is unobtainable makes people think they need to get one.

Rolex produces huge numbers but deliberately creates fake rarity in some of the models to drive to drive some of this hysteria...some people are backng away from the brand now unhappy with their behaviour...others will be unperturbed.

I have owned and handled many watches... Rolex are much improved on what they were but they are still pretty basic and cost too much (especially when they do produce something sophisticated/complicated like a sky dweller they just cant compete with the likes of Vacheron or Patek) but the circle **** of owners and the advertising and way they are regarded as a commodity just makes them such an obvious choice to people who both know and appreciate watches and to those that know nothing except "Fat bloke in the pub said Rolexes are the best so it must be true"


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## Craftycockney (Nov 5, 2015)

Daveyboyz said:


> I have to come back on those points.... I am sure some of it is jealousy but there is a great deal of observation and logic involved in the non-Rolex position.
> 
> Was my opinion not valid on this before I owned Rolex and is somehow more valid now I own some? I could write a book on the issue purely based on the thousands of conversations I had when working in the industry and from the fact that a lot of these frankly average watches 20 years back which I considered no value at under £1000 each and that I ignored then are even less value now that they are £5000 each.
> 
> ...


 I have agree on the huge numbers produced, after to speaking to a Grey dealer a few weeks back, he mentioned that AD's have plenty of stock sitting in there safes but they want to also cash in on the hype train of Rolex too. For example, he brought £250k worth of watches from an AD to sell on from his stall in Hatton Garden.

I guess if you know the right person and grease the right palm you can get pretty much whatever model you want...


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Craftycockney said:


> I have agree on the huge numbers produced, after to speaking to a Grey dealer a few weeks back, he mentioned that AD's have plenty of stock sitting in there safes but they want to also cash in on the hype train of Rolex too. For example, he brought £250k worth of watches from an AD to sell on from his stall in Hatton Garden.
> 
> I guess if you know the right person and grease the right palm you can get pretty much whatever model you want...


 Did he get the papers too lol

This thread wasn't started to knock R*l*x, and I definitely could afford one if I was a one-watch chap. The forum is quite a rarefied atmosphere (or it was until I joined) and there are opinions either way: the thread was started I suppose due to the awe I have for the stranglehold R*l*X have on public perception in the 'real world' beyond watch forums. And how irritating that can be. I do not think it is due to the horology - there are many vintage watches with Aegler 'Rebberg' movements out there, it's the one signed R*l*x everyone wants. And I am quite thick skinned and well known for ploughing my own furrow, normally oblivious to or regardless of 'opinion'. Yet it is interesting that what started really as an idle, light-hearted question still has legs, despite having been discussed to death for the last ten years. I would not be surprised if some who had sworn not to get involved on yet another R*l*X thread eventually gave in and could not resist that siren brand ... calling, always calling ...


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Of all the non-WIS I know who own a Rolex as their only watch, almost all bought it on "aspiration" and the fact it was a statement that "they had made it".

Of all the non-WIS I know who own a Rolex as well as another watch(s), this is not the case.

Not scientific, anecdotal to some degree, but a pretty healthy sample size.

Regarding the Watch savvy I know in the real world, only one of my network is a Rolex owner currently and he also has a few Omegas and from my watch chums here in the sunny South, Omega are by far the most popular luxury watch offerer.

People like to chat about Rolex because there is a lot to talk about.

The reason it can get negative is pretty obvious, there are a lot of thing wrongs with Rolex currently. Failure to actually supply the watches to the shops being the most obvious.

Personally I think the current ( albeit theoretical ) white dialled OP is just about the nicest watch of its kind on the market and not stupidly priced ( if it was actually available ) ... so no Rolex hate from me. Just huge scepticism about a company that I suspect is not what it says it is currently.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Nigelp said:


> It's the 'porsche mentaility' john, they want a rolex but can't afford one, etc. thats how it seems. Hence Parnis etc.


 It's the "poseur" mentality. I'd have a 71 911 2.2 T, they're a driver's car, and I like them, a lot of the others are as bland as a Marks & Spencer slipper, regardless of how fast they go. Same with bikes. Ducati's were avoided because of the propensity to explode, but they were a motorcyclist's bike, but after Pierre Terblanche designed the 916, and they swept up on the race circuits world wide, every high street cruiser wanted one. So instead of saying "look at my Rolex", the talk in the wine bar would be about how fast their bike would go, and what they were going to spend on it to make it go even faster. Which invariably led to a quick journey in an ambulance. I have no problem with Rolex, people can buy what they want, and if they feel the need to flaunt their "eye candy" as they call it, on Instagram, then that's fine. Down side to that one is, as a few find out, that some nasty men come to your house when you're on holiday and nick your stuff.

3.7 M views.


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> that some nasty men come to your house when you're on holiday and nick your stuff.


 Or in the case of my Rolex buddy, 4 nasty men came to his house twice in 3 years while he was at work and nicked his stuff ....


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> Or in the case of my Rolex buddy, 4 nasty men came to his house twice in 3 years while he was at work and nicked his stuff ....


 Unfortunately, people do that because they know. Every now and then you'll see news of some high profile collector getting done over, it is completely wrong, but too many make it too easy for the criminal.


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> Unfortunately, people do that because they know. Every now and then you'll see news of some high profile collector getting done over, it is completely wrong, but too many make it too easy for the criminal.


 Yep , he is a nice guy ,,,, but can not resist chit-chat in the wrong places. I lost count of the times I told him to "keep it down" in the local ....

Ironically, he is not a show-off, just loud.


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## ZenArcade (Aug 17, 2016)

Have you ever felt like buying a Rolex ...

