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Time for change

6K views 43 replies 18 participants last post by  Slim2500 
#1 ·
Hi everyone,my name is Carlos Chamaoun and I'm the co-founder of ArloMouN (pronunciation ArloMooN).Just joined the forum to get some more Insight and opinion on our watch.The new watch is called Bold Classic and we would love to hear what you think.
18252176_287007528416212_849756851998084


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16583876_1665289853770776_45251316985846


Watch case: Stainless steel (grade 316L) Water resistant: 5 ATM, 50 meters (new)Glass: Sapphire coated crystal with anti-scratch surface finish (inside)Strap size: 20 mm, best fit for 14 - 23 cm wrists Watch size: 39 mm in diameterWatch thickness: 9.80 mmMovement: SOPROD A2 Swiss Made automaticStrap: full crocodile grain Italian leather, handcrafted. incl. butterfly buckle in case colour. Colours: brown mahogany and black nappaBuckle: Milanese stainless steel. Colours: gold or silverWarranty: 2 years limited warranty against manufacturing defects.
 
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#2 ·
First thought is that you should have the courtesy to contact the forum owner @Roy before trying to promote your watch here.

Second thought is that it would have helped to look around the forum first as there is a section specifically for you to promote your watch.

As for the watch...it is OK but similar to many others on the market so much would depend on price as i would need a good reason to buy this from a company I have not heard of rather than one from an established company where I would have more faith in any warranty.

If you send a watch to Roy then he is usually willing to pass it on to forum members to do a review - but it would be an honest review.
 
#14 ·
First thought is that you should have the courtesy to contact the forum owner @Roy before trying to promote your watch here.

Second thought is that it would have helped to look around the forum first as there is a section specifically for you to promote your watch.

As for the watch...it is OK but similar to many others on the market so much would depend on price as i would need a good reason to buy this from a company I have not heard of rather than one from an established company where I would have more faith in any warranty.

If you send a watch to Roy then he is usually willing to pass it on to forum members to do a review - but it would be an honest review.
To be honest my intentions we're only to get your honest opinion on my watch nothing else but I totally understand that it overlaps the idea that it's also a promotional tactic.

I totally understand your point of view, and I would have the same what the problem is a lot of people would rather go with a well-known brand then a unknown brand and at one hand it's understandable but on the other you're not really giving a chance to new watch brands. Price is of course the main reason for people to buy a watch.

I do care for honest reviews and honest opinions, that's why I do appreciate everything people are saying about the watch.

Appreciate the tips
 
#3 · (Edited by Moderator)
I've moved this thread to this section as I can see no where on your website that you can actually purchase this watch as for trying to get free advertising I'll leave it for others to comment.

"In 2016, We proudly launched our first elegant, distinct and unique timepiece. All of our timepieces are unique and different, but not like any other in the market, we are passionate about our timepieces, and we take the time to choose and design every single part."

I see nothing distinct or unique, sorry.
 
#5 ·
I like the dial colour/ finish too, I also like the shape of the case and lugs , weather its unique or distinct I am not knowledgeable enough to know , but I also do not like the crown position at 4 but that's just me :biggrin:

deano
 
#6 ·
It`s ok but nothing about it would make me consider buying one & to be honest the lugs put me off a bit.
 
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#8 ·
I'm sorry, but it leaves me completely cold. The date window looks very isolated, but at the same time is too prominent, for the black dial, it should have been colour coded - white numbers on black background.
 
#9 ·
I've just checked the website and that model is shown at €2050 euros!!! Really? I'm not knowledgable on movement types but there is nothing in that watch that would encourage me to part with that sort of cash for it. Am I missing something? Clear readable dial, but not keen on the angled date window and €2050 euros for a fairly bland watch without a bracelet wtf?
 
#18 ·
You for your opinion as well. The price is merely the retail price. only option for us to actually produce this watch will be through crowdfunding the price will then be €917. This is the price that we have almost no profit on. As you know well known watch companies have a big profits on watches and maybe someday when our brand is well known to our customers will be able to price at that stage.

