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Guest neil

Hello all

Talking of Boeing aircraft, do I have the record here of flying on all the main models of the "7" series except the latest 777 which I will no doubt travel on in the future.

I've flown in:

707

720

727

737

747

757

767

The oldest plane I've flown in was a Vickers Viscount turbo prop, now that is noisy. :o

The only thing I have against the 747 is that you get a large queue at customs when you disembark if the plane is full.

I usually solve this by running past the dawdling people to get to the front of the queue and first to the car rental desk where it can be even worse!

Cheers,

Neil.

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Guest neil

Griff

I'd go up in a 737 tomorrow.

I think if you look at any airliner type with heavy general usage you will find some flaw that has developed or been a problem in the past.

The 737 has been flying since the 60's on short haul routes and has probably for the service hours been one of the least troublesome aircraft.

Some time back there was a lot of trouble with DC-10's crashing, I don't know if that was ever sorted out.

The Concorde fleet was recently grounded and remember the Comets breaking up in mid air?

The thing is I've flown on all these planes for many years (Concorde excepted) and never had a hint of trouble.

I'm not a fatalist but you put your life in the pilots hands. If it were that dangerous do you think the crew would still be flying them?

Cheers,

Neil.

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Got to agree with you comments Neil, i dont think the pilots would be very happy to fly one that's got major problems, most fun i had was in a small two seater from a grass strip, that was a bumpey ride, plus a flight in a Micro light, terific fun that one. b.f.n. fred.

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The 737 seems to have a built in problem waiting to happen, with a flawed rudder valve design system, as highlighted in my post, and in a similar thread on Eddie's site. I'm well aware that these systems only have spasmodic events of failure, but the evidence of past events points to a potential and acknowledged problem, as outlined in the posts, and is enough to disturb my confidence in that aircraft until the valve problem is properly addressed with a new valve design, and replacement component, rather than relying on pilot techniques, now being included in new training, to avoid yet another possible rudder failure event of a fatal nature.

Part of that training involves rolling the aircraft upside down very suddenly, with the acknowledged fact that there would be no time to warn passengers first to buckle up their seat belts. This is an event I'd prefer not to be at risk of, and I will therefore avoid the 737's until the remedy I have suggested is put in place.

In other words.............I 'aint going to run across a busy road wearing a blindfold!

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Guest neil

Griff

The 737 has been flying since 1965!!

I think their safety record speaks for itself.

Being a short haul jet they are never up in the air as long as transatlantic models.

There are many acknowledged faults on all airliners and the crews are trained to deal with them, however very occasionally various faults occur at the same time mixed in with a bit of pilot error and its "Goodnight Vienna"

You may well find the 747 has a similar system being part of the Boeing family.

Good job you didn't research all this before your trip to India, you'd still be in the terminal! :lol:

Cheers,

Neil.

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I'm more confident about the Airbus, and 747.

I don't have the same confidence with the 737.

The new Next Generation 737's may have eliminated the problem of the valves, I'll find out, but until then, I wont be going in any 737's, and certainly not the older ones!

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Guest neil

Griff

I don't think you have a lot of choice.

I've been flying for decades now and while you may think you are booked on a certain type of aircraft these can be changed at the last minute if the one for your flight has a maintenance problem (this happens fairly regularly)

I have even been switched to another airline!

If you've ever been stuck in a terminal for a few hours with your original plane unserviceable for whatever reason you'll get on anything to get off!! :angry:

Cheers,

Neil.

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My agent uses Lufthansa a lot, and when I'm going Europe way, or further East, I very much doubt that will happen with that particular airline, which I highly rate. But when I do have an option, I will not jump on a 737, and certainly not an older one. Lufthansa seem to quickly sell off their older aircraft, and tend to have the latest in its fleet.

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Guest neil

Griff,

The original 737-100's from Boeing were all purchased by Lufthansa

The other airlines had the 200 variant.

I think you'll find that Lufthansa are are the biggest operators of the 737 in Europe.

Stay away from Lufthansa on your European jaunts or you'll never get off the ground! :o

Cheers,

Neil.

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When I book a flight, I will enquire which aircraft it is, as I did for India.

If they say it's a 737, and an older one, I wont book that flight. I will not fly in a 737 where I can possibly avoid it, and certainly not an older one!

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I love the 747-400. Flown a few times with it, once in business... I thought I would never fly economy or another plane again (Reality hits at the same time as the credit card bill). Maybe next time I may go for this, although it won't be for this year?

http://www.airbus.com/product/a380_flight_deck.asp. Should be plenty of room for a wheelchair too...

Pieter

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Lufthansa to Sell its Boeing 737-400s

As a part of its cost-cutting programme, the Lufthansa fleet is to be rationalized reducing the number of aircraft types. The six B.737-400s 141 seater (D-ABKA,B,C,D,F,K,L), ordered in 1991 and delivered during the following year, will be sold in the second half of 1997.

The Boeing 737-300 and 400 fleet will be retained; the B.737-230s Advanced have been sold to Indonesia and to the US leasing company Jet Ventures for a total of 30 aircraft which are to be replaced by Airbus A 319s.

At the beginning of 1965, Lufthansa was launch customer of the original B.737-100, with an order for 22 aircraft, comprising two (D-ABEL, D-ABEM) used for a short time by the charter subsidiary Condor.

In the picture: Lufthansa's Boeing 737-400 D-ABKC "Straubing" at Turin-Caselle airport in June 1996

(Aeromedia, October 1996)

lb53.gif

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Hi,

I'm more confident about the Airbus, and 747.

I belive there are some issues regarding the software in the Airbus, and the 747 had a rear bulkhead failure over Japan !!

They all have issues if you dig deep enough, but it is still very safe. I would not hesitate to fly on any well maintained airliner.

If you smoke the risk of premature death is much higher than death by flying.

All forms of transport have accidents, busses, trains, cars and ferry boats.

If you worry too much you could always stay at home. Now thats dangerous!

I rather fancy death by chocolate if I have to choose :blink:

Steve

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Not buying any of that. You're presenting no argument at all to ignore a serious and accepted design flaw concerning a certain valve affecting the rudder of older 737's in particular, and it's not acceptable to state feeble analogies of a patronising nature that aren't relevant to the issues raised.

You can decide what you like for youself, as can another member, but don't try telling me that I should accept your over simplified analysis, when you've made absolutely no attempt to make an argument on the specifics.

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I will happily board a 737 (and usually do at least once a month)

However you will not get me on a BA 146 !!

The 146 otherwise known as the flying gas chamber by those in the know is an accident waiting to happen.....

Its just a matter of time....

Regards.

-Eric

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Eric,

I know nothing of that aircraft, but respect your reservations about it, and your decision about not getting on one, which is what I'm trying to get understood regards my concerns about the rudder valve on certain 737's. I'm still not convinced about that, and I am only asking people to understand that is my view/opinion, and until all those valves have been corrected/replaced, there is no one going to convince me otherwise except by detailed and technical information/evidence. It's as simple as that. But I don't accept I should be happy boarding one just because someone else is happy to do so. I'm clearly not. I'd be glad if the problem I've described has been addressed other than by evasive pilot techniques, but that will remain my position till then.

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The 146 has a nasty habit (extensivley documented and routinely denied) of leaking Organo Phosphates into the cabin.

On at least one occasion both the Captain and Co-pilot were "knocked out" by the fumes...

I will try and find the relevant stories and post a link.

Eric

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