I felt like buying an Invicta once...... :laugh:


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## Craftycockney (Nov 5, 2015)

Jet Jetski said:


> Did he get the papers too lol
> 
> This thread wasn't started to knock R*l*x, and I definitely could afford one if I was a one-watch chap. The forum is quite a rarefied atmosphere (or it was until I joined) and there are opinions either way: the thread was started I suppose due to the awe I have for the stranglehold R*l*X have on public perception in the 'real world' beyond watch forums. And how irritating that can be. I do not think it is due to the horology - there are many vintage watches with Aegler 'Rebberg' movements out there, it's the one signed R*l*x everyone wants. And I am quite thick skinned and well known for ploughing my own furrow, normally oblivious to or regardless of 'opinion'. Yet it is interesting that what started really as an idle, light-hearted question still has legs, despite having been discussed to death for the last ten years. I would not be surprised if some who had sworn not to get involved on yet another R*l*X thread eventually gave in and could not resist that siren brand ... calling, always calling ...


 Rolex like Marmite love it or hate it

Look forward to the next 10 years of discussions granted nothing will change...


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

ZenArcade said:


> I felt like buying an Invicta once.....


 Both motorcycle,










and automobile, are most desirable.


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## Richy (Oct 14, 2013)

Yes and I did.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Richy said:


> Yes and I did.


 Ah, but was it bought solely to shut up the 'But do you have a Rolex?' brigade?

Which is the rub of this particular thread.


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## Richy (Oct 14, 2013)

No, since enjoying watches I have always tried to gradually (IMO) improve my collection. I have Omegas' and think that they produce quality watches and movements, with my daily wearer being a SMP. I have however always fancied a Rolex Submariner (no date) and tried out a mate's (ceramic bezel) one. Sat nice, and knew right away the watch was to my taste. Personally there are several brands, AP and Hublot to name a couple that do nothing for me, so it is merely down to taste and picking a watch that I like. In the future will be inherited by my son.

To be honest my Omega Speedmaster Mk2 Rio attracts more attention than my Rolex, and re your question I have no real interest in what others think.

So a question for you, have you ever felt like buying a cheaper watch so that you can tell other people that their paying to much for their watches?

Did you know that Rolex just put their prices up so hopefully my watch has went up a little...…..


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Richy said:


> So a question for you, have you ever felt like buying a cheaper watch so that you can tell other people that their paying to much for their watches?


 I must admit I LOVE wearing my $100 Casio at the Gym and once in a blue moon being "educated" about perhaps "getting a decent watch" .... its only happened a couple of times, but it was quite funny ....


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Richy said:


> ever felt like buying a cheaper watch so that you can tell other people that their paying to much for their watches


 I pretty much always pay too much for my watches, so not really - I think it is a bit rude to talk about the cost of watches anyway, I think people should pay as much as they can possibly afford if they really want something and it's none of my business. The thread was never about affordability, it was about branding / advertising overwhelming one's natural inclination to simply buy a good quality watch you like, that keeps adequate time, doesn't fall apart, and brings you joy. Rolex is the obvious culprit but other brands can be 'coveted' for the wrong reasons too. I know someone who has a very expensive Tag - probably a Steve McQueen square one, and he keeps it 'hidden' in his laundry basket. Didn't have the heart to tell him (JK!).

But, I HAVE shopped around to try and prevent myself paying what I would consider too much for a 'good' watch, even though technically you cannot pay too much for a watch that will have a resale value above the retail price, and I think my 'best watch' is jolly nice, keeps great time, and I can read the date without having to glue a cyclops on the glass. The bezel looks smooth, but under a loupe you can see it is gently fluted and that's why it really catches the light. I like a bit of subtle detailing.

Fluted:

[IMG alt="Plates from Royal Copenhagen" data-ratio="22.50"]https://www.royalcopenhagen.com/rc/mediaweb/?context=cmN8cm9vdHwxMDU0ODQ3fGltYWdlL3BuZ3xoYzEvaGJmLzg4Mjg4NzA4NTI2MzgucG5nfDdlMjc5OGVlZWVkZTg1M2Y0NGIxOWEyNWYzODJlY2JhZmVmYjNjNzU4NTFmYjI5ZTU1YjEzZjU1YmJjMzJhOTE[/IMG]

IT IS NOT RIBBED!



Richy said:


> Hublot


 I get ribbed for wearing a Junkers, because it says Junk on the dial, but when your brand produces some of the biggest blots on the horological landscape you should be called Hugeblot. The Hublot wannabes by AP are the worst of their range too. So we agree on something.

[IMG alt="No photo description available." data-ratio="104.42"]https://scontent.flhr4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/53320040_122094315528481_8450948818941247488_o.jpg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_ohc=ZSNoofbb1oAAQkcMf7uBRtAndHtnKtYS8ZPA6C0chIucYXGrqZvMXmqZA&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-1.fna&oh=2476c4210dc959582f5292b3b0b4969e&oe=5E9D340E[/IMG]

I would like a Submariner too of course, but only if I could afford to wear it for its original purpose as a beater, and I feel no shame in saying that that level of profligacy is unfortunately beyond me, profligate though I do try to be.

So my tool watch is a much cheaper military diver, but the case does have a Vickers hardness index of 1200 (both the steel and the PVD) vs about 500 for Rolex 904 stainless, but I didn't buy it intentionally to upset people who bought their Rolex for the scratch resistance of the case. And it is triple sealed (thanks Rolex).