The price would include a watch box, one certificate, two Italian leather straps, one milanese strap and free shipping. So at that price we are really maxing out.

At £250 maybe but at £2000 ish jog on kitty.

Think I'd be on preowned Aquca Terra allllll day long at that sort of price. :yes:
So you're saying it's not really a matter of what you can get for the price more than what you think it's worth, because of our reputation as we do not have. I totally understand that you are comparing it with a well-known brand like so many others.
 
#11 ·
Hi everyone,my name is Carlos Chamaoun and I'm the co-founder of ArloMouN (pronunciation ArloMooN).Just joined the forum to get some more Insight and opinion on our watch.The new watch is called Bold Classic and we would love to hear what you think.
One problem you might have is the fact that an established brand like Christopher Ward have got watches like this for £495 - £580:

c05-39ada3-s00w0-oc_3d_rangelaydown.png


I think if you put it to the vote on here, the vast majority of members would go for the CW - Sorry mate, but you did ask for our opinions :biggrin:
 
#19 ·
One problem you might have is the fact that an established brand like Christopher Ward have got watches like this for £495 - £580:

c05-39ada3-s00w0-oc_3d_rangelaydown.png

I think if you put it to the vote on here, the vast majority of members would go for the CW - Sorry mate, but you did ask for our opinions :biggrin:
Totally agree, but CW is doing this longer than we have and they can actually keep the cost low with manufactures, but if you are start up you need to actually pay the full price and sometimes additional costs because of the low amount your buying in.

What they said. Not special or different enough for the price tag and I know everyone has to start somewhere but it's a lot to pay for an unknown brand with no history. Sorry
Thanks for your honesty and your opinion maybe someday ;-)
 
#13 · (Edited by Moderator)
I've seen better SKAGEN watches, and I don't like them either :tumbleweed:

I don't have humble opinions - - if you bought it from Amazon or Argos you could always send it back :yes:
 
#21 ·
Not wishing to rain on your parade but I think you'll struggle to sell them at €917 euros. The design isn't anything that isn't already established out there and from research the movement you're proposing to use gets mixed reviews and retails £150-180 for a single unit. I appreciate you have manufacturing costs and costs for the package of straps, box etc but I think given the already available competition your pricing is off. People, myself included, will gravitate to established brands they feel they can trust, at a lower price, rather than take a risk on your product. Even at your reduced price of 917euros I'd be looking at vintage Omega, longines, oris etc. The market is highly competitive and for an unknown entity your pricing isn't. Sorry, but that's my honest feedback.
 
#23 ·
It seems the price you are asking for the watch is to cover the initial expenses as soon as you can. There are a lot of hidden expenses when starting a business and they can take years to recoup, it's not always just a matter of price it high and get the money back asap.

My latest business is three years old next month and I'm still not making huge profits because I'm still paying off the initial investment. I didn't take a wage for the first year, if I had of doubled my prices then yes I would, but nobody would have bought from me so I would have likely failed.

There are a huge amount of watches out there you're competing with, most more stunning than yours for far less so you either have to have an exceptional product or be good value.
 
#26 · (Edited by Moderator)
Well kudos for one point: at least you're trying to be honest about the cost of the watch and its retail price to customers. There's a WUS thread about a startup called Deviate that priced the watch at an absurdly low price for patrons, running into all kinds of stupid New Watchmaker issues, and it's now unclear if patrons will get a watch at all, let alone a working watch, let alone a working watch that matches what the startup proposed. I understand it costs at LEAST US$250-350 per unit to start a limited manufacture of custom designs.

In several posts, you seem to presuming that we are favoring "the well known big watch makers" over humble, upstart You. Boy are you full of s***. Members here are known for buying some really obscure brands, and your host owned a shop and produced limited runs of very personalized watches which are cherished by members. This is not a matter of "David versus Goliath" but companies with reputation, track record, credibility, and someone who is unknown and untested. You want some feedback? Send me one of your watches. I'll wear it for a month. I'll post pics. I'll tell you and other WIS about the experience. Do the same for 5-10 other members. THEN you'll get useful feedback.