[IMG alt="Image may contain: outdoor" data-ratio="133.33"]https://scontent.flhr4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/67341414_145457123192200_7815299375734718464_o.jpg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_ohc=5qbJSJmE_M4AQkCnGbiUt1OQoMEdkkWBuz5-8H_vZYi2md0nUNsNGCjKg&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-1.fna&oh=d50fb652b115a50366395f9ac45ac89b&oe=5E6ADB0D[/IMG]

But look at the date window. Am I being picky, or is the date about 1 degree off horizontal? It is, isn't it, I think the date window should be moved another degree clockwise round the dial, to sit squarely (or roundly) between 4 and 5. So, you know, Rolex sub is prolly worth the extra 8.5k, if the date is level.



JonnyOldBoy said:


> I must admit I LOVE wearing my $100 Casio at the Gym and once in a blue moon being "educated" about perhaps "getting a decent watch" .... its only happened a couple of times, but it was quite funny ....


 I have been close to pulling the trigger on one of these a few times, but it is the silver dial I would really like.


----------



## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Jet Jetski said:


> So my tool watch is a much cheaper military diver, but the case does have a Vickers hardness index of 1200 (both the steel and the PVD) vs about 500 for Rolex 904 stainless, but I didn't buy it intentionally to upset people who bought their Rolex for the scratch resistance of the case. And it is triple sealed (thanks Rolex).
> 
> 
> 
> But look at the date window. Am I being picky, or is the date about 1 degree off horizontal? It is, isn't it, I think the date window should be moved another degree clockwise round the dial, to sit squarely (or roundly) between 4 and 5. So, you know, Rolex sub is prolly worth the extra 8.5k, if the date is level.


 If you apply that logic you could have saved yourself about £350/£400 and bought a £50 GShock

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:

Just as an asides whilst you can manufacture pretty much anything anything to MOD specs in this case (no pun intended) did the MOD actually buy any of them ???


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

BondandBigM said:


> Just as an asides whilst you can manufacture pretty much anything anything to MOD specs in this case (no pun intended) did the MOD actually buy any of them ???


 I believe the MOD took delivery of the first batch - Elliot Brown are very proud that although there are watches with no NATO stock number that have been issued to the services, and some with a NATO stock number that haven't, theres is and has, or has and is lol. They do an olive green one too, but that doesn't get the pheon.

Oh, here you go, they took them down the road the'selves, apparently ...

"Hand delivering the first batch of Holtons to the unit concerned was a proud moment that made us stop and take a breath because so few watches have ever attained the status of being developed this way and being issued as military equipment. Even fewer are issued to the type of specialist unit using the Holton, so it came as no surprise when this watch quickly became our most requested model."

A bit from a Chr. Ward forum post:

With regard to the 'Military Issue' status of the Holton Professional I contacted Elliot Brown to see if I could get clarification from them. This is the response I received from Alex Brown;-

"To clarify: when we say "Issued", we mean a watch that is (and has been) purchased by the MoD (directly or indirectly), delivered to the military stores from the supplier (not from EB), and available to (and provided to) military personnel from the stores on the base/camp/etc.

Imagine a twin circle Venn diagram, with Issued watches (as described above) in one circle, and NSN'd watches in the other.

In our experience, not all watches worn by military personnel are NSN'd, and not all watches that are NSN'd are Issued.
We've seen all sorts of watches issued from stores, and plenty aren't NSN'd.

For example, Eddie's 'Smiths' are NSN'd but not Issued. Same with the reissued Newmark watch.

(To clarify - we've absolutely nothing against Timefactors or Newmark - I mention them only because they were mentioned in that thread - we're not, absolutely not, singling them out for criticism. Just using them to illustrate the point of NSN'd but not Issued.)

I'm not sure if these watches use newly created NSNs or if they just reused the NSNs that were originally created for the original watches that theirs are based on. But either way, they aren't Issued watches, they're watches with an NSN on the caseback.

This is where the confusion comes from in this thread; most people think NSN=Issued, and that's not the case.

The Holton is different because it's in the area where the two circles intersect: it is NSN'd and Issued, and that's rare. As we've said, we're not aware of another British brand doing that in a decade.

*It's available to buy on the NATO system, and has been purchased from MoD budget by specialist military suppliers, not from EB directly, and will be issued from stores.**

p.s. When I am on the hill I wear this on the other wrist ...

[IMG alt="No photo description available." data-ratio="107.06"]https://scontent.flhr4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/58382123_131593094578603_7498425622167814144_o.jpg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_ohc=0Alq0O5GEKgAQmAqCt_YWTcB5JsltdSBxF5fn-TpO2IP1puMwk_dOmpJw&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-1.fna&oh=40de3f576772fb86d23357d829bc557b&oe=5E9B626E[/IMG]


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Jet Jetski said:


> I believe the MOD took delivery of the first batch - Elliot Brown are very proud that although there are watches with no NATO stock number that have been issued to the services, and some with a NATO stock number that haven't, theres is and has, or has and is lol. They do an olive green one too, but that doesn't get the pheon.
> 
> Oh, here you go, they took them down the road the'selves, apparently ...
> 
> ...


 Available "to buy" and actually issued free of charge are world's apart.

My brother worked as a civvy on an American base in Germany, in their equivalent of our "stores" you could buy all sorts.

Smoke, mirrors and marketing spring to mind.


----------



## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

BondandBigM said:


> Smoke, mirrors and marketing spring to mind.


 and MWC.


----------



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

BondandBigM said:


> Available "to buy" and actually issued free of charge are world's apart.


 OK, Alex Brown of Holton says they have been issued.

"available to (and provided to) military personnel from the stores on the base/camp/etc."

With the 'Canford' range, Elliott Brown already had a reputation for tough outdoors watches, and the narrative is that their watches were already being used by service personnel as a preference; and a joint venture was then embarked upon to tweak the design up to make the Holton a better mission fit - they have not just revived or appropriated an old / redundant NATO stock number (the NSN for this watch is 6645-99-303-0677)



BondandBigM said:


> marketing


 they have a way to go to catch up with R*l*x LOL!

It's a good watch either way, I got mine discounted too so not too far over my 'limit' for a quartz, plus extra straps (mine's on a 22mm Fossil rubber strap that I'm happy to wreck lol), they are all wet tested and cooled for moisture manifestation before they leave the factory, and impact tested on the crystal; the bezel is easy to turn with your gloves on because of the hob-nailing - just push down with your palm - legibility is great, shock resistance, WR, threaded spring bars, OEM rubber and G10 strap options , oh and scratch resistant! (unlike my Casio, as you can see ...)

I think you'll agree that the pheon is pretty low key on the dial

I do buy watches just for fun too, but I really like strapping this on for a hike. The OEM rubber strap is kind of barbed too, so it won't pull back past the keeper accidentally - that's why navy divers dive in pairs, you need a buddy to help get your watch off afterwards!



WRENCH said:


> and MWC.


 they do make some value watches, for a 300m diver they look OK - 10 yr battery life too on the quartz

but my second hand hits the markers, so they can eat my shorts.



BondandBigM said:


> in their equivalent of our "stores" you could buy all sorts


 Alex Brown addressed that too I think


----------



## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> 6645-99-303-0677


 https://elliotbrownwatches.com/blogs/technical/the-holton-range


----------



## YouCantHaveTooManyWatches (Nov 28, 2010)

ZenArcade said:


> Have you ever felt like buying a Rolex ...
> 
> I felt like buying an Invicta once...... :laugh:


 I bought a zenith el primero that looks awfully like a Rolex, but to answer the question - NO


----------



## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

YouCantHaveTooManyWatches said:


> I bought a zenith el primero that looks awfully like a Rolex, but to answer the question - NO


 Yes the Primero takes after the early Rolex Daytona quite a bit.



BondandBigM said:


> Smoke, mirrors and


 testing:

https://elliotbrownwatches.com/blogs/technical/testing-testing-and-more-testing

welding one to the front of a clipper and sending it round the world is quite funny, because oftentimes watch manufacturers warn you that a static pressure test doesn't mean it will stand a dynamic immersion environment


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Jet Jetski said:


> testing:
> 
> https://elliotbrownwatches.com/blogs/technical/testing-testing-and-more-testing
> 
> welding one to the front of a clipper and sending it round the world is quite funny, because oftentimes watch manufacturers warn you that a static pressure test doesn't mean it will stand a dynamic immersion environment


 https://www.rolexmagazine.com/2017/03/the-return-of-single-red-sea-dweller_23.html

As they say nothing like real world testing, the other five parts are worth a read as well.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

This one had 10 years of real life testing,










Rotary couldn't afford Jacques Cousteau, so I got the job. 10 year olds, fighting, falling out of trees, crashing bikes, falling in rivers and lochs, paper rounds in all weather. Welded to a boat ? Pah!. :tongue:

Did I tell you about the "Timex lost in a dung midden" test. ? :laughing2dw:

One thing I find interesting is that I have friends and relations that have all been in active service, and every one of them has used their own Casio, either G Shock or Protrek. Because, in their words, "the issued stuff was [email protected]".


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

BondandBigM said:


> https://www.rolexmagazine.com/2017/03/the-return-of-single-red-sea-dweller_23.html
> 
> As they say nothing like real world testing, the other five parts are worth a read as well.





BondandBigM said:


> https://www.rolexmagazine.com/2017/03/the-return-of-single-red-sea-dweller_23.html
> 
> As they say nothing like real world testing, the other five parts are worth a read as well.


 Absolutely, I think that's great for people who need that, and don't mind putting a £10k watch to work. Unfortunately I have to think twice about being reckless with a watch well before the £500.00 mark!


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> the issued stuff was [email protected]


 I think that's why EB were asked to make this, because their civvy watches were being used in preference to the issued [email protected]

The owners used to work for Animal - that company started up to make watches for surfers (I am guessing surfers' watches take a good bit of knocking) so there's quite a continuing theme of making things to take knocks.

G-shocks are OK, although mine has bleed in a couple of the LCD screens and I've not got on with the skeleton hands, and Pro-trek keep going, but mine has certainly gone the 'bend don't break' route:

[IMG alt="No photo description available." data-ratio="103.33"]https://scontent.flhr4-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/58033160_131588164579096_4729574684494921728_o.jpg?_nc_cat=105&_nc_ohc=SgloJnQgHrkAQkJRvXzfVSrYK5UGrl4rijrNig3_vYDQj_idORFCrYgsw&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-2.fna&oh=408beb0432788bf68a7300d0658e84ec&oe=5E6A4229[/IMG]

The Holton doesn't feel like it will bend! But I wear them both and the analogue gives me the at-a-glance legibility - I think you said you seldom wore a watch on the hill, I always do - need to know the time to my next mars bar stop!


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

WRENCH said:


> This one had 10 years of real life testing,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Apparently recently the issued stuff has been Japanese and from what I can gather these hardly anybody gets them.

This freedom of information request is a bit out of date but nevertheless.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wristwatches_issued_to_the_briti

Another interesting article

https://anordain.com/blogs/news/100-years-of-british-military-watches-part-3


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Jet Jetski said:


> G-shocks are OK,


 and cheap enough to be disposable, although one of my pals is very sentimentally attached to his old Protrek.



Jet Jetski said:


> I always do - need to know the time to my next mars bar stop!


 I have a pretty accurate internal clock for that. :laughing2dw: . :thumbsup:



BondandBigM said:


> Apparently recently the issued stuff has been Japanese and from what I can gather these hardly anybody gets them.