You'd better put on your big boy pants and be willing to go above and beyond your comfort zone to earn WIS respect and consideration for your watch concern, ESPECIALLY when you price it well into the high end of established brands. You say you'll lose money at €917? Ouch. I'm wearing a US microbrands limited edition forum special project right now - cost to plank owners US$700, cost to me US$900 plus fee for extra regulation, cost to other sodbusters buying on the secondary market, $1800-2200. The maker got a wee bit of profit (if anything) from those watches, but has reaped worldwide attention and appreciation, including from the timepiece press. Someone's comment about finding more economical manufacturing, take that to heart. I don't encounter many WIS types who are willing to throw away €2000 or the equivalent on an untested watch from a new unknown maker.

Now, about your design. Meh. Looks like the Jazzmaster on the sales corner right now. I'm sure I've seen Tissots, Hamiltons, Orises, etc, with very similar look. I'm sure you're proud of your design. But it's derivative. It's conventional. I've seen it before. And Mach's right about those lugs, I'm not sure if I like their elegance, or I'm concerned about the huge space above the strap. I'd have to wear it.

Bravo for registering on the forum and soliciting some honest feedback. But I'd put that hubris that's leaking from between your words into a jar in the cupboard and leave it there until you're an established concern with employees, offices, steady orders and fulfillment. Until then, your claim that we either appreciate your watch's lovely design, or just can't see it, is ephemeral flatulence to my ears.

P.S. Apologies to anyone who just sprayed their port or Earl Grey over their computer's monitor.
 
#30 ·
Well kudos for one point: at least you're trying to be honest about the cost of the watch and its retail price to customers. There's a WUS thread about a startup called Deviate that priced the watch at an absurdly low price for patrons, running into all kinds of stupid New Watchmaker issues, and it's now unclear if patrons will get a watch at all, let alone a working watch, let alone a working watch that matches what the startup proposed. I understand it costs at LEAST US$250-350 per unit to start a limited manufacture of custom designs.

In several posts, you seem to presuming that we are favoring "the well known big watch makers" over humble, upstart You. Boy are you full of s***. Members here are known for buying some really obscure brands, and your host owned a shop and produced limited runs of very personalized watches which are cherished by members. This is not a matter of "David versus Goliath" but companies with reputation, track record, credibility, and someone who is unknown and untested. You want some feedback? Send me one of your watches. I'll wear it for a month. I'll post pics. I'll tell you and other WIS about the experience. Do the same for 5-10 other members. THEN you'll get useful feedback.

You'd better put on your big boy pants and be willing to go above and beyond your comfort zone to earn WIS respect and consideration for your watch concern, ESPECIALLY when you price it well into the high end of established brands. You say you'll lose money at €917? Ouch. I'm wearing a US microbrands limited edition forum special project right now - cost to plank owners US$700, cost to me US$900 plus fee for extra regulation, cost to other sodbusters buying on the secondary market, $1800-2200. The maker got a wee bit of profit (if anything) from those watches, but has reaped worldwide attention and appreciation, including from the timepiece press. Someone's comment about finding more economical manufacturing, take that to heart. I don't encounter many WIS types who are willing to throw away €2000 or the equivalent on an untested watch from a new unknown maker.

Now, about your design. Meh. Looks like the Jazzmaster on the sales corner right now. I'm sure I've seen Tissots, Hamiltons, Orises, etc, with very similar look. I'm sure you're proud of your design. But it's derivative. It's conventional. I've seen it before. And Mach's right about those lugs, I'm not sure if I like their elegance, or I'm concerned about the huge space above the strap. I'd have to wear it.