 Interesting, I often go into a cafe that is a stopping off point on a major route, and often frequented by military personnel en route. Last time it was "territorials", and the two in charge had CWC "Fatboys". Usually it's RAF regiment, and G Shocks.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WRENCH said:


> very sentimentally attached to his old Protrek


 me too - I have to say mine isn't especially disposable (titanium), but the tide-graph is set to Newhaven where my dad was born

it is the second 'triple sensor' I have owned, gave the first one to a nephew


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Jet Jetski said:


> Yes the Primero takes after the early Rolex Daytona quite a bit.


 For a long time , Rolex Daytona models actually used Zenith movements.....


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> For a long time , Rolex Daytona models actually used Zenith movements.....


 yes, that was my little joke!

:rofl:

:tumbleweed:


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Some interesting points raised re-the issue or no issue of military divers' certainly in my quest to find an original turtle from the 70's it brought me across this subject particularly with reference to (though not confined to the seiko 6105 diver (Apocalypse Now) etc. These recreational divers with their bi-directional bezels and 150m w/r are tough old dogs and dogs of war, but only because they were bought by GI's with their own pay from outlets on army bases during conflicts. Im not aware any army as ever issued them (stand to be corrected sic). Sometimes and recently ive seen advertisements even on here claiming a watch to be military issued and its vague. Some subs were...take the Comex? Why? I'm unsure but it opens up an whole new ball game for debate. A lot of the comments above when broken down still boil down to the fact 'i would buy a rolex if i didn't feel uneasy about using it for its purpose as a tool watch given the cost'....focused on the sub...it seems to focus on the Sub always...maybe the thread should have asked more narrowly 'would you buy a sub'...for 8 grand and use it as intended?...During my time on here I only know one person who has...step forward @BondandBigM...you were true to your word back in the old days on the rolex forum. Well Done. Its been entertaining.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?p=204809

enjoy the trip down memory lane mate you kept your word...

"Thanks All,

Most of you won't like to hear this but the LV will be more of an everyday watch for me."


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## yokel (Jul 30, 2017)

*

*


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Nigelp said:


> Some subs were...take the Comex


 ?

The Rolex COMEX Sea-Dweller Models

Compagnie Maritime d'Expertises, COMEX, is the French commercial diving company that commissioned Rolex to create dive watches. COMEX needed watches that could plunge down to extreme depths, handle pressurized chambers, and survive ensuing decompression periods.


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Nigelp said:


> @BondandBigM
> 
> enjoy the trip down memory lane mate you kept your word...


 I'm surprised I'm still here

:laughing2dw: :laughing2dw:

And I've still got the phone that took the pics !!!



And the pic



I remember at the time these Nokias were hugely expensive, I seem to remember about five hundred odd quid and I never did buy the day date, I bought the then new GMTC.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Nigelp said:


> i would buy a rolex if i didn't feel uneasy about using it for its purpose as a tool watch given the cost


 that is my personal take on the Rolex that I could own regardless of the name on the dial, because of Sean Connery I think basically lol - but no, the thread is really about owning any old Rolex (some 'Rebberg' movements are jolly good, but then what about a Gruen ...) so you don't have to justify not owning one, even though you are supposed to like watches and (if you have a sizeable collection, or drive a car more expensive than your needs, or have followed the advice to keep a good credit score, or are flush, or single, kids grown up etc etc.) could have prioritised your spending in such a way as to own one - after all, the price of smoking 20 cigarettes a day would get you a 'cheap' Rolex in about a year, and quite a nice one after two years.

I have looked at the Datejust, the hand length is great, and I was thinking you could take the minute hand off and broach it so you could slide it back on over the hour hand, and bond them, to make a one handed watch, like this - see how the hand I used would work even better on the smaller dial with batons only (I had to trade off here between a long hand to the markers or one short enough to point to the numerals, but with a one handed watch knowing the time to the second is not the point, so I left it short).

Jet Jetski One-handed Watch mod:

[IMG alt="No photo description available." data-ratio="111.50"]https://scontent.flhr4-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/74178670_160612031676709_8972764951445766144_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&_nc_ohc=X9oGMAD625cAQnG8FvXbZB6iPgXKpWQcaPiDkMS3Eo-7EEDy92IbYnZnw&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-2.fna&oh=86d17142703d2f240da7c9f36a71a996&oe=5E95CC10[/IMG]


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## Nigelp (Jan 28, 2015)

Jet Jetski said:


> that is my personal take on the Rolex that I could own regardless of the name on the dial, because of Sean Connery I think basically lol - but no, the thread is really about owning any old Rolex (some 'Rebberg' movements are jolly good, but then what about a Gruen ...) so you don't have to justify not owning one, even though you are supposed to like watches and (if you have a sizeable collection, or drive a car more expensive than your needs, or have followed the advice to keep a good credit score, or are flush, or single, kids grown up etc etc.) could have prioritised your spending in such a way as to own one - after all, the price of smoking 20 cigarettes a day would get you a 'cheap' Rolex in about a year, and quite a nice one after two years.
> 
> I have looked at the Datejust, the hand length is great, and I was thinking you could take the minute hand off and broach it so you could slide it back on over the hour hand, and bond them, to make a one handed watch, like this - see how the hand I used would work even better on the smaller dial with batons only (I had to trade off here between a long hand to the markers or one short enough to point to the numerals, but with a one handed watch knowing the time to the second is not the point, so I left it short).
> 
> Jet Jetski One-handed Watch mod:


 Some people ended up in jackets with straps around the back for their arms. And rooms with nice soft padded walls. No door.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Nigelp said:


> Some people ended up in jackets with straps around the back for their arms. And rooms with nice soft padded walls. No door.


 One handed watches are ample for most tasks, and this one has a cunning sub-dial arrangement should you need to time something more accurately - an impromptu soufflé perhaps, an opportune omelette. If you have old eyes, much simpler in the night than figuring out which hand is which - simple enough to know if it's 3 yet, or nearly 6. Anybody who looks at watches all the time can immediately tell you where the minute hand ought to be by the position of the hour hand. Not saying you would run trains by it, if you reported to Stalin, but the slow hand is a more relaxed take on timekeeping.


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## wrenny1969 (Jun 24, 2008)

odyseus10 said:


> Bugger, I'd decided to buy a new AMG C43 next year? That said I'd never touch a VAG car again, after the fiasco/cover up of the Siemens fuel injectors (I fell foul of that design flaw on my Golf GT 170)


 Anything with a VAG and Siemen(s) means your likely to have been or will get f*cked :biggrin:


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## Stan (Aug 7, 2003)

Dustincrodn said:


> Yes who hasn't :laugh: check more about fitbit and smartwatches here an ThinkSmartwatch.com.


 D1ck.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)




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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

BondandBigM said:


> did the MOD actually buy any of them ?


 The FOI request as to how many and by whom came back as: the MOD looked for that information, and found it, but will not release it as it is covered under the blanket exemption for security issues that does not need to be weighed against the public interest.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/620349/response/1485188/attach/3/20191213 FOI2019 12925.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1

But a chap who knows his specification & procurement onions wrote here that it is a legitimately specified, procured, and issued piece of NATO kit according to his research:

https://www.mwrforum.net/forums/showthread.php?84652-Elliot-Brown-military-watch/page3&s=7940d26549c688d37030308d025a92e7

But the best point I think was made by this chap on the same thread:

"I have both a CWC SBS diver and a Holton. Both are amazing military watches in service at the SBS and purchased by them. The Holton is incredibly tough. They feel different and I wear both of them a LOT. In the real tough situation it would be the HOLTON on my wrist. Its already been on deployment in the arctic. Don't talk in theory ... use them both !!"

I bought it because I wanted another tough beater for my excursions - I have a 'G-shock', that goes on my right wrist - and it needs to be properly waterproof, because I'm not pulling my sleeve back to check the time when I'm on the hill in weather. EB test all these watches under water and then chill them to check for condensation.

[IMG alt="Image may contain: outdoor" data-ratio="133.33"]https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/p720x720/67341414_145457123192200_7815299375734718464_o.jpg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_sid=1480c5&_nc_ohc=_1L_OdEE_qEAX9C4KSW&_nc_ht=scontent-lhr8-1.xx&_nc_tp=6&oh=dd5b33bb7a8e1c03c5470228bcb8e16e&oe=5EBB9804[/IMG]

EB specialise in watches for wet and tough environments. We know G-shocks are tough, but I read a part of the spec for this watch was resistance to vibration - EB already had expertise in tough watches so a natural progression for them. I believe the height of their damping system is one reason there is no automatic version, nor will there be, because they cannot keep it under the thickness limits for the spec. with a mechanical auto.

But how much vibration does a military watch need to be able to withstand? Erm ...

[IMG alt="No photo description available." data-ratio="133.33"]https://scontent.flhr4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/45672293_945401665649363_8946622675220955136_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_sid=110474&_nc_ohc=Q3K6jRlgAroAX-3ti09&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr4-1.fna&oh=48d4d2913559a04131cf797657315294&oe=5EB8BEB9[/IMG]

HAGD!


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## Grand Old Duke (Mar 2, 2020)

ZenArcade said:


> I often wonder why people who dislike a brand so much talk about it so frequently.


 Manchester United fans have a saying which echoes this: "hated, adored, never ignored".


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## BondandBigM (Apr 4, 2007)

Jet Jetski said:


> HAGD!


 Thanks

Hopefully it will be, plenty of anicdotes and conspiracies on the tinternet to read up on, should keep me busy until beer o'clock

:biggrin:


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

Grand Old Duke said:


> Manchester United fans have a saying which echoes this: "hated, adored, never ignored".


 I didn't start this thread because I hate Rolex, but because I am impressed by the fact that no matter what watch you may discuss in general company, no matter that it laid three ounce golden eggs every quarter hour, someone will ask 'but have you got a Rolex' and I would like to get one so I can say 'Yes" instead of trying to explain that I buy watches that I like, and not what other people like, which would then mean I could afford fewer watches that I like. I am not against expensive watches, or expensive badges, and I might one day be persuaded to buy a Speedmaster, which is equally hyped, but chimes with me.

Meanwhile I am wearing the pre-cursor to the famed Wilsdorf perpetual as my beater, since it has no stem and therefore no penetrations to the case which could let in grit or compost, while I plant out my onions. I'm taking a chance - please no more frost.


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## JonnyOldBoy (Mar 28, 2017)

Grand Old Duke said:


> Manchester United fans


 Seem to mostly live in Guildford, Milton Keynes and Swindon..... LOL.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

JonnyOldBoy said:


> Seem to mostly live in Guildford, Milton Keynes and Swindon..... LOL.


 China, West Africa ...

I am a Blue, proud to have listened to the 1999 play-off final against Guildford, having pulled my car over to listen to the end, for fear of having a prang.

And listening to the 2001 Arsenal game on the radio, sat in my car in Moss Side, within earshot of the crowd singing 'Boring boring Asenal', as we went down 4-0 at home and effectively got relegated.