Bravo for registering on the forum and soliciting some honest feedback. But I'd put that hubris that's leaking from between your words into a jar in the cupboard and leave it there until you're an established concern with employees, offices, steady orders and fulfillment. Until then, your claim that we either appreciate your watch's lovely design, or just can't see it, is ephemeral flatulence to my ears.

P.S. Apologies to anyone who just sprayed their port or Earl Grey over their computer's monitor.
Well at least we got one point right :) What we meant to say was comparison is always been done with watch brands that have a customer base and have a higher budget. We're just starting out we're creating and trying to achieve the best way possible.

We would love honest reviews on our watches especially, by watchmakers. The problem is each sample cost us $1000 dollars to make and for us this is not a option. The reason why is because It's made from scratch (Literally a scratch). So costs are higher, Also because the cases are hand finished, but to get the best cost out of this we need to mass produce, but we can't mass-produce because we don't have the money for it and even if we wanted to make five or 10 this would be too much money (So if you have a big boy pants with deep pockets, we would love to have you as a investor). We did find watchmakers In the area of Amsterdam to actually review our watches but this will take time.

Well I do appreciate your honesty about our watch and trust that this watch is not your taste..at all. Everyone has his own perspective on what it is and what is not. We're just Have our opinion and we just listened to yours.
 
#31 ·
I understand what you are saying and it may cost $1000 or euros to produce one sample but that does not mean the watch is worth that to a purchaser. The sample price is not a true reflection of the final selling price, that would come from the mass produced cost and reputation, desirability, history, quality etc. Therefore you can't say the RRP is $2000 because it cost $1000 to make one.

The tooling, R&D, machine and design costs can't be applied to one watch, if that was the case with every other product then everything would be extremely overpriced, even a pencil!

You need to come back when you have the money to mass produce, send samples and apply a realistic price to your watch.
 
#32 ·
So… you're applying the entire R&D costs for samples to every watch you sell??? That's a hell of a profit margin.
 
#33 ·
Probably worth introducing at this stage, the story of Deaumars very successful kickstarter watch and why they then walked away from the business. I'm sure a few members here have this watch? I was close to buying it myself.

Also worth noting the cost attached to getting a plug in the popular on-line review sites!

http://www.watchthoughts.com/2016/12/29/i-come-to-bury-deaumar-not-to-praise-it/?utm_source=Deaumar+Watches+Newsletter&utm_campaign=d4c32d2955-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2016_12_30&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_bced4e9265-d4c32d2955-145388530&mc_cid=d4c32d2955&mc_eid=8ad0e4a63b
 
#34 ·
You should really look into changing your business model because I don't think you will succeed if your watch is priced as is.

Unless you plan on competing on cost, as many microbrands do, you should try and create more of a USP for your product. As others have mentioned, your design is rather conventional so it would be difficult for you to compete with other microbrands who offer watches at the fraction of the cost. Even with the higher end Soprod movement factored in, your watches are priced exceptionally high for a microbrand. Steinhart, for example, used to offer Soprod equipped watches at £600-800 (roughly $800 - 1000).

At $2000, you are at a pricepoint where you are competing with an endless list well known, big name brands, such as TAG, Longines, ORIS etc. Newer brands that have managed to penetrate that price point successfully have done so by offering functions and features, such as in house movements and complex complications or unique case materials, not available from dominant brands in the same cost bracket. These generally cost the brands millions of dollars in investment, so this may not be an option for your brand.

I highly recommend looking into the supply chains / business models of other micro brands who have been able to successfully undercut well establish brands whilst offering similar specifications to your product. Because you aren't going to be able to compete at all if your production costs is twice the retail price of competitors offerings.
 
#35 ·
:tumbleweed:
 
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#43 ·
Could someone design an emoticon for "fartin' in the wind" please to allow me to comment further?
 
#44 ·
To me it's just another watch nothing stands out that would make me part with over 2000 euros i know it is hard to get going from the start my friend is currently going through the same process although at the moment to keep costs down he has had to look at the far east to obtain cases and dials to his design
 
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