'Amid the carnage, the home support stood by their favourites until the end. "Even if that was gallows humour it was terrific," added Royle. "I've never heard anything like that before."'

or since


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## krissy1301 (Feb 4, 2020)

I looked at Rolex' when picking my latest watch and even tried a few on, there just wasn't any I particularly liked and realised I was being drawn to them because they were "Rolex". I changed my mind and went for the watch I liked best.

Also, if you're interested, I know of a man potentially selling a 1997 submariner at some point in the future (possibly) but just wants some information for now. Let me know and I'll pass on your details...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

krissy1301 said:


> I looked at Rolex' when picking my latest watch and even tried a few on, there just wasn't any I particularly liked and realised I was being drawn to them because they were "Rolex". I changed my mind and went for the watch I liked best.
> 
> Also, if you're interested, I know of a man potentially selling a 1997 submariner at some point in the future (possibly) but just wants some information for now. Let me know and I'll pass on your details...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 This is an observation/opinion. I had an Explorer when they were a tool watch that were slightly more expensive than the norm. I loved that watch not because of the name, (which at the time didn't mean much) but because I liked it. Then, for whatever reasons, Rolex became the ultimate component of conspicuous consumerist consumption, and this is where the split atarted. I still have an Explorer, not my original, but I still like it, and definitely not because of the name. I don't wear it as often as I possibly should, but when I do, it goes completely unnoticed, which is the way I like it. So as you correctly say buy what you like best, forget about the hype, and enjoy owning whatever suits you best. :thumbsup:


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## WickerBill (Apr 14, 2020)

Well from a relative newbies perspective....both yes and no.

Yes, because I like watches like the Air King and no date Submariner, I appreciate those watches.

Heres my problem though, when I buy a watch I have to 'buy into' the brand, it's history, customer service and ethos as much as the Watch itself. When I compare it to companies on a similar level like Omega, JLC I appreciate the history of those companies, their tech, movements, achievements more than Rolex. I also appreciate the customer service of JLC/ Omega more than Rolex given the withholding of warrenty cards, used parts after refurb and the whole waiting list rubbish/ pre owned prices of Rolex.

I suppose for me the problem is I don't see watches as investments....I buy what I like. If I have 3k to spend, id get an Omega....if I had 6k to spend, it wouldn't be on a Rolex when you can get a JLC for the same money.

Dont get me wrong, if I could get a Rolex Sub, Air King without any of the Rolex 'baggage' I would, but currently I'm not prepared to play the Rolex game, knowing that every time I looked down at my wrist I'd remember how much of a pain in the butt the whole process was.


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

WickerBill said:


> it's history


 I am not a Rolex chap, my ex offered to buy me one when I was 30, but I held out for my Tag 6000, still going strong 25 years later, unlike my marriage ha ha ha. And I enjoy wearing the hammer precursor to their rotor auto, however, Wilsdorf was a shrewd cookie, he knew his watches, and he took and improved patents and made them his own to develop the first properly integrated modern watch (imho), with his perpetual oyster:- no excess wear on the screw-in crown by dint of eliminating hand-winding, and a case-back you could really torque up. I am not crediting him with innovation, let's give that Harwood and Borgel; or even a developer - I'm giving that to Vogt; but synthesis was his forte.

However, the cult of Rolex is an entirely different thing, even though they have contributed hugely to popularising what we now consider normal, and I heard someone once say that every great idea is a marmite idea, so maybe they are great, even though we wouldn't spread one on our toast? Cyclops - divisive. Date window - divisive. Blink-and-you-miss-it date change - divisive. But only one side of the argument is considered churlish, no matter how blatantly partisan are the proclaimers and no matter how reasonable is the declamation.

For me, it's just not my vibe. Would I have a Paul Newman Daytona? Yes, of course, it's right up there with my Tag in terms of helping you drive faster and thrust further, but not because it's a Rolex, and if I tell you The Great Escape was one of my favourite films ever perhaps that's why I went Tag! And I would love a Speedy, not because it's an Omega, not the badge, because it's the NASA flight-tested space watch! I need a 15K pre-moon one, to put next to my $50.00 30mm screw-case Pobeda as worn by Chernushka the space dog. Watches are so romantic!

And watches can be fun. The mention of Rolex kind of takes the fun and romance out of it IMHO - the first hint of mickey taking seems to end up in flames and insults.

[IMG alt="Jurassic Park GIF - Find & Share on GIPHY" data-ratio="112.50"]https://media.giphy.com/media/9S4cyvaUXPLlm/200w.gif[/IMG]

I guess we live in a world plagued by insecurity, and perhaps that is why Rolex must be on a par, at the very least, with other mega brands like McDonalds - the sense, and safety, that you know what you are going to get. It's the watch equivalent of gold, I suppose.


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## tick-tock-tittle-tattle (Aug 4, 2018)

Yes, and I have never regretted going the extra step and buying one...but I wanted an under the radar Rolex.

I bought my Rolex for me, I didn't buy it for a reaction from others. I have never had one person in all the time I have owned it compliment or even notice what it is, that's why I love it.

The perfect Rolex...for me, no bling, no fuss, all watch, and no compliments...










all that said, I still class myself as a Seiko fanboy, what's not to love about Seiko old or new?


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## Jet Jetski (Feb 10, 2019)

tick-tock-tittle-tattle said:


> an under the radar Rolex


 I know, I have often looked at the Rolex trench watches with an unsigned dial - by the time they launched the bubble back oysters they were all signed, and that is the only one that interests me really. Oh, and a PN Daytona, but that's not for the watch, that's for the girls that come with it!


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## tick-tock-tittle-tattle (Aug 4, 2018)

Jet Jetski said:


> Rolex trench watches with an unsigned dial


 Totally right, if you ever find a WW1 'trench' watch with Rolex neatly inked upon the dial, then you need to look carefully 'under the bonnet'

I see so many on Ebay where the movement isn't pictured, but the dial has Rolex crisply inked on the dial, an obvious fake or a Frankenwatch.

I love the Rolex watches I own, but you'll find a Seiko on my wrist more often than any other brand, they offer every type of movement you can think of, they have a great history, and offer great value.

If I was forced to sell every watch I owned, but was allowed to keep one watch, I am positive it would be a Seiko that would be the last watch standing.


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## WickerBill (Apr 14, 2020)

tick-tock-tittle-tattle said:


> Yes, and I have never regretted going the extra step and buying one...but I wanted an under the radar Rolex.
> 
> I bought my Rolex for me, I didn't buy it for a reaction from others. I have never had one person in all the time I have owned it compliment or even notice what it is, that's why I love it.
> 
> ...


 See that's a pretty rolex...not too vanilla, something different and not one one which has a massive following. I always ask myself when buying a watch if I'd still buy the piece without the brand name...it's usually a good sign on whether I like the watch or not. I'd happily do that with the Air King....if I a) had the money b) could easily get hold of one!


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## WickerBill (Apr 14, 2020)

Jet Jetski said:


> Wilsdorf was a shrewd cookie, he knew his watches, and he took and improved patents.....synthesis was his forte.
> 
> However, the cult of Rolex is an entirely different thing.
> 
> ...


 Sorry to paraphrase a bit (didn't want to clog up the whole page!

Yeh kind of my thoughts. Rolex 'as a brand' is incredible. What Wilsdorf did was pretty amazing, with that said, it was more a key decision during the Quartz crisis that really made Rolex and put more established brands like Omega/ Longines on the back foot and elevated Rolex to the popularity it has today.

I agree about the cult thing...that's not to say everyone that has a Rolex is part of 'the cult' ....most just love their watches in my experience...I have to admit I dislike the whole shove it in a box and let it become an investment rubbish. But hey, everyone's entitled to do what they want with their money...

in terms of vibe, I like some of their models...but yeh I'm with you. If I took off the Rolex name, would I buy one? Maybe one or 2 in their range....but not many.

Agree about the Speedy....watches and their history tell a story, I've got to 'feel' the watch and it's history to really enjoy it. They aren't just an inanimate object to me.

Agree about the fun being taken out of it, although it's not the watches fault. I suppose ultimately that's the joy about watches, there's something out there for everyone...while I personally don't get the whole Rolex 'thing'...it's not like I'd wait in a queue To pay a £5000 premium for second hand pickup that some redneck had shoved a few dead sheep in the back of, I appreciate the watches.....and actually I wonder where watches would be today if Rolex didn't take a stand during the quartz crisis rather than being another sheep. We should probably thank brands like Rolex for the fact we can still get cogs in watches today.


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## tick-tock-tittle-tattle (Aug 4, 2018)

WickerBill said:


> I always ask myself when buying a watch if I'd still buy the piece without the brand name


 Wise words indeed, I'd never thought of it like that, but it is a great way to look at it.

A name means little to me, I have tried on most of the Tudor range, and the more popular Omega's, but they didn't give me the 'fizz' I know that I should like these brands, but my wrist keeps telling me that it doesn't like them.

Watch buying/collecting is such a personal thing, I'm glad we all like different things as this watch forum would be rather boring if on WRUW days we had a long list of Rolex Submariner pictures.


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

tick-tock-tittle-tattle said:


> Wise words indeed, I'd never thought of it like that, but it is a great way to look at it.
> 
> A name means little to me, I have tried on most of the Tudor range, and the more popular Omega's, but they didn't give me the 'fizz' I know that I should like these brands, but my wrist keeps telling me that it doesn't like them.
> 
> Watch buying/collecting is such a personal thing, I'm glad we all like different things as this watch forum would be rather boring if on WRUW days we had a long list of Rolex Submariner pictures.


 Agree 100%. Four times I have gone to buy a Speedmaster, but didn't, same with a 50 Fathoms. Can't put my finger on it, but something said NO ! Anyway, I like my Vostoks as much as the rest. Each to their own. :thumbsup:


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## WickerBill (Apr 14, 2020)

Tbh I went to see various speed masters and just didn't click...then the racing version came along and OMG just clicked....ok it's only 2mm smaller than the normal one and has a bit of colour but made such a difference. Same between my Longines Conquest and Hydroconquest....I thought the conquest was good but tried the hydro on a rubber strap and it's light years better.

i agree though, I'm certainly not bashing Rolex, it's nice that everyone likes something different...world would be boring otherwise!


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## John_D (Jul 21, 2018)

Under the present circumstances...definitely... :thumbsup:


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

John_D said:


> Under the present circumstances...definitely... :thumbsup:


 Is there a waiting list ?


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Turpinr said:


> Is there a waiting list ?


 They're trying to flush out panic buyers.


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## Turpinr (Dec 18, 2017)

WRENCH said:


> They're trying to flush out panic buyers.


 :laugh: Thanks Tony Blackburn


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## WRENCH (Jun 20, 2016)

Turpinr said:


> :laugh: Thanks Tony Blackburn


 Well they are for the public convenience.


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## tick-tock-tittle-tattle (Aug 4, 2018)

Turpinr said:


> Is there a waiting list ?


 Probably, toilet paper is still in short supply, I am on a waitlist for a Daytona and I was told around a seven year wait.

That's a long time to wait to have a Rollex poo. :biggrin:


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## WickerBill (Apr 14, 2020)

Turpinr said:


> Is there a waiting list ?


 Yes but you've got to form an orderly queue 2m apart outside the cubicle